Ascended Winners and Losers

entrailbucket

@LavaManLee said:
The biggest issue, IMHO, is with a 550 MT/SC, none of that is relevant. A 10k protect tile? Shrug. Even the damage with saving 12 Yellow. By the time you have saved 12 Yellow, the battle is probably over. I don't know what the answer is. Not sure if there is an answer. But outside of a few boosted characters (and some lucky starting boards) there is almost no team that a non-boosted 550 MT/SC can't mop up.

Is that good? Is that bad? I don't know. That's for other minds to debate. But that definitely is a fact and one worth considering.

I haven't found a single team, including many sets of dual 672s with optimal supports (and I have quite a few of them) that doesn't lose on defense to m'Thor/Shang-Chi.

So I'm not sure if that's relevant to specific character evaluations -- again, there is no character in the game, at any level, that can stand up to those two (and they don't even have to be 550 -- I lose to lower level ones as well). I strongly suspect that all future characters will suffer the same fate as well.

Put another way, while it's true that 3->5 Luke Cage loses to m'Thor/Shang-Chi, so does literally everyone else, both present and future, so it's hard for me to hold that against him in particular. If I compare him to other characters, he still seems pretty strong.

entrailbucket

@Timemachinego said:

@entrailbucket said:
Hey, don't overlook the fact that you get a strength 4500 protect tile every single turn for free (if he's boosted it'll be almost 10k, too).

I have a feeling Luke Cage is going to start showing up on those lists of "best guys to ascend" now -- I want royalties!

Hey, maybe I can go back to running luke cage, iron fist and doc strange like I did when I didn't have anything better! Progress!

Unfortunately Luke Cage got all the numbers in the Heroes for Hire partnership. Iron Fist is not very good.

Lvl452, unboosted:

WhiteBomber

The best part is attack tiles are about 20% the value of a protect tile (maybe less), yet his attack tile comes out half the strength of Luke's protect. Someone on the inside doesn't like Ironfist.

Timemachinego

Yowch, you're really not joking there.

rainkingucd

@entrailbucket said:

@Timemachinego said:

@entrailbucket said:
Hey, don't overlook the fact that you get a strength 4500 protect tile every single turn for free (if he's boosted it'll be almost 10k, too).

I have a feeling Luke Cage is going to start showing up on those lists of "best guys to ascend" now -- I want royalties!

Hey, maybe I can go back to running luke cage, iron fist and doc strange like I did when I didn't have anything better! Progress!

Unfortunately Luke Cage got all the numbers in the Heroes for Hire partnership. Iron Fist is not very good.

Lvl452, unboosted:

Sadly that damage on Iron Fist of K'un-Lun is better than Echo's version (456 unboosted):

entrailbucket

Just in case anybody forgot about him (lvl606, boosted stats):

If you have lvl5 Tinkerer you only need 1 black AP.

Pantera236

@entrailbucket said:
Just in case anybody forgot about him (lvl606, boosted stats):

If you have lvl5 Tinkerer you only need 1 black AP.

This week I'm running 672 1a5 Juggs and a 468 pre boost Prowler with implanted bomb on Juggs and Tinkerer on Prowler. I take +2 all and + 2 red green and black. I'm starting the match with 10 black so fire Prowler for 60k in strikes, make one black match and bomb gives you 1 more black ap (not sure if always but seemed to be) so can fire black again for 60k more strikes. Oh and Tinkerer hits for like 5k + strikes every time you match a fortified enemy tile. It gets pretty crazy.

entrailbucket

@Pantera236 said:

@entrailbucket said:
Just in case anybody forgot about him (lvl606, boosted stats):

If you have lvl5 Tinkerer you only need 1 black AP.

This week I'm running 672 1a5 Juggs and a 468 pre boost Prowler with implanted bomb on Juggs and Tinkerer on Prowler. I take +2 all and + 2 red green and black. I'm starting the match with 10 black so fire Prowler for 60k in strikes, make one black match and bomb gives you 1 more black ap (not sure if always but seemed to be) so can fire black again for 60k more strikes. Oh and Tinkerer hits for like 5k + strikes every time you match a fortified enemy tile. It gets pretty crazy.

I'm using 4* Hawkeye (Ronin) with the arrow support, and the other character will have Pizza Dog. Getting free attack tiles and sometimes tripling Prowler's strikes is nuts.

ThaRoadWarrior

Iron fist gives ascended cage all that black he needs for jab jab though - that power really seemed to come alive

entrailbucket

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
Iron fist gives ascended cage all that black he needs for jab jab though - that power really seemed to come alive

I know they won't tell us the specifics, but I wish there was at least some rule of thumb we could use to see which characters or powers get good. It's just very inconsistent.

JoeHandle

Naturally, I have 3Fist much farther along then 3Cage
Always used him for spamming black anyway.

Reminder that 3Cage makes ONE protect tile, and replaces it if destroyed. Somewhere up there it was said he makes a tile every turn. If it's missing, sure he does. Only if it's not present at start of his tuen, tho.

captainheath

Has anyone gotten 3 star Black Widow to 5 star yet? If so, does the purple still cost 11 to make 6 green? What is the green damage? Thanks.

entrailbucket

@captainheath said:
Has anyone gotten 3 star Black Widow to 5 star yet? If so, does the purple still cost 11 to make 6 green? What is the green damage? Thanks.

I don't have her and haven't seen her yet.

bluewolf

I honesty can’t imagine it’s worth focusing on 3BW as we really haven’t seen a single case that I’m aware of where ap costs dropped for a 3-5.

She seems like a permanent reward engine at this point in the game. An antiquated design there’s no point in updating.

entrailbucket

@bluewolf said:
I honesty can’t imagine it’s worth focusing on 3BW as we really haven’t seen a single case that I’m aware of where ap costs dropped for a 3-5.

She seems like a permanent reward engine at this point in the game. An antiquated design there’s no point in updating.

I can't remember if anybody's AP costs drop.

The bigger problem with her is that I'm not sure how far you could realistically drop that power before it becomes a problem.

Yeah, I know Shang-Chi exists, but the GSBW power is actually quite a bit better in terms of infinite...ness. it's similar to the old 2* Magneto power (the original Winfinite) that they ended up having to nerf.

bluewolf

If you’re in a position to ascend 3BW to a 5, you’ve probably got numerous winfinite teams you could run already.

I don’t think they’d drop the cost but sure. You could use a cheaper power to just spam yourself to a win on offense.

rainkingucd

@entrailbucket said:

@bluewolf said:
I honesty can’t imagine it’s worth focusing on 3BW as we really haven’t seen a single case that I’m aware of where ap costs dropped for a 3-5.

She seems like a permanent reward engine at this point in the game. An antiquated design there’s no point in updating.

I can't remember if anybody's AP costs drop.

1* Yelena's Black and Hood Yellow drop in AP cost when ascended

entrailbucket

@bluewolf said:
If you’re in a position to ascend 3BW to a 5, you’ve probably got numerous winfinite teams you could run already.

I don’t think they’d drop the cost but sure. You could use a cheaper power to just spam yourself to a win on offense.

I'm not sure. Given enough time, everyone will ascend the 3s to 5s. Sure, it takes a lot of resources right now, but people used to say that about 550ing 5*, and now every single player gets a 550 m'Thor just for signing up (I think).

ThaRoadWarrior

My best is still 487 Profe$$or X….

ThaRoadWarrior

At 4* black widow’s power costs are still laughably high. Mine is at 282. What’s funny is that her green cost goes up every level you put on it - costs 15 at one cover up to 19 at 5 covers. Same with red, starts at 12 at one cover up to 17 at five, and purple just costs 11 all the time. I never noticed that before.