Please nerf 5* Gambit

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  • Darknes21
    Darknes21 Posts: 321 Mover and Shaker
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    Nerf Him Like OML!!!!
  • GrumpySmurf1002
    GrumpySmurf1002 Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Dayv said:

    And I'd be totally fine with this getting announced hand-in-hand with a far more needed and drastic redesign to Gambit at both the 3* and 5* tiers.
    Drastic?  Make his AP gen contingent on there being his colored charged tiles on board, and he's fixed.  Hardly a major overhaul.  

    Alternatively, have him generate all colors, 1 AP per that color charge on board.  

    There's nothing wrong with the powers themselves, it's how fast he can produce them.  

    I mean, better solution is to get a character that blocks his AP gen some other way so he has a direct counter, but sure, always nerf.   
  • thedarkphoenix
    thedarkphoenix Posts: 557 Critical Contributor
    edited November 2017
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    Dayv said:

    thedarkphoenix said:
    You'll also notice that 3 star gambit isn't really the topic of discussion like he was a few weeks ago...

    and that's because his damage isn't insane and his utility isn't near as good.
    I used a 3* Gambit team (along with 3* Storm) in a Daredevil Lightning Round today to take down a team with champed 5* Thanos and 5* Spidey (Peter Parker).  None of my 3* champs were maxed out, and my Daredevil wasn't even as big as the enemy's.  3* Gambit is *also* a problem, not because of his damage output (although his purple is no slouch) but because of the constant AP feeding to his actives and the feeding from his red to random AP for the rest of the team.
    I find this hard to believe as they literally could match you to death before you can do enough damage to nuke them down, but I'll take your word for it.

     I've taken down champed 5 teams with my punisher 3 team... doesn't mean punisher OP even though we all know its strictly because of his red that I was able too do it easily.


    3 gambit is not a problem, just stop it. he's a good battery at 3 and decent damage and that's about it, 3 strange and hawkeye are just as good.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,199 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I don't understand why the BP/Thanos combo seems to be getting so much attention here.  Maybe because I play in a less populated slice I don't see it as much, but even pre-Gambit I hardly ever ran into them.  I have both those guys but I don't really use them together in PvP since they're so slow, and I have never had a problem mowing them down in PvP, even at higher levels.

    I came up with my favorite fix so far for Gambit.  Keep him exactly as is, but add "Gambit takes 5,000 damage" to the passive ability.  The damage would increase or decrease per cover level, and be taken each turn he generated AP (which is each turn).  This lets him keep his advantage on offense (since I guess everyone needs him to beat the super-difficult BP/Thanos combo), but makes him much much easier to kill on defense.  It trades his speed for sustainability, which is something that the designers have indicated is ok before (Thanos, Sentry, Carnage).  Plus it makes him much more interesting to use!  Now you actually have to decide on his spec, and if you let the fight drag on too long he can die.  Also, if he does die to some combination of enemy damage and self-damage, you still have whatever unused AP he generated.

    And, of course, it results in selling more health packs, which everyone knows is the developers' secret desire and is at the root of every change they've ever made.
  • GrumpySmurf1002
    GrumpySmurf1002 Posts: 3,511 Chairperson of the Boards
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    entrailbucket said:
    I don't understand why the BP/Thanos combo seems to be getting so much attention here.  Maybe because I play in a less populated slice I don't see it as much, but even pre-Gambit I hardly ever ran into them. 
    This seems impossible.  They were literally the meta from the moment Panther hit tokens until Gambit's release.  And they're still the choice of anyone not running Gambit.

    I mean, I guess once you cross 500 maybe your meta is built with actual diversity of other 500 characters (or all grills), but at the 450-470 level it was all Panthos all the time after about 800, maybe lower.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,199 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I was feigning a bit of ignorance there, although it was indeed true that I didn't see those guys too much. 

    The combo is/was overused because it's really good at beating cupcake teams, but the downside is that it's not very good at beating not-cupcake teams.  If you're fighting a match against a cupcake team that includes a 3* loaner, you can kill that guy very quickly and get the combo going.  If you're fighting a maxed out 3* with 40-50k health + 2 champion 5*, the combo can work, but since they don't have any direct damage it's very slow to get it going.

    Since there aren't cupcakes where I play, and most of the teams I'm fighting are lvl266 3* + 2x lvl450+ 5*, I never really used or saw BP/Thanos very much.  If the development team could finally eliminate the cupcake exploit, that particular combo would be much less widely used, or at least much less effective.
  • PenniesForEveryone
    PenniesForEveryone Posts: 294 Mover and Shaker
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    GrumpySmurf1002 said:
    entrailbucket said:
    I don't understand why the BP/Thanos combo seems to be getting so much attention here.  Maybe because I play in a less populated slice I don't see it as much, but even pre-Gambit I hardly ever ran into them. 
    This seems impossible.  They were literally the meta from the moment Panther hit tokens until Gambit's release.  And they're still the choice of anyone not running Gambit.
    I think your memory is a little fuzzy here....  On release Thanos was believed to be broken due to how high his team damage was.  People didn't like using him because he was a health pack suck, and shortly after his release his team damage was reduced slightly (although that might have only been on the 3* version, my memory is a little fuzzy as well :-P)

    And Panther was rated as the worst 5* by far by a notable whale and consequently largely dismissed by the rest of the community at his launch as well.  You didn't have quite the same number of hoarders at the time, and so the Panthos meta was actually pretty slow to develop.

    I only mention it in comparison since for so long we have all agreed that Panthos is THE PvP meta, but the combo wasn't exactly perceived as being so dominant or OP at launch.  Compare now to Gambit who seems universally agreed to be at least the strongest 5* in the game if not game-breakingly OP.....at launch.  What do you think he will do to the meta 6 months from now if allowed to reign without a nerf until then???
  • therightwaye
    therightwaye Posts: 459 Mover and Shaker
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    Is this the current tread for balance or Nerf talk? 
  • Beer40
    Beer40 Posts: 826 Critical Contributor
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    PenniesForEveryone said:
    GrumpySmurf1002 said:
    entrailbucket said:
    I don't understand why the BP/Thanos combo seems to be getting so much attention here.  Maybe because I play in a less populated slice I don't see it as much, but even pre-Gambit I hardly ever ran into them. 
    This seems impossible.  They were literally the meta from the moment Panther hit tokens until Gambit's release.  And they're still the choice of anyone not running Gambit.
      What do you think he will do to the meta 6 months from now if allowed to reign without a nerf until then???
    I think you'l be able to sell every 2 of his covers for 1 *special* cover, provided youve also spent ISO to level him
  • Piro_plock
    Piro_plock Posts: 287 Mover and Shaker
    edited November 2017
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    therightwaye said:
    Is this the current tread for balance or Nerf talk? 
    If a character is as OP as Gambit, then the simplest way to balance them is nerf (and let's be honest, every change that tones him down will be called a nerf). Easier to implement than boosting all others in that tier.
  • therightwaye
    therightwaye Posts: 459 Mover and Shaker
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    Sorry is this the official Nerf and or balance thread? 
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
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    therightwaye said:
    Sorry is this the official Nerf and or balance thread? 
    It's the thread for scruffy looking nerf herders.  
  • therightwaye
    therightwaye Posts: 459 Mover and Shaker
    edited November 2017
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    broll said:
    therightwaye said:
    Sorry is this the official Nerf and or balance thread? 
    It's the thread for scruffy looking nerf herders.  

    Yeah, but that's all of us right? Anyhow, I had some thoughts but this is too much to follow. 
  • Jabrony_Geoff
    Jabrony_Geoff Posts: 378 Mover and Shaker
    edited December 2017
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    Under no circumstance should Gambit be nerfed. 
    I beat Gambit all the time in pvp.
    Dont do it MPQ, these people asked for him now they don't like him. DONT DO IT !! His pvp win points are always high.
     :D 
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
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    PenniesForEveryone said:
    When fighting a level 506 Medusa, 540 Thor, and 450 Gambit........I take out Gambit first.  That's pretty telling.
    I would target a hood that was 100 levels weaker than one of his allies first as well. Any character that is that low level wise will have less health and makes a good priority.
  • Piro_plock
    Piro_plock Posts: 287 Mover and Shaker
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    tiomono said:
    PenniesForEveryone said:
    When fighting a level 506 Medusa, 540 Thor, and 450 Gambit........I take out Gambit first.  That's pretty telling.
    I would target a hood that was 100 levels weaker than one of his allies first as well. Any character that is that low level wise will have less health and makes a good priority.
    Unless you're running Thanos that shouldn't always be the case. In my opinion better to take out the biggest threat first - it might be an AP stealer, a battery, someone with a dangerous/irritating passive or big nuke/AOE. Gotta save them healthpacks if possible.
  • tiomono
    tiomono Posts: 1,654 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Piro_plock said:
    tiomono said:
    PenniesForEveryone said:
    When fighting a level 506 Medusa, 540 Thor, and 450 Gambit........I take out Gambit first.  That's pretty telling.
    I would target a hood that was 100 levels weaker than one of his allies first as well. Any character that is that low level wise will have less health and makes a good priority.
    Unless you're running Thanos that shouldn't always be the case. In my opinion better to take out the biggest threat first - it might be an AP stealer, a battery, someone with a dangerous/irritating passive or big nuke/AOE. Gotta save them healthpacks if possible.
    So wanting to target gambit first proves he needs a nerf? Then there is a large portion of the character pool that also need nerfed.
  • PenniesForEveryone
    PenniesForEveryone Posts: 294 Mover and Shaker
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    tiomono said:
    PenniesForEveryone said:
    When fighting a level 506 Medusa, 540 Thor, and 450 Gambit........I take out Gambit first.  That's pretty telling.
    I would target a hood that was 100 levels weaker than one of his allies first as well. Any character that is that low level wise will have less health and makes a good priority.
    I'm not killing him first because he is the easiest target, I'm killing him first because he is the largest threat.

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