I dunno, I think it's kind of neat that the 99.99% of players are finally pushing back against the .01% at the top of the game, who make the most noise and complain the most.
Those folks always cry and whine and ultimately get their way, claiming they're doing it for the "good of the game" -- except the truth and justice they're crusading for mysteriously only benefits the top .01%.
I felt their stated policy was fair, reasonable and not bad in the least bit. I guess we can disagree on this point. Yet, I am paying customer they did not listen to me. Looks like your reasonableness out weigh my reasonableness.
The 99.99% benefit from the .01% paying the bills.
@Codex said: I felt their stated policy was fair, reasonable and not bad in the least bit. I guess we can disagree on this point. Yet, I am paying customer they did not listen to me. Looks like your reasonableness out weigh my reasonableness.
They did adjust from 12 covers to the actual amount people would have received. I’m sure that was to account for the fact that folks taking your stance found that part unfair. Justly so btw.
@jp1 said: The 99.99% benefit from the .01% paying the bills.
Completely untrue. As a group they significantly outspend us.
Back when it cost $10,000 to be competitive? Sure, maybe. Now most of the top players coast on past spending, and tons of them are completely free to play now. The 99.99% don't buy starks at a time, but collectively they spend a ton.
@entrailbucket said: @jp1 said: The 99.99% benefit from the .01% paying the bills. Completely untrue. As a group they significantly outspend us. Back when it cost $10,000 to be competitive? Sure, maybe. Now most of the top players coast on past spending, and tons of them are completely free to play now. The 99.99% don't buy starks at a time, but collectively they spend a ton.
@entrailbucket said:
I’ll give you that I don’t know that to be true. I’m guessing neither of us has the data. Lots of us at top end play still spend plenty though. Also, without those stark days and $10,000 times you speak of it’s possible the game wouldn’t have made it ten years.
Either way, veteran resources have been devalued and somehow there is still contempt for them getting the things that still matter to their game. You have to admit it’s a bit weird. Recently $100 could put you squarely in 5* land as a relatively new player. No years of grinding, or thousands of dollars necessary. I don’t see too many vets hating on the 99 percent about that.
@jp1 said: @entrailbucket said: @jp1 said: The 99.99% benefit from the .01% paying the bills. Completely untrue. As a group they significantly outspend us. Back when it cost $10,000 to be competitive? Sure, maybe. Now most of the top players coast on past spending, and tons of them are completely free to play now. The 99.99% don't buy starks at a time, but collectively they spend a ton. I’ll give you that I don’t know that to be true. I’m guessing neither of us has the data. Lots of us at top end play still spend plenty though. Also, without those stark days and $10,000 times you speak of it’s possible the game wouldn’t have made it ten years. Either way, veteran resources have been devalued and somehow there is still contempt for them getting the things that still matter to their game. You have to admit it’s a bit weird. Recently $100 could put you squarely in 5* land as a relatively new player. No years of grinding, or thousands of dollars necessary. I don’t see too many vets hating on the 99 percent about that.
@jp1 said:
I agree with you that our tenure and past spending should matter, and probably matter a bit more than it currently does. We shouldn't be losing to 450 Shang-Chi/Thor teams, but I think that's a problem with those characters more than a fundamental issue with the game.
Realistically, these guys are never going to catch up to us -- the only way they'll move up the hierarchy is if we go away. So they should want us to go away! It's only logical.
@jp1 said: @Codex said: I felt their stated policy was fair, reasonable and not bad in the least bit. I guess we can disagree on this point. Yet, I am paying customer they did not listen to me. Looks like your reasonableness out weigh my reasonableness. They did adjust from 12 covers to the actual amount people would have received. I’m sure that was to account for the fact that folks taking your stance found that part unfair. Justly so btw.
I am sorry, but how do justify getting 12 covers fair when normally it would range for 6-12?
I said something similar in the other thread, but if BCS had said something like, we can't at this time differentiate between levels of ascended characters therefore we are giving everyone 12 covers. Then ofcourse I would have ascended.
@Codex said: @jp1 said: @Codex said: I felt their stated policy was fair, reasonable and not bad in the least bit. I guess we can disagree on this point. Yet, I am paying customer they did not listen to me. Looks like your reasonableness out weigh my reasonableness. They did adjust from 12 covers to the actual amount people would have received. I’m sure that was to account for the fact that folks taking your stance found that part unfair. Justly so btw. I am sorry, but how do justify getting 12 covers fair when normally it would range for 6-12? I said something similar in the other thread, but if BCS had said something like, we can't at this time differentiate between levels of ascended characters therefore we are giving everyone 12 covers. Then ofcourse I would have ascended.
@Codex said:
I don’t. I think you misread my post.
> >
A few of you could use a reality check. Oh, if you are “whining and crying and throwing a tantrum” and name calling you probably should read back at just how childish and pathetic you sound. Not to mention coming off as a giant hypocrite since you know, those are the exact things you are accusing people of making largely reasonable feedback of doing.
Zero problem with feedback. Both sides of this argument had feedback. My issue is more that they had a policy and then abrogated it. They abrogated it largely in part because of people playing the "I'm not gonna spend my monies" argument which is infantile behavior. I have no problem with them deciding that something they decided before isn't the best plan. But that decision was documented and other people made decisions based on that. Then another group of people pitched a fit well after the fact and viola everyone who played by the rules lost out. Plenty of folks who waited to ascend did so because they were told they would not get those rewards.
Glad you got yours. Sorry that you can't see why that might upset folks.
@jp1 said: Wow, the vitriol here is ridiculous. God forbid the dev team would listen to customer concerns and then deviate from their original plan to try and give a fair solution to a bad policy. That’s one of the biggest complaints of the past years and as soon as it happens they are mocked and shamed.
Except if you scroll up and look at S0kun response to my question you'll see that instead of a fair solution they implement a 'secret handshake' solution for Forumites/Discord members.
Essentially only those players who are in the 'club' and know of this policy are going to get their retro covers via a customer service request. Anyone who doesn't come here or there or have an alliance who is aware is going to miss out entirely. That's not exactly a fair solution. They should have made an in game announcement to the effect of 'if you have ascended X23, please contact customer service for your retro rewards' OR simply spent time to write a script to search all rosters who have an ascended X23 and awarded accordingly.
KGB
@jp1 said: Wow, the vitriol here is ridiculous. God forbid the dev team would listen to customer concerns and then deviate from their original plan to try and give a fair solution to a bad policy. That’s one of the biggest complaints of the past years and as soon as it happens they are mocked and shamed. A few of you could use a reality check. Oh, if you are “whining and crying and throwing a tantrum” and name calling you probably should read back at just how childish and pathetic you sound. Not to mention coming off as a giant hypocrite since you know, those are the exact things you are accusing people of making largely reasonable feedback of doing. Anyway, thanks devs for continuing to prove how different you are from the old guard and actually listening to your customers and adjusting when/where you see it is reasonable. Like last time, I’ll be spending whatever I might have spent and then some to show appreciation and support.
Anyway, thanks devs for continuing to prove how different you are from the old guard and actually listening to your customers and adjusting when/where you see it is reasonable. Like last time, I’ll be spending whatever I might have spent and then some to show appreciation and support.
You need to check out the Reddit comments. They're even saltier than here. And they aren't making an attempt to hide the fact they're motivated by jealousy and resentment.
@revskip said: @jp1 said: > > A few of you could use a reality check. Oh, if you are “whining and crying and throwing a tantrum” and name calling you probably should read back at just how childish and pathetic you sound. Not to mention coming off as a giant hypocrite since you know, those are the exact things you are accusing people of making largely reasonable feedback of doing. Zero problem with feedback. Both sides of this argument had feedback. My issue is more that they had a policy and then abrogated it. They abrogated it largely in part because of people playing the "I'm not gonna spend my monies" argument which is infantile behavior. I have no problem with them deciding that something they decided before isn't the best plan. But that decision was documented and other people made decisions based on that. Then an other group of people pitched a fit well after the fact and viola everyone who played by the rules lost out. Plenty of folks who waited to ascend did so because they were told they would not get those rewards. Glad you got yours. Sorry that you can't see why that might upset folks.
@revskip said:
Zero problem with feedback. Both sides of this argument had feedback. My issue is more that they had a policy and then abrogated it. They abrogated it largely in part because of people playing the "I'm not gonna spend my monies" argument which is infantile behavior. I have no problem with them deciding that something they decided before isn't the best plan. But that decision was documented and other people made decisions based on that. Then an other group of people pitched a fit well after the fact and viola everyone who played by the rules lost out. Plenty of folks who waited to ascend did so because they were told they would not get those rewards.
Where was this “I’m not gonna spend my monies” argument made?
Also, you waited to Ascend…I get that’s an inconvenience. Hardly at the same level as losing retro rewards that take years of roster building to acquire. If they wanted to send all of you who waited something extra I wouldn’t make a stink about it. I really don’t see why everyone is so concerned with what someone else will get.
You could ascend now and use the awful X-23 ascended version and see what all you missed out on while still getting the rewards. That’s a win for everyone.
@KGB said: @jp1 said: Wow, the vitriol here is ridiculous. God forbid the dev team would listen to customer concerns and then deviate from their original plan to try and give a fair solution to a bad policy. That’s one of the biggest complaints of the past years and as soon as it happens they are mocked and shamed. Except if you scroll up and look at S0kun response to my question you'll see that instead of a fair solution they implement a 'secret handshake' solution for Forumites/Discord members. Essentially only those players who are in the 'club' and know of this policy are going to get their retro covers via a customer service request. Anyone who doesn't come here or there or have an alliance who is aware is going to miss out entirely. That's not exactly a fair solution. They should have made an in game announcement to the effect of 'if you have ascended X23, please contact customer service for your retro rewards' OR simply spent time to write a script to search all rosters who have an ascended X23 and awarded accordingly. KGB
@KGB said:
I agree with this too. I’m not saying it’s a perfectly fair solution. At least they are doing something though, and have plans to fix the bad policy moving forward.
@liminal_lad said: @jp1 said: Wow, the vitriol here is ridiculous. God forbid the dev team would listen to customer concerns and then deviate from their original plan to try and give a fair solution to a bad policy. That’s one of the biggest complaints of the past years and as soon as it happens they are mocked and shamed. A few of you could use a reality check. Oh, if you are “whining and crying and throwing a tantrum” and name calling you probably should read back at just how childish and pathetic you sound. Not to mention coming off as a giant hypocrite since you know, those are the exact things you are accusing people of making largely reasonable feedback of doing. Anyway, thanks devs for continuing to prove how different you are from the old guard and actually listening to your customers and adjusting when/where you see it is reasonable. Like last time, I’ll be spending whatever I might have spent and then some to show appreciation and support. You need to check out the Reddit comments. They're even saltier than here. And they aren't making an attempt to hide the fact they're motivated by jealousy and resentment.
@liminal_lad said:
"Jealousy and resentment" is exactly the response that anyone would and should have, when their competitors in a competitive game are being handed a competitive advantage.
That's fair. I just find it funny how high-minded other people are pretending to be about this. They're either less good at hiding that there objections are selfishly motivated or more honest about it.
@jp1 said: Where was this “I’m not gonna spend my monies” argument made?
Page 1 of the thread they had to break off of the new character page. You were in there, perhaps you just skimmed past it.
All over reddit. And on Discord. And I'm certain in all of the backchannels that exist as well.
It's not a new thing, happens any time there is an unpopular feature/character/event that some are up in arms about.
@revskip said: @jp1 said: Where was this “I’m not gonna spend my monies” argument made? Page 1 of the thread they had to break off of the new character page. You were in there, perhaps you just skimmed past it. All over reddit. And on Discord. And I'm certain in all of the backchannels that exist as well. It's not a new thing, happens any time there is an unpopular feature/character/event that some are up in arms about.
Voting with dollars is how most change happens in the world. Why should it be any different here?
@liminal_lad said: @revskip said: @jp1 said: Where was this “I’m not gonna spend my monies” argument made? Page 1 of the thread they had to break off of the new character page. You were in there, perhaps you just skimmed past it. All over reddit. And on Discord. And I'm certain in all of the backchannels that exist as well. It's not a new thing, happens any time there is an unpopular feature/character/event that some are up in arms about. Voting with dollars is how most change happens in the world. Why should it be any different here?
By all means vote with your dollars. But don't pitch a public fit about it. That is the providence of children.
Look… the devs publicly stated that they understand it’s a frustrating policy and they are going to try and right the code so that all players get the rewards moving forward. That was pretty much all I needed to hear as it was confirmation of the point I was trying to make. It’s ya player unfriendly policy that penalizes for ascending. The rigid idea that once a policy is in place it should never be amended or abolished is very silly. Countless examples throughout history.
The reason ascended characters aren’t giving feeders isn’t because the developers see it as a separate character now and therefore you shouldn’t get the rewards because you “sold” the four stars when you made your five. It isn’t because the idea of choosing between future rewards and a higher level character is some cool strategic element they implemented. The reason you can’t get your covers is because it would take a very long time to code. And the only way to do it (for now) is manually. That’s it.
So why the policy? The policy is in place to help offset a groundswell of customer service tickets from thousands of players. Not a large number when looking at the overall player base. But huge when looking at their staff size. If the developers decide not to adhere to their boundary and overwork themselves as a goodwill gesture to the players… more power to them. I’m not going to get upset if they choose to use their time this way.
It’s funny that even when the developers say, “you know what… this does suck and we are going to try and fix it in the future” people are STILL going off in here salty as can be. It gives a real old man yelling at clouds vibe to me. There’s also a lot of stone-throwing and glass houses. I see Karens, whiners, and complainers on both sides.
As someone who didn’t ascend and should be arguing against others “getting theirs” (Because this is competitive! Grr! Die!), I still say good for those that get their.covers. I’m sure it took a really long time and a lot of resources to get two copies (at least one max) of X-23.
By not ascending I missed out on months of a higher level version of a character you got to enjoy. I’m not going to cry about it. It’s really not that deep.