Feedback Wanted: Character Balance

1…6791112…29

Comments

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,455 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    Halleck said:
    [...] Within the broad spectrum of competitive to casual players, anyone with finite leisure time values speed to some extent.
    I have a roster that probably would allow me to play PVE competitively, but I choose to play to progression because I don't have a life that allows me to play optimally. I'm all about those force multipliers just to get it out of the way. 

    The core mechanic of this game is Collecting Characters, the actual Match-3 modes are just the chores you have to do to get your allowance to open packs.
  • Jacklag
    Jacklag Posts: 316 Mover and Shaker
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    Taganov said:

    Nerfs, though, are a nuclear option. Scorched earth. No one wins. D3 have never, not once, nerfed a character and have it retain any relevance. In case ya'll forgot: Ragnarok, Sentry, Wolverine 4, Wolverine 5, Gambit.
    I'm sure there were others, but the forum tears were especially salty for those.
    I'm sorry to interject on a comment that I mostly agree with (nerfs are bad and should be considered only in the last case scenario) but I think you are confusing relevant with meta.

    Aside from Sentry, Ragnarok, Wolverine 4, Wolverine 5 and Gambit all have their uses They may not be the top characters in their tiers, but they each have a partner that allows them to shine: Ragnarok+Riri, XFWolverine+XFDeadpool, OML+a yellow battery, BlackBolt+Gambit. And I think that is the point of balance, when a character is not great by himself but becomes great with a few specific allies. 

    That, I think, is the case for Hammercap, 5*Thor, and 4*GRocket, but it's not the case for Bishop. 
  • jp1
    jp1 Posts: 1,081 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,287 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
  • jamesh
    jamesh Posts: 1,600 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum

    For people saying "don't nerf anyone", remember that it is possible to nerf a character without even changing its stats.  The developers even have form for doing this.

    Way back when there were only a few 4* characters in the game, the developers did a massive rebalance that touched almost every character in the game. Everyone whose health was adjusted got an increase. It took a while to sort through the list of changed characters to find out who'd been left behind.  In effect, they'd done a stealth nerf of 2* Storm, and all the Daken and Wolverine variants.  Some of the Wolverine variants got a boost later on, but you can still see the effects today.

  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 10,275 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    Jacklag said:
    Taganov said:

    Nerfs, though, are a nuclear option. Scorched earth. No one wins. D3 have never, not once, nerfed a character and have it retain any relevance. In case ya'll forgot: Ragnarok, Sentry, Wolverine 4, Wolverine 5, Gambit.
    I'm sure there were others, but the forum tears were especially salty for those.
    I'm sorry to interject on a comment that I mostly agree with (nerfs are bad and should be considered only in the last case scenario) but I think you are confusing relevant with meta.

    Aside from Sentry, Ragnarok, Wolverine 4, Wolverine 5 and Gambit all have their uses They may not be the top characters in their tiers, but they each have a partner that allows them to shine: Ragnarok+Riri, XFWolverine+XFDeadpool, OML+a yellow battery, BlackBolt+Gambit. And I think that is the point of balance, when a character is not great by himself but becomes great with a few specific allies. 

    That, I think, is the case for Hammercap, 5*Thor, and 4*GRocket, but it's not the case for Bishop. 

    Sentry has his use for some much needed MPQ comedy. Thank you "Sacrifice"!
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,819 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    jamesh said:

    For people saying "don't nerf anyone", remember that it is possible to nerf a character without even changing its stats.  The developers even have form for doing this.

    Way back when there were only a few 4* characters in the game, the developers did a massive rebalance that touched almost every character in the game. Everyone whose health was adjusted got an increase. It took a while to sort through the list of changed characters to find out who'd been left behind.  In effect, they'd done a stealth nerf of 2* Storm, and all the Daken and Wolverine variants.  Some of the Wolverine variants got a boost later on, but you can still see the effects today.

    It's a 6 year old game and vastly different than it was.  I'm not sure how many of the people working on the game back then even still work at Demiurge.  Probably under 5.

    I think hoping for some broad, tier-wide readjustment of 5* health and match dmg is a fantasy.  The fact is that they design 5's around their health and match dmg to some extent.  One reason Carbage has such high health and match dmg is he has low attack tile and direct dmg numbers, so he has to stick around to be even a little effective and they decided to make his match dmg hit harder.  It's their balance.  If a character is slower on offense they often get more health and match dmg.

    That said of course there is match dmg creep; it's how you keep the top spenders invested in new 5's when they are rocking a slew of 550s.  Match dmg is the primary basic passive power that all 5's have.

    Not to say some of the very old 5's shouldn't be improved...they should.  But doing that will only effectively help very long term vets who already have them covered, or nearly covered, etc.   Dilution is horrible, the vast majority of players will never open their wallets to cover a 5 from scratch, and shards mean you will be chasing every 5 you can't just pull in Latests for about a year or more - assuming you are starting with only a few covers.
  • jp1
    jp1 Posts: 1,081 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,819 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    @Daredevil217

    Granted on that option D....note that it includes "AP costs, etc".  Which could be number tweaks to damage etc, I agree.  I don't think that it is promising they could do it but they want to see what people think.

    There have been plenty of surveys that offered options with no apparent impact in the game.   Remember being asked about sending characters out on missions when you weren't playing?

    I'd be happy to be wrong but remain leery that the small dev team has the manpower to take on a project like rebalancing ALL the characters in the 5 tier (up to 40 in a week!) since again, standardizing the match dmg would require hitting basically every character's ability costs and damage numbers unless I am way off.  And maybe they have some slider that they can push and pull and somehow it balances out the AP and damage automatically, but I feel like they would be doing lots of testing with each one.

    Again, if you brought, say, Carnage down to the middle (assuming your goal was to have everyone the same) you'd make him far worse as a character unless suddenly his attacks were much much more powerful, for example.

    And woe to the players who have carefully curated their rosters - and spent dollars - making sure Okoye tanks for Thor.  Suddenly that's gone.  Would they be happy?

    Maybe it could be a years-long project taking us through the next 6 years of the game.  Or maybe they just wanted to make sure they put all possible responses on their survey to help inform direction of rebalances. 

    Honestly I think it would be a mistake to make every 5 exactly the same in terms of match dmg for a variety of reasons.  Or to do a broad, major rework of the tier.  Given how strategic people have been in their targeting of specific ones, it seems rife with danger for negative reactions.  Help out the weakest ones, yes.
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,287 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
    Of course if you throw bishop in a crash he won't be OP, Crash's are 4* vs 4*.  I specifically said "He is a monster vs 5*" so saying he won't be that affective against another 4 star is irrelevant to my point.

    Bishop is only a problem when facing a 5 star opponent.  It's been said before, but I'll say it again.  A character should not shut down the entire tier above them.

    I'm on day 2174.  In the 6 years I've been playing there have only been 2 characters so OP that having them on defense was basically just as good as being shielded in PVP.  The first was Gambit and the second is Bishop

    They didn't allow Gambit to go on being a free shield saver and I very much doubt they will allow Bishop to keep doing it.  
  • Painmonger
    Painmonger Posts: 167 Tile Toppler
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    I'm sorry, but I find this thread more than a little patronizing. You want to know how we feel about character balance right now? You just said there are changes in the works & even with total agreement we shouldn't expect anything to come from this any time soon. There are also 3 threads in this sub in the first 2 pages about nerfing Bishop & Worthy Cap & restoring OML & Gambit, still getting comments less than a week ago. If that's not recent enough for you then any changes you have in the pipeline right now will make any input from this poll useless. It's already down to another A/B test we all dislike because there aren't enough options. It was explained as a limit to the forum technology, but it's the exact same button you use to create a 2nd & 3rd poll option, just hit the button again. I can't help but feel this is all just a shortcut for the dev team to only have 3 numbers to look at & the comments associated with our voted will never be read.

    That said, I'll play along!

    I picked Super Soldier Serum based on volume of changes needed. Bishop is probably the biggest problem character in the game, Worthy Cap is 2nd, but it wouldn't take much to fix them & in general I dislike nerfs. Extend Cap's CDs to 2 turns or reduce the number of them. Make Bishop's jump in front mechanic work like the others so it only happens if the teammate has lower HP. Those would be minor adjustments to one power rather than the scorched Earth policy employed in the past.

    150+ comments so far, a lot of them saying the same thing, the older 5* really need to be brought up to par on match damage & health. AP costs or damage numbers should be tweaked for a lot of them, too. Others have already stated Banner & Wasp should be completely redone, as they are now they're just dead weight. The 4* tier needs work, too, as there are a bunch of characters that don't seem to bring anything to the table. The plus side to dilution at that level, though, is that at least there are plenty of other options. Undo some of the previous changes & see how things go. We were told Mr Fantastic was far & away the least used 4* & was reworked because of that, so I'd be interested to find out how much his usage has changed since then? I know personally it went from Kaecelius(sp?) to never.

    In the end I think the forums are too small a cross section of the players to get any meaningful data. I'd propose an in game survey similar to the ones we get from time to time. Once a month give every player a chance to vote on one character to get a buff or nerf, weigh that with their usage in the respective tier & whoever has the highest rating gets an adjustment in the next month. Put a 6 month limit before that character can be selected again. You could add a comment with the vote so players could say exactly what they think is wrong with the character so you know what to fix. If no one stacks up enough to hit a minimum threshold, announce it & state no changes will be made that month. We'd be making progress, players would feel more engaged & listened to, and even if you had to do every character, you could stretch that out over a decade.
  • jp1
    jp1 Posts: 1,081 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
    Of course if you throw bishop in a crash he won't be OP, Crash's are 4* vs 4*.  I specifically said "He is a monster vs 5*" so saying he won't be that affective against another 4 star is irrelevant to my point.

    Bishop is only a problem when facing a 5 star opponent.  It's been said before, but I'll say it again.  A character should not shut down the entire tier above them.

    I'm on day 2174.  In the 6 years I've been playing there have only been 2 characters so OP that having them on defense was basically just as good as being shielded in PVP.  The first was Gambit and the second is Bishop

    They didn't allow Gambit to go on being a free shield saver and I very much doubt they will allow Bishop to keep doing it.  

    “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

    I’ll say this...having Bishop out on defense is not “as good as being shielded” but it is better than most other options. Second, I’ll take any Crash with a mid to top tier 5 against a solo Bishop and guarantee a win. He is nothing other than an annoyance without someone doing damage during the duration of his stun mechanic. So, IMO, he isn’t a good solo character...even though he is a great support character. 

    Perhaps you have more 5s than I do, I’m not familiar with your roster. The fifteen I do have champed contain most of the top and second tier 5s. Maybe that is a factor. Or maybe I’m willing to look for different strategies, or use other teams besides my top three. In any case, in my experience, he isn’t nearly as much a problem as he is made out to be.

  • Godzillafan67
    Godzillafan67 Posts: 598 Critical Contributor
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    Godzillafan67 said:
    An important note: At 163 votes having been cast thus far, exactly zero of those are for "Balance is fine right now".

    220 votes now. Still none for "balance is fine right now". Though I didn't mention it before, the voting ratio remains 4:1 in favor of buffing vs nerfing.
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,287 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
    Of course if you throw bishop in a crash he won't be OP, Crash's are 4* vs 4*.  I specifically said "He is a monster vs 5*" so saying he won't be that affective against another 4 star is irrelevant to my point.

    Bishop is only a problem when facing a 5 star opponent.  It's been said before, but I'll say it again.  A character should not shut down the entire tier above them.

    I'm on day 2174.  In the 6 years I've been playing there have only been 2 characters so OP that having them on defense was basically just as good as being shielded in PVP.  The first was Gambit and the second is Bishop

    They didn't allow Gambit to go on being a free shield saver and I very much doubt they will allow Bishop to keep doing it.  

    “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

    I’ll say this...having Bishop out on defense is not “as good as being shielded” but it is better than most other options. Second, I’ll take any Crash with a mid to top tier 5 against a solo Bishop and guarantee a win. He is nothing other than an annoyance without someone doing damage during the duration of his stun mechanic. So, IMO, he isn’t a good solo character...even though he is a great support character. 

    Perhaps you have more 5s than I do, I’m not familiar with your roster. The fifteen I do have champed contain most of the top and second tier 5s. Maybe that is a factor. Or maybe I’m willing to look for different strategies, or use other teams besides my top three. In any case, in my experience, he isn’t nearly as much a problem as he is made out to be.

    As OJSP said, I have 9.  Most of them older, only Meta one is a recently champed Thor but no Okoye.  The only strategy that has worked somewhat well for me with Bishop is Thanos/Panther but it's very dependent on Panther being up front to get stunned and keeping thanos from being stunned until Panther returns from being stunned after 4 turns. Not easy to do.

    Maybe with your 15 Five star champs you have more options to work around Bishop and have found something that works, but with my options of just reaching 5 star land with my highest lvl 5 star at lvl 454, I've found Panthos to be best and that is not at all reliable.  I can either skip, or drop down to using 4 stars to not trigger Bishop.  I'm in five star land, I don't want to go back down to 4 star just like when I got into 4 star land I didn't want to keep using 2 and 3 stars.

    I'm on this forum, line, discord, and fb MPQ groups and I can tell you that no, it's not just my opinion.  People constantly brag about how long they can go with no hits, minimal hits, or even defensive gains in pvp with no shields, just Bishop.  If I had Bishop champed I'd give him a try myself.  
  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,819 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use a dusting of nerf powder
    Godzillafan67 said:
    Godzillafan67 said:
    An important note: At 163 votes having been cast thus far, exactly zero of those are for "Balance is fine right now".

    220 votes now. Still none for "balance is fine right now". Though I didn't mention it before, the voting ratio remains 4:1 in favor of buffing vs nerfing.
    Two things:

    1.  I think most players agree that there are characters who need some adjustment somewhere, given that there has not been a rebalance in a year.

    2.  If you have a poll which requires you to take action....and your choice is "everything is fine".....you are less motivated to express that than if you feel something needs addressing.  Human nature.  Also this is the forum, so you need to create a login to even register a vote which means you are already by default invested in the game and almost certainly want to see some rebalancing done.

    I don't think I've seen one single player express an opinion that no one needs work - at least not in several years.  Banner has been in the game for a very, very long time, for one thing.
  • jp1
    jp1 Posts: 1,081 Chairperson of the Boards
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
    Of course if you throw bishop in a crash he won't be OP, Crash's are 4* vs 4*.  I specifically said "He is a monster vs 5*" so saying he won't be that affective against another 4 star is irrelevant to my point.

    Bishop is only a problem when facing a 5 star opponent.  It's been said before, but I'll say it again.  A character should not shut down the entire tier above them.

    I'm on day 2174.  In the 6 years I've been playing there have only been 2 characters so OP that having them on defense was basically just as good as being shielded in PVP.  The first was Gambit and the second is Bishop

    They didn't allow Gambit to go on being a free shield saver and I very much doubt they will allow Bishop to keep doing it.  

    “Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”

    I’ll say this...having Bishop out on defense is not “as good as being shielded” but it is better than most other options. Second, I’ll take any Crash with a mid to top tier 5 against a solo Bishop and guarantee a win. He is nothing other than an annoyance without someone doing damage during the duration of his stun mechanic. So, IMO, he isn’t a good solo character...even though he is a great support character. 

    Perhaps you have more 5s than I do, I’m not familiar with your roster. The fifteen I do have champed contain most of the top and second tier 5s. Maybe that is a factor. Or maybe I’m willing to look for different strategies, or use other teams besides my top three. In any case, in my experience, he isn’t nearly as much a problem as he is made out to be.

    As OJSP said, I have 9.  Most of them older, only Meta one is a recently champed Thor but no Okoye.  The only strategy that has worked somewhat well for me with Bishop is Thanos/Panther but it's very dependent on Panther being up front to get stunned and keeping thanos from being stunned until Panther returns from being stunned after 4 turns. Not easy to do.

    Maybe with your 15 Five star champs you have more options to work around Bishop and have found something that works, but with my options of just reaching 5 star land with my highest lvl 5 star at lvl 454, I've found Panthos to be best and that is not at all reliable.  I can either skip, or drop down to using 4 stars to not trigger Bishop.  I'm in five star land, I don't want to go back down to 4 star just like when I got into 4 star land I didn't want to keep using 2 and 3 stars.

    I'm on this forum, line, discord, and fb MPQ groups and I can tell you that no, it's not just my opinion.  People constantly brag about how long they can go with no hits, minimal hits, or even defensive gains in pvp with no shields, just Bishop.  If I had Bishop champed I'd give him a try myself.  
    That’s a movie quote, and in jest. However, even if many people hold an opinion it is still just that. 

    It’s quite possible that our roster differences, and especially the fact I have a decently leveled Bishop, are responsible for the differing opinions here. I definitely have more effective options than Panthos at my disposal since luck has been kind to me with my draws. I’m not trying to shout down anyone who feels Bishop is a detriment to their gameplay...just offering an opposing view so we don’t wind up in an echo chamber here.

    If they do nerf Bishop my life is likely to become less complicated when it comes to PVP, so I stand to gain nothing from coming to his defense. Other people, those in transition with maybe 1 or 2 five star champs or those deeply rooted in 4 star land having to deal with under leveled fives who are still dominating their play experience might need those tools.
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 10,275 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited January 2020
    Some characters could use super soldier serum
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    jp1 said:
    So, you think Bishop is great by himself then? He isn’t going to be much trouble unless he has one or two good partners.

    I think all 5s should be exceptional both solo and with a team. The endgame that takes years to achieve is underwhelming at times and that is what I call broken.

    Also OML is still not good even with a yellow battery. He would be an amazing 4* but he needs a buff to be taken serious in 5* territory.
    I can only assume you are in 4 star land because as a 5 star player Bishop is a monster by himself.  I don't care about his partners, when I skip a bishop team it is because of bishop not his partners.  With my 5 star team I can't so much as match 3 without him jumping in front, doing double the damage, gaining ap and then stun locking my team.

    Hammer cap is a pain too but he needs Hawkeye.  Bishop is a pain by himself, not because "he has one or 2 good partners".  Who he is partnered with is irrelevant to me because HE IS THE PROBLEM.
    Actually I am a 5 star player. Take on Bishop teams all the time as well as HammerCap. They are more challenging but not impossible. 

    If you stick Bishop in a Crash of the Titans he won’t pose much threat, thus “by himself” he isn’t very intimidating. The whole attitude of people can’t have differing opinions on Bishop without clearly being uninformed is getting quite old to be honest. 

    You think he is OP, I don’t. Of course you think you are right...otherwise you wouldn’t have formed your opinion in the first place. That doesn’t make it a fact.
    Of course if you throw bishop in a crash he won't be OP, Crash's are 4* vs 4*.  I specifically said "He is a monster vs 5*" so saying he won't be that affective against another 4 star is irrelevant to my point.

    Bishop is only a problem when facing a 5 star opponent.  It's been said before, but I'll say it again.  A character should not shut down the entire tier above them.

    I'm on day 2174.  In the 6 years I've been playing there have only been 2 characters so OP that having them on defense was basically just as good as being shielded in PVP.  The first was Gambit and the second is Bishop

    They didn't allow Gambit to go on being a free shield saver and I very much doubt they will allow Bishop to keep doing it.  
    Not wishing to get involved beyond saying that this is in fact not correct. Crash of the Titans can be characters from 3, 4 or 5* tier as opponents. Oh plus Galactus.

Categories