New Feature: Bonus Heroes! *Updated (3/1/17)

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  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,274 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I know the feature is called "Bonus Heroes" but why does it feel that it should be called "Vaulting is back!"...

    5% chance of something happening really is insignificant in the grand scheme of things. You try to make it sound
    like its awesome and everything but it sounds more like an excuse to reintroduce vaulting.

    Vaulting a ton of characters and making them unavailable is a lot more important. You've basically killed your champions
    system with this vaulting stuff, way to go!

    You tried vaulting before, it was deemed a failure. Now let's try it again... I... dont... understand.

    icon_mad.gif
  • Lukoil
    Lukoil Posts: 266 Mover and Shaker
    edited March 2017
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    DayvBang wrote:
    Not speaking as a moderator:

    I seriously can't believe we're not only going back to vaulted covers, but more heavily vaulted than ever before. Over two-thirds of 4* removed from most tokens. Almost my entire set of 4* champs cut off of further levels except for the one I decide to focus on.

    This is a total "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" moment. They've given us what looks like a nice (but highly unreliable) way to occasionally get more covers for selected characters, but gutted the 4* and 3* reward pools in the process.

    Why is character vaulting in any way necessary to introduce bonu.s heroes? Why is it necessary at all?

    All this does is spoil the reception for bonus heroes by roping it to an utterly terrible decision
    well I guess you misiing the point here. You actually can favorite ALL your characters and will have same pool as before. with 5% chance to get 4* cover you need.
  • Dragon_Nexus
    Dragon_Nexus Posts: 3,701 Chairperson of the Boards
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    DayvBang wrote:
    Why is character vaulting in any way necessary to introduce bonus heroes? Why is it necessary at all?

    All this does is spoil the reception for bonus heroes by roping it to an utterly terrible decision.

    I can only assume the logic is that it shrinks the prize pool, ergo you have a higher chance of getting one of the handful of covers. "Oh hey, that 4* I really need is one of the 12 or so in the legendary token. I'll go for that!"

    It feels a little lame when I open a token and "Oh...a Red Hulk. Okay..." I mean sure, a champ level makes him more powerful, but a cover for my under-13s club would have been nice, too. I had a long run where every classic legendary I opened was just a champ level.

    So I can see where they're coming from with this, obviously newer 4*s are going to be more desirable and harder to come by.

    That said, limiting the number of 3*s available makes no sense to me. We're well past the point where 3*s are the strongly desirable aspect of the game. 3* is a stepping stone to 4* land now, the faster you can get them up and usable the better, so limiting the distribution doesn't help anyone there. We're not getting new 3*s that much, so saying "We're going to help you grab the new characters" is meaningless.

    I don't like the attitude I'm seeing from some posters here where it seems to be "I dislike this small aspect, ergo we need to trash the entire thing and start over". Not saying you're doing that, DavyBang, I'm just seeing it from other posters. It's not constructive and it's a brand new feature that can be tweaked as time goes on. Can we not just give it a chance for now?
  • spiderpool
    spiderpool Posts: 76 Match Maker
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    I was really hoping this bonus hero thing would let me pick the color in searching for too. If I have a 5/5/0 oml and wanted to favorite red to finally finish him that would have been great. Now I just have to hope that I get a bonus oml and that it also happens to be red.
  • notamutant
    notamutant Posts: 855 Critical Contributor
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    Pulled a Thanos from LL. Got a bonus OML. Pulled a Medusa yellow from CL, got a bonus Medusa yellow (she was at 1/5/5 before so I got really lucky I didn't end up with two extra covers to throw away). Then I decided to pull 10 more LL tokens, and got no more bonuses. I did however get extra covers for **** characters I didn't champion and didn't want to champion ever (Wasp). Before, I at least would've had a better chance of not pulling covers for a 4 star I didn't already champion or have no interest in. I have very mixed feelings on this. It will only be good if all the new characters released are good. Otherwise, I will be stuck with characters that are not only lower champion level than my older characters, but also worse.
  • thisone
    thisone Posts: 655 Critical Contributor
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    It's March 1st not April 1st yah mooks icon_e_smile.gif
  • zonatahunt
    zonatahunt Posts: 251 Mover and Shaker
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    Eight pages of thoughts and comments, and no one has mentioned what this has accomplished for the longevity of the game. By minimizing possible 4* pulls to the 12 newest, they've substantially slowed championing progression at that level. For the life expectancy of the game it's a good thing. I have all but six 4*s champed and my highest 4* is PX at level 325. In a little over a year I've gotten PX more than halfway to his leveling demise. This vaulted feature of only including the 12 newest 4*s slows my march towards level 370, and ultimately will give me more time to collect useful covers before I'm forced to either recruit a new PX or sell an unusable cover when he becomes champ-maxed. I have to assume they make good money with this game, I enjoy playing it daily, so a feature that can increase the life expectancy of my favorite game is a welcome change to me. Also, in PvP-land, a non-champed character paints a red target on your butt. I'd rather increase my ability to get 13 covers of the newest characters so they can be champed, as opposed to praying to the RNG gods that another IW doesn't pop up instead of a cover I need for a new character not at 13 covers. Sure, this feature slows progression to champed characters, but it greatly increases the rate at which you can cover-max newer characters. Lastly, yes, when a 4* is buffed, and they're champ-maxed they can be a force that can take on a 5*...but generally 5* characters fight against other 5*s...so who cares if progression of champed 4*s slows substantially?
  • Punter1
    Punter1 Posts: 727 Critical Contributor
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    Lukoil wrote:
    DayvBang wrote:
    Not speaking as a moderator:

    I seriously can't believe we're not only going back to vaulted covers, but more heavily vaulted than ever before. Over two-thirds of 4* removed from most tokens. Almost my entire set of 4* champs cut off of further levels except for the one I decide to focus on.

    This is a total "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" moment. They've given us what looks like a nice (but highly unreliable) way to occasionally get more covers for selected characters, but gutted the 4* and 3* reward pools in the process.

    Why is character vaulting in any way necessary to introduce bonu.s heroes? Why is it necessary at all?

    All this does is spoil the reception for bonus heroes by roping it to an utterly terrible decision
    well I guess you misiing the point here. You actually can favorite ALL your characters and will have same pool as before. with 5% chance to get 4* cover you need.

    But before with all the characters in the pool you had ~2% chance to get a specific 4* from classic. So if you have 9 champs like I do, that's an 18% chance of a champ level, which is progression through ISO, CP or tokens. Now 8 of those 9 I'll so rarely see a token for as I need to use my fave to focus on the 15+ useful "old" 4* I need covers for that aren't covered.

    The fave thing is good to help target my bonus covers to ones I wnat

    The vaulting is bad
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Dragon_Nexus wrote:
    obviously newer 4*s are going to be more desirable

    To you maybe! I could care less if I get any of the 12 in the next 3-6 months. I've got at least 1 cover to so I can play them when they are required. But I'd rather focus on building my top tier 4* to champ level so I can actually play competitively. But no, now I'll get saddled with flavors of the month constantly.

    Also a lot of people in my alliance are still in 2* territory struggling to have the 4*s for required. So I guess they're just totally out of luck of ever having those required characters. icon_rolleyes.gif
  • Lukoil
    Lukoil Posts: 266 Mover and Shaker
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    sinnerjfl wrote:
    Vaulting a ton of characters and making them unavailable is a lot more important. You've basically killed your champions
    system with this vaulting stuff, way to go!
    But you can make them available just by selecting all of them as favorites
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Lukoil wrote:
    sinnerjfl wrote:
    Vaulting a ton of characters and making them unavailable is a lot more important. You've basically killed your champions
    system with this vaulting stuff, way to go!
    But you can make them available just by selecting all of them as favorites

    So instead of RNG they are now an RNG to an RNG to an RNG. I'm thrilled. icon_rolleyes.gif
  • optimus2861
    optimus2861 Posts: 1,232 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Vaulting (BOOOOOOOO! icon_evil.gif ) + Confusing = might be finally time for me to permanently retire. Pity, because I've really been enjoying the DDQ changes. Actually kept me logging in daily again.
  • whycantwesyncpc
    whycantwesyncpc Posts: 188 Tile Toppler
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    Lukoil wrote:
    DayvBang wrote:
    Not speaking as a moderator:

    I seriously can't believe we're not only going back to vaulted covers, but more heavily vaulted than ever before. Over two-thirds of 4* removed from most tokens. Almost my entire set of 4* champs cut off of further levels except for the one I decide to focus on.

    This is a total "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" moment. They've given us what looks like a nice (but highly unreliable) way to occasionally get more covers for selected characters, but gutted the 4* and 3* reward pools in the process.

    Why is character vaulting in any way necessary to introduce bonu.s heroes? Why is it necessary at all?

    All this does is spoil the reception for bonus heroes by roping it to an utterly terrible decision
    well I guess you misiing the point here. You actually can favorite ALL your characters and will have same pool as before. with 5% chance to get 4* cover you need.

    5% that you pull one when you pull one when you pull a 4* cover. For those of us who have lives and can't dedicate all of our time to this game how many do you think we pull? I pull maybe 2-3 a month. What's a 5% chance on that? I also just spend most of the past year focused on champing my 3* characters only be told that I now have a 5% chance to maybe get a cover to add champ levels to them. I get no say in what characters are deemed worthy of being pulled. Great I just wasted months of play champing characters I am going to get virtually locked out of adding levels too. What a wonderful feeling.

    It is not the same pool as before. That is just a stupid comment because over 50% of 3* and an even higher percentage of 4*'s and locked out. You add those as favorites and that 5% gets really diluted really fast. Pure stupid and since my play for the last year has turned into a complete waste comes a pure FU. I don't like having my time wasted. If this doesn't get overturned I am likely out of here. I don't have the time to be f'd over by out of touch developers that don't give a **** about doing what it right.
  • Lukoil
    Lukoil Posts: 266 Mover and Shaker
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    broll wrote:
    Lukoil wrote:
    sinnerjfl wrote:
    Vaulting a ton of characters and making them unavailable is a lot more important. You've basically killed your champions
    system with this vaulting stuff, way to go!
    But you can make them available just by selecting all of them as favorites

    So instead of RNG they are now an RNG to an RNG to an RNG. I'm thrilled. icon_rolleyes.gif
    If you don't care what you get from token, then RNG is not the problem here. If you care - now you have controlled RNG and can select specific characters and have 5% to pull them off from tokens.
  • herm1978
    herm1978 Posts: 153 Tile Toppler
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    Jaedenkaal wrote:
    herm1978 wrote:
    This would be good if we could chose color when we get the bonus cover.

    I doubt that I'll select any 4* that I already have maxed two of the colors. That is just begging to get the wrong ones when I get the bonus cover.

    Again, this is no worse than the previous system. However it does feel weird that the new system doesn't really address this, aside from a (somewhat) higher cover acquisition rate. Perhaps they're still working on that feature separately from this one.

    I think this will just emphasize hording tokens even more. A 1 in 20 chance to get a bonus cover is low enough that I want to have it mean something, talk about anti-climatic getting that 1 in 20 just to get a duplicate cover.

    Having such a moment now with 3* Thanos, pulled 16 heroic and got one bonus, a purple. Just the color I have 5 of. Then I bit into my stack of 240 standard tokens and have gotten 3 more covers in 172 pulls (one of each). So now I have a 3/5/4 Thanos with 3 extra purple cover in queue (already had one there waiting).

    And thats just a 3*...
  • cpeyton3535
    cpeyton3535 Posts: 256 Mover and Shaker
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    Lot of good comments on here of the pros and cons. I'm adopting a wait and see, but really don't like the older 4* and 3* toons going into purgatory. Some have suggested a legendary vault for those and I think that solves the problem. I'm off to post that in the suggestions forum.

    Curious. Following the logic stated, shouldn't Coulson be in the 4* list???? Or did I miss something?
  • killerkoala
    killerkoala Posts: 1,185 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Jaedenkaal wrote:
    DayvBang wrote:
    Jaedenkaal wrote:
    Look on the bright side. You'll never have to see another (randomly-generated) Elektra, Reed, or Brock Venom cover ever again, if you don't want to.
    Sure, that's great, except that I champed two of those three characters to make their covers into valuable rewards again. Total waste now.

    Yeah I don't have much to offer you there. I'm guessing they'll still be in vaults, and progression/placement rewards. Well it's not a total waste. There are no rewards unique to any of them that you can't get anywhere else. If you're close to a good one, you could make the push to get to that champion level and then move to someone else. That's what I'll be doing first, getting everyone to 271 for the token.
    killerkoala wrote:
    IDK if this was asked earlier but do we get bonus tokens from post event pulls?
    No bonus tokens from vaults. Oh, you mean from archived vaults? That's a good question. I'd guess no.


    not post event vaults. i'm guessing those rules still apply like regular vault not having bonus covers.

    I mean post events like character pvp's token pages or 1st release character pve events.
  • whycantwesyncpc
    whycantwesyncpc Posts: 188 Tile Toppler
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    cpeyton3535 wrote:
    Lot of good comments on here of the pros and cons. I'm adopting a wait and see, but really don't like the older 4* and 3* toons going into purgatory. Some have suggested a legendary vault for those and I think that solves the problem. I'm off to post that in the suggestions forum.

    Curious. Following the logic stated, shouldn't Coulson be in the 4* list???? Or did I miss something?

    He won't be in tokens until the start of next season
  • firethorne
    firethorne Posts: 1,505 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2017
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    Lukoil wrote:
    DayvBang wrote:
    Not speaking as a moderator:

    I seriously can't believe we're not only going back to vaulted covers, but more heavily vaulted than ever before. Over two-thirds of 4* removed from most tokens. Almost my entire set of 4* champs cut off of further levels except for the one I decide to focus on.

    This is a total "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory" moment. They've given us what looks like a nice (but highly unreliable) way to occasionally get more covers for selected characters, but gutted the 4* and 3* reward pools in the process.

    Why is character vaulting in any way necessary to introduce bonu.s heroes? Why is it necessary at all?

    All this does is spoil the reception for bonus heroes by roping it to an utterly terrible decision
    well I guess you misiing the point here. You actually can favorite ALL your characters and will have same pool as before. with 5% chance to get 4* cover you need.

    No, Lukoil, that isn't how it works. Each pull only has a 5% chance to get a Bonus Hero. But favoriting a character doesn't put it in the classics pool (though that might be a good solution). If you mark everyone as a favorite, 95% of the draws you make will still not get any of them. You still are at significantly reduced odds to get the heroes that have been removed from the packs.
  • Crowl
    Crowl Posts: 1,579 Chairperson of the Boards
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    geno685 wrote:
    I think the vaulting will help out the lower tier players ALOT, cuz now they have a selected amount of heroes they can build up and after so much time, it switches up and by then they hopefully have enough hp to support the new options available. Also when just starting the 4star transition this will help as again they will have a selected amount to obtain from and wont be as swamped with different covers. Lastly it will be easier for lower end players who are trying to build their 4 star platform with the newer realeases because they arent in a good enough alliance or dont go and grind like mad to get progression and top placement.

    Vaulting would help out if you had more control over who was being vaulted, limiting things to the newest 12 omits so many top tier characters, just look at the 4* rankings post and how many of the top half of it is missing from tokens due to this change.

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