Patch Notes - R91 (01/05/16)

GrumpySmurf1002

TxMoose wrote:

i guess it all remains to be seen, but this doesn't quite seem to reach the affect on the game that ddq did. ddq was/is/will be the single best player-friendly addition to the game that I've seen in my 405 days.

I went back to look at that announcment - and there's no go-live date in that announcement either.

So apparently we're in "fool me twice" territory. (twice might be 300 times, but who's counting really)

Phaserhawk

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

It somewhat boggles my mind that arguably the biggest feature the game has rolled out in the last 2 years.....and they are playing the release date by ear.

I don't know, I think the ability to respec was probably the best single feature. True healing IMO was still the most game changing as it completely changed lineups and playstyle. This is just an extension of the end game.

GrumpySmurf1002

Phaserhawk wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

It somewhat boggles my mind that arguably the biggest feature the game has rolled out in the last 2 years.....and they are playing the release date by ear.

I don't know, I think the ability to respec was probably the best single feature. True healing IMO was still the most game changing as it completely changed lineups and playstyle. This is just an extension of the end game.

Well I'm looking at it as this has the potential to be bigger than both of those.

But I did say arguably. Also depends on whether you consider true healing a 'feature' or just a character update, much like the health boost was.

This probably needs it own thread anyway. My point is/was still more of a "how is a change this big not planned down to the minute?"

Phaserhawk

aesthetocyst wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

JVReal wrote:

...

Stay ever vigilant... for we know not when it will arrive.

My Loki will soon be championed....like a thief in the night!

Phaserhawk wrote:

This is just an extension of the end game.

Much more than that Phaser. It's a major shift to the game economy.

It shifts emphasis back to roster development.

It turns completionism into an investment activity.

It (finally!) offsets roster costs. Slot costs literally become direct investments.

It (finally!) positively encourages maxing characters, directly, rather than only indirectly. In the past, I had always discouraged players from making maxing players a priority, due to decreasing ROI. Now—er, as soon as we hit go-live on this feature—it's the exact opposite.

It (finally!) creates a more direct transition from one tier to the next. Completing 1 tier will literally feed into the next.

Within 24hrs, we'll be amazed the game made it 2yrs without the Championing system.

I can give you those. To say it just extends the endgame is a vast understatement. My only concern is that this is how they are going to deal with the issue of 5*'s. I have been facing more and more lately and while they rarely get a skill off on me, I have half my life gone just due to their tile strength. We are getting to a point where the 4* upgrade and hopefully 3 and 2 as well need to be buffed to deal with this 5*'s because they are beginning to be a problem. When OML can take more life than a boosted Daken Chemical Reaction due to just match damage in 3-4 turns, we have a problem.

Orangecrush

Phaserhawk wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

aesthetocyst wrote:

JVReal wrote:

...

Stay ever vigilant... for we know not when it will arrive.

My Loki will soon be championed....like a thief in the night!

Phaserhawk wrote:

This is just an extension of the end game.

Much more than that Phaser. It's a major shift to the game economy.

It shifts emphasis back to roster development.

It turns completionism into an investment activity.

It (finally!) offsets roster costs. Slot costs literally become direct investments.

It (finally!) positively encourages maxing characters, directly, rather than only indirectly. In the past, I had always discouraged players from making maxing players a priority, due to decreasing ROI. Now—er, as soon as we hit go-live on this feature—it's the exact opposite.

It (finally!) creates a more direct transition from one tier to the next. Completing 1 tier will literally feed into the next.

Within 24hrs, we'll be amazed the game made it 2yrs without the Championing system.

I can give you those. To say it just extends the endgame is a vast understatement. My only concern is that this is how they are going to deal with the issue of 5*'s. I have been facing more and more lately and while they rarely get a skill off on me, I have half my life gone just due to their tile strength. We are getting to a point where the 4* upgrade and hopefully 3 and 2 as well need to be buffed to deal with this 5*'s because they are beginning to be a problem. When OML can take more life than a boosted Daken Chemical Reaction due to just match damage in 3-4 turns, we have a problem.

Let me know how the championed 4* deal with the championed 5*.

GrimSkald

Here's the thing, though, with limited exceptions there aren't fully completed 5*s out there. Most of the 5*s I see in PVP have about 5-8 covers, and it took them months to get this far. They're also well short of level 450.

So, yeah, I think we may see one or two of the superwhales with 5* Champions, but that will be it. The cost to get a max 5* champion is litterally hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it by money alone.

What's going to happen is we're going to see 2*s get leveled up pretty quickly (not instantly, but within a month or two we'll see them often - that is if anyone on the high end wants to.) The 3*s will take months to get leveled in an appreciable way. Sure, you can some covers quickly, but collecting 100 covers for anything takes time. 4*s will be an order of magnitude slower - I think it will be quite some time before we see any 370 4*s, and it may well be years before that becomes the norm at the top end (if the game lasts that long.)

The only way to whale this out is to buy 40 packs. A lot of 40 packs. 40 packs are tinykitty expensive.

A side benefit of this is you may get some good 5* covers out of it, though...

Orangecrush

GrimSkald wrote:

Here's the thing, though, with limited exceptions there aren't fully completed 5*s out there. Most of the 5*s I see in PVP have about 5-8 covers, and it took them months to get this far. They're also well short of level 450.

So, yeah, I think we may see one or two of the superwhales with 5* Champions, but that will be it. The cost to get a max 5* champion is litterally hundreds of thousands of dollars to do it by money alone.

What's going to happen is we're going to see 2*s get leveled up pretty quickly (not instantly, but within a month or two we'll see them often - that is if anyone on the high end wants to.) The 3*s will take months to get leveled in an appreciable way. Sure, you can some covers quickly, but collecting 100 covers for anything takes time. 4*s will be an order of magnitude slower - I think it will be quite some time before we see any 370 4*s, and it may well be years before that becomes the norm at the top end (if the game lasts that long.)

The only way to whale this out is to buy 40 packs. A lot of 40 packs. 40 packs are tinykitty expensive.

A side benefit of this is you may get some good 5* covers out of it, though...

While that is true, the benifit of a single level is much greater on a 5* than a 4*. The only thing that will balance it is the increase in number of 5* toons, so the odds of maxing out a specific 5* will go down.

TxMoose

Orangecrush wrote:

While that is true, the benifit of a single level is much greater on a 5* than a 4*. The only thing that will balance it is the increase in number of 5* toons, so the odds of maxing out a specific 5* will go down.

and the slow crawl gets slower. but hey, in the meantime champ some guys.

zeeke

Without them really cranking up the number of 4* we get I dont see any maxed champions any time soon. Im just thinking of my sad creepy bobby whos been sitting at 335 since forever. Thats 11 covers I've collected during months and to expect to get the next 102 soonish is just foolish

simonsez

Orangecrush wrote:

The only thing that will balance it is the increase in number of 5* toons, so the odds of maxing out a specific 5* will go down.

The problem with that is that if you already find yourself hitting a wall of OMLs, you're pretty much screwed since it'll be harder to ever catch up.

Crowl

Phaserhawk wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

It somewhat boggles my mind that arguably the biggest feature the game has rolled out in the last 2 years.....and they are playing the release date by ear.

I don't know, I think the ability to respec was probably the best single feature. True healing IMO was still the most game changing as it completely changed lineups and playstyle. This is just an extension of the end game.

It is a shame that with there being so much randomness in this game that the respecs part of championing can't be unlocked at 13 covers and not locked off until you eventually gather up enough iso to fully level a character, you would think that letting people see characters in their best light would encourage them to max them all that much sooner.

Azoth658

Crowl wrote:

Phaserhawk wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

It somewhat boggles my mind that arguably the biggest feature the game has rolled out in the last 2 years.....and they are playing the release date by ear.

I don't know, I think the ability to respec was probably the best single feature. True healing IMO was still the most game changing as it completely changed lineups and playstyle. This is just an extension of the end game.

It is a shame that with there being so much randomness in this game that the respecs part of championing can't be unlocked at 13 covers and not locked off until you eventually gather up enough iso to fully level a character, you would think that letting people see characters in their best light would encourage them to max them all that much sooner.

Isn't that why they give you those yellow nodes with some of the best build types in? I know seeing speedshot in action made me want to start a hawkeye.

I can see why so many people want the max level to increase on a character once you have 13 covers but with the rewards for champion levels I can see why you need to level them first.

Azoth658

OJSP wrote:

Azoth658 wrote:

Isn't that why they give you those yellow nodes with some of the best build types in? I know seeing speedshot in action made me want to start a hawkeye.

I can see why so many people want the max level to increase on a character once you have 13 covers but with the rewards for champion levels I can see why you need to level them first.

I agree with both paragraphs.

Specifically on the first one, that loaner node also taught me a lot about the importance of team composition. (Hulkbuster, Psylocke and Hawkeye was/is not a good combination.. also Deadpool, KK, Wolverine was ridiculously bad (although on paper, it's only missing blue.. it's only got 3 active powers!), especially with KK specced 5/5/3..)

Completely agree!

Also getting the chance to use newer characters with their powers is fun like using a Reed with Ms Marvel to keep Imaginaut on the field really boost standard attacks made me appreciate he might actually not be that bad.

I was a bit gutted I missed the Red Hulk launch as I was on a break from gaming at the time and never received even one and haven't had chance to play with him as a loaner yet.

Quebbster

OJSP wrote:

Azoth658 wrote:

Isn't that why they give you those yellow nodes with some of the best build types in? I know seeing speedshot in action made me want to start a hawkeye.

I can see why so many people want the max level to increase on a character once you have 13 covers but with the rewards for champion levels I can see why you need to level them first.

I agree with both paragraphs.

Specifically on the first one, that loaner node also taught me a lot about the importance of team composition. (Hulkbuster, Psylocke and Hawkeye was/is not a good combination.. also Deadpool, KK, Wolverine was ridiculously bad (although on paper, it's only missing blue.. it's only got 3 active powers!), especially with KK specced 5/5/3..)

Not looking forward to this in Enemy of the state. Only covers four colors (no black, no red), and yellow only has two passive skills, so you need to decide carefully who gets to use the blue and green AP...

Crowl

Azoth658 wrote:

Isn't that why they give you those yellow nodes with some of the best build types in? I know seeing speedshot in action made me want to start a hawkeye.

I can see why so many people want the max level to increase on a character once you have 13 covers but with the rewards for champion levels I can see why you need to level them first.

The yellow nodes often have horrible team compositions and don't always have the best builds when it is a character with an arguable best either.

I agree that the max level part of a character should not be changed on a character once you have 13 covers, but allowing people to make them a base level champion and gain access to respecs should not be tied into hitting max level.