**** The Thing (Classic) ****

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  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,260 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Because of his yellow, big attack coming in? Plop in R&G in the front, let him take all the damage. When he's low enough, match yellow and he's gonna heal up a lot.

    Thing takes the full damage, makes the protect tiles (that end up being cleared away by his own green or regular play) and it's likely his yellow will not proc again because he's at lower health than his teammates.
  • Blahahah
    Blahahah Posts: 738 Critical Contributor
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    I don't personally see the point of 5 yellow, but thats just me.
    Then again I'm aiming to run team "meh tier" with Mr. Fantastic and Ant-Man, so I'll just be spitting out protect tiles anyhow and Reed will be tanking 3 colors since he can just heal. Thing is mainly there to just barf out some more special tiles and cover the red and green, to which he does so decently well.
  • Stormking3
    Stormking3 Posts: 38
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    sinnerjfl wrote:
    Because of his yellow, big attack coming in? Plop in R&G in the front, let him take all the damage. When he's low enough, match yellow and he's gonna heal up a lot.

    Thing takes the full damage, makes the protect tiles (that end up being cleared away by his own green or regular play) and it's likely his yellow will not proc again because he's at lower health than his teammates.
    Interesting. I see.
    Too bad R&G don't tank my 4* though.
  • Quebbster
    Quebbster Posts: 8,070 Chairperson of the Boards
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    My 3/5/5 Thing made the Heroic Dark Avengers event a lot easier. He worked best against Daken and others with fast attacks for moderate amounts of damage - one Chemical reaction and suddenly you are pretty much not taking damage anymore.
  • jjfyahpowah
    jjfyahpowah Posts: 81 Match Maker
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    Yellow needs reworking ASAP.

    CURRENT
    Rock Solid - Passive yellowtile.png
    (PASSIVE) The ever-lovin' blue-eyed Thing steps up to protect his friends and family. If an ally with less health than the Thing would take 913 or more damage, the Thing moves to the front and then creates 2 strength 137 Yellow Protect tiles. Dev Note: The Protect tiles are generated *after* the attack and any cascades takes place. If there is a conflict as to who is supposed to protect (such as having both Deadpool and Thing), the character with more health will be the protector.
    Level Upgrades

    Level 2: If an ally would take 913 or more damage, creates 2 strength 201 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 3: If an ally would take 822 or more damage, creates 3 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: If an ally would take 730 or more damage, creates 4 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: If an ally would take 685 or more damage, creates 5 strength 183 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Max Level
    Level 3: Jumps in at 1629 damage, creates 3 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: Jumps in at 1448 damage, creates 4 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: Jumps in at 1358 damage, creates 5 strength 361 Yellow Protect tiles.

    NEEDS TO BE:
    The ever-lovin' blue-eyed Thing steps up to protect his friends and family. If an ally takes 913 or more damage, the Thing moves to the front and then creates 2 strength 137 Yellow Protect tiles. Dev Note: The Protect tiles are generated *after* the attack and any cascades takes place. If a player has both Deadpool and Thing the character with more health will be the protector.
    Level Upgrades

    Level 2: If an ally would take 913 or more damage, creates 2 strength 201 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 3: If an ally would take 822 or more damage, creates 3 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: If an ally would take 730 or more damage, creates 4 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: If an ally would take 685 or more damage, creates 5 strength 183 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Max Level
    Level 3: Jumps in at 1629 damage, creates 3 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: Jumps in at 1448 damage, creates 4 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: Jumps in at 1358 damage, creates 5 strength 361 Yellow Protect tiles.

    WITH:
    Zero scaling on amount of damage needed to be taken for power to be activated the higher in level The Thing is. Maxes out at 1629, 1448, 1358.
  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
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    jjfyahpowah wrote:
    Yellow needs reworking ASAP.

    CURRENT
    Rock Solid - Passive yellowtile.png
    (PASSIVE) The ever-lovin' blue-eyed Thing steps up to protect his friends and family. If an ally with less health than the Thing would take 913 or more damage, the Thing moves to the front and then creates 2 strength 137 Yellow Protect tiles. Dev Note: The Protect tiles are generated *after* the attack and any cascades takes place. If there is a conflict as to who is supposed to protect (such as having both Deadpool and Thing), the character with more health will be the protector.
    Level Upgrades

    Level 2: If an ally would take 913 or more damage, creates 2 strength 201 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 3: If an ally would take 822 or more damage, creates 3 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: If an ally would take 730 or more damage, creates 4 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: If an ally would take 685 or more damage, creates 5 strength 183 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Max Level
    Level 3: Jumps in at 1629 damage, creates 3 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: Jumps in at 1448 damage, creates 4 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: Jumps in at 1358 damage, creates 5 strength 361 Yellow Protect tiles.

    NEEDS TO BE:
    The ever-lovin' blue-eyed Thing steps up to protect his friends and family. If an ally takes 913 or more damage, the Thing moves to the front and then creates 2 strength 137 Yellow Protect tiles. Dev Note: The Protect tiles are generated *after* the attack and any cascades takes place. If a player has both Deadpool and Thing the character with more health will be the protector.
    Level Upgrades

    Level 2: If an ally would take 913 or more damage, creates 2 strength 201 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 3: If an ally would take 822 or more damage, creates 3 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: If an ally would take 730 or more damage, creates 4 strength 146 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: If an ally would take 685 or more damage, creates 5 strength 183 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Max Level
    Level 3: Jumps in at 1629 damage, creates 3 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 4: Jumps in at 1448 damage, creates 4 strength 289 Yellow Protect tiles.
    Level 5: Jumps in at 1358 damage, creates 5 strength 361 Yellow Protect tiles.

    WITH:
    Zero scaling on amount of damage needed to be taken for power to be activated the higher in level The Thing is. Maxes out at 1629, 1448, 1358.


    Are you just saying that when Thing is boosted it becomes too hard to trigger the passive?
  • jjfyahpowah
    jjfyahpowah Posts: 81 Match Maker
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    Are you just saying that when Thing is boosted it becomes too hard to trigger the passive?

    No, that he should take the damage of the team no matter what, and that the shields be generated when a damage threshold is exceeded.

    This is his role within the Fantastic 4 and should be the same in game.
  • Crowl
    Crowl Posts: 1,579 Chairperson of the Boards
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    jjfyahpowah wrote:
    Are you just saying that when Thing is boosted it becomes too hard to trigger the passive?

    No, that he should take the damage of the team no matter what, and that the shields be generated when a damage threshold is exceeded.

    This is his role within the Fantastic 4 and should be the same in game.

    You probably need to rewrite your improved version to clarify that point then.
  • BlackBoltRocks
    BlackBoltRocks Posts: 1,160 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2017
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    I believe Thingy needs a buff, especially in light of the power creep.

    Let's look at his Red, It's Clobbering Time. I've compared it to the other two Red stunners in 4* land: Miles' Venom Blast and Spiderwoman's System Shock (let's only focus on damage done to the target). All numbers at lv270, 5 covers.

    Miles: 6 AP, 3274 damage, 1-turn stun (545.6666...damage/AP)
    Thing: 10 AP, 4888 damage, 2-turn stun (488.888...damage/AP)
    Spiderwoman: 14 AP, 8658 damage, 3-turn stun (618.428571 damage/AP)

    Thing clearly falls woefully short of the damage/AP ratio of the two spiders. Since he sits perfectly in the middle of those two (as in, he costs 4AP more than Miles and 4AP less than Jessica, and stuns one turn more than Miles and one turn less than Jessica), let's increase his damage ratio to be in between those two, i.e. ~582.0476 damage/AP. That would put his damage output at 5820 damage. Which is still laughable, given that Riri does 10520 for 11AP (956.36 damage/AP) and even Hulkbuster does 630 damage/AP. Still, it's somewhat mitigated by the stun...right? Regardless, this ability needs a major damage buff, to around the 6000 mark.

    Same goes for his Green, Yancy Street Special. I've compared it to the other single-target greens that do fixed damage in 4* land: Invisible Woman, Moon Knight, Riri.

    Riri: 8 AP, 5029 damage (628.625 damage/AP)
    Invisible Woman: 10 AP, 8299 damage (828.9 damage/AP)
    Moon Knight: 12 AP, 12881 damage (1073.4 damage/AP)
    Thing: 12 AP, 6100 damage (508.3 damage/AP)

    Once again, Thing's damage ratio is laughable. Sure, he removes 16 tiles, but the devs have always overvalued boardshake (just look at Xverine's X-Force). And Moon Knight's crazy damage is somewhat offset by the fact that it hits a random enemy, but almost 13k damage is nothing to sneeze at. Thing doesn't guarantee you that; indeed, on occasion, you might end up destroying useful friendly special tiles. I believe it should do somewhere in the range of 8500-9000 damage. That's slightly higher than IW for 2 more AP, but not as crazy as Moon Knight. Any subsequent cascades should be of benefit to you, rather than being a source of penalisation (This applies to War Machine and Carnage as well. Their greens should also do more damage. At least War Machine deals damage for the maximum 18 tiles he destroys, and Carnage does bonus damage for any special tile destroyed). And come on, it's The Thing. He's supposed to hit like a freight train.

    And for yellow, please make it actually do something in 1v1. Like if Thing is the last man standing, create a friendly protect tile whenever he takes a certain amount of damage. Luke Cage's The Defender is so much better than Rock Solid.
  • Starfury
    Starfury Posts: 719 Critical Contributor
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    • His champ rewards are just as good as anybody else's.
    • Together with 4* Deadpool he's a good deterrent to 4* Grocket. (not that that matters much anymore now defensive teams have been made irrelevant in PvP)
  • Rick_OShay
    Rick_OShay Posts: 765 Critical Contributor
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    I've recently been in that same situation twice, and Thing has actually become a 'thing' again with a Gambattery. But, are you going to be pulling Legendaries soon when 5* Thor enters Latest? You might want to consider champing a different 4* character that you will inevitably get to 14 covers on, during that pull.
    Anyone else of importance getting close? 
    Consider the source here though, after a champion Pun Max yesterday, I'll be champing Lockjaw in a few days..
  • DrDevilDinosaur
    DrDevilDinosaur Posts: 436 Mover and Shaker
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    It looks like I'll be getting one cover from placement in the current PvE event, and then another 2 from progression in the next, so I guess it's about time to champ him.

    At a glance, it looks like 4/4/5 might be my preferred build, although it looks like the damage on Red does jump up significantly for rank 5. What's the general consensus for this guy?

  • BlackBoltRocks
    BlackBoltRocks Posts: 1,160 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited November 2017
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    The general build is 5/3/5. At 3 Yellow, his Protect tiles are already good enough, although it does require a higher threshold to activate than compared to 5 covers. Anything less than 5 Red means you sacrifice significant damage; anything less than 5 Green means you give up damage and potentially better boardshake.

    Still, like any champion he's flexible. I'm not sure if going 5 Yellow against the omnipresent Medusa/Gamorph4 (yes I did that on purpose)/Grocket teams is feasible. I myself only champed him a couple of days ago, cos I had two covers expiring, with another two more on the way in Hulk PvE. It depends on whether you pair him up with a better Red or Green user.

    SIDE DIGRESSION-CUM-RANT: his damage/AP is seriously pathetic in 4* land. Just look at Riri's Red and Green, for instance. That's mainly why I held off championing him for so long; I think I've tossed like 5 or 6 covers for him before this. That excludes the 4 or 5 dupe Greens i got before he hit 13 covers.
  • DrDevilDinosaur
    DrDevilDinosaur Posts: 436 Mover and Shaker
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    Yeah, I haven't had a compelling reason to champ him previously and his damage output had been surpassed. I guess I'm really only planning to use him on gimmick teams where he just needs to exist, so I've got room to play around with different builds myself if I want to experiment.

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