PVP Supports: Feedback Thread

1…34689…21

Comments

  • plizard
    plizard Posts: 5 Just Dropped In

    @entrailbucket said:

    I'd be fine with removing names, it just wouldn't do the thing you want it to do. It'd make life a little more difficult for the coordinators but wouldn't come close to stopping them. It really wouldn't affect the way I play at all.

    But then you wouldn't be able to hit a player 10x in a row. Where's the fun in that?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    @plizard said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    I'd be fine with removing names, it just wouldn't do the thing you want it to do. It'd make life a little more difficult for the coordinators but wouldn't come close to stopping them. It really wouldn't affect the way I play at all.

    But then you wouldn't be able to hit a player 10x in a row. Where's the fun in that?

    I play in s2. If somebody's out and they've got points, I don't need to see their name to find them 10x in a row!

  • plizard
    plizard Posts: 5 Just Dropped In

    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

  • plizard
    plizard Posts: 5 Just Dropped In
    edited 4 July 2024, 23:00

    That's too much effort. I'm just playing to 50 wins or 1.2, whichever comes first. But I'm not above hitting the same person over and over to reach either goal.

    That said, I don't think my ability to hit someone like 5x in the span of a few minutes without the AI getting a turn thanks to supports is particularly non-toxic to the game.

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

    If you've broken MMR, dumping breaks the spell, takes you back to 'normal' matchmaking. What's the fun in that?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

    If you've broken MMR, dumping breaks the spell, takes you back to 'normal' matchmaking. What's the fun in that?

    The fun is in smiting one's enemies. What other reason is there to play a Player vs Player game?

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

    If you've broken MMR, dumping breaks the spell, takes you back to 'normal' matchmaking. What's the fun in that?

    The fun is in smiting one's enemies. What other reason is there to play a Player vs Player game?

    Using the PvP mode in a roster management game to farm covers. Who cares about the other names on a screen? (whoops, wasn't supposed to say that part out loud, danggit.)

  • WilliamK1983
    WilliamK1983 Posts: 1,015 Chairperson of the Boards

    @DAZ0273 said:

    @LHammer said:

    @slidecage said:
    You don't have to memorize anything. Just pick your team and play

    Yeah, you kind of do because picking your team and playing what previously would have been a manageable fight can now result in a massacre because you didn't understand what happens when Yelena has Uncle Ben's Rice equipped on a team with Star Brand.

    Uncle Ben's rice gives you +2 spicy when applied to Mexicans but gets a 14% multiplier to any team equipped with it where at least one character is from Uranus.

    Just Ben's. It's how racism was solved, remember? 🙄

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

    If you've broken MMR, dumping breaks the spell, takes you back to 'normal' matchmaking. What's the fun in that?

    The fun is in smiting one's enemies. What other reason is there to play a Player vs Player game?

    Using the PvP mode in a roster management game to farm covers. Who cares about the other names on a screen? (whoops, wasn't supposed to say that part out loud, danggit.)

    I've never understood MPQ roster management as a goal for its own sake. MPQ covers, supports, boosts, tokens etc, are utilitarian objects whose only use is smashing other people (or, I guess, the AI in PvE).

    It'd be like collecting cars you never drive, or sealed video games or toys you never open -- except in this case your MPQ roster has zero resale value so it's a terrible investment.

    Roster management is only a means to an end, and the end is beating other people with your roster. It doesn't make sense for it to be the end...why not play a harem game or a clicker?

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @plizard said:
    But what if you want to keep hitting that same person until they are only worth 5 points out of spite? Asking for a friend

    Well, if they're only worth 5 points to you, then you have too many points. Hitting someone for 5 points is just gifting them a good retal -- not very spiteful.

    Instead you should dump 500 or so, so you can start hitting them for 40 or 50 again.

    If you've broken MMR, dumping breaks the spell, takes you back to 'normal' matchmaking. What's the fun in that?

    The fun is in smiting one's enemies. What other reason is there to play a Player vs Player game?

    Using the PvP mode in a roster management game to farm covers. Who cares about the other names on a screen? (whoops, wasn't supposed to say that part out loud, danggit.)

    I've never understood MPQ roster management as a goal for its own sake. MPQ covers, supports, boosts, tokens etc, are utilitarian objects whose only use is smashing other people (or, I guess, the AI in PvE).

    It'd be like collecting cars you never drive, or sealed video games or toys you never open -- except in this case your MPQ roster has zero resale value so it's a terrible investment.

    Roster management is only a means to an end, and the end is beating other people with your roster. It doesn't make sense for it to be the end...why not play a harem game or a clicker?

    1. Faux productivity.
    2. You've recycled this post many times over the years; have a macro for it?
    3. "Harem game"? This isn't a ... ? Oh, hell. Some harems wear more spandex than others! ;)
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,329 Chairperson of the Boards

    So I guess supports can stop insta win powers from working as I learned tonight. Decided to just cheese a dual 672 jugg spidey team with purple ap boosts and some purple ap supports and just drop whales on them. I got enough purple ap, fired mega whales and to my surprise a support activated (I think it was leap frog) and instead of ending the match it left the enemy team still alive, though close enough to dead the I was able to finish them off easily enough.

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @BriMan2222 said:
    So I guess supports can stop insta win powers from working as I learned tonight. Decided to just cheese a dual 672 jugg spidey team with purple ap boosts and some purple ap supports and just drop whales on them. I got enough purple ap, fired mega whales and to my surprise a support activated (I think it was leap frog) and instead of ending the match it left the enemy team still alive, though close enough to dead the I was able to finish them off easily enough.

    If the surviving character went invisible, with an invisibility tile, it was a Leapfrog support, 3* or higher. You put it on a key character so they can survive 1st-turn kills and use their AP.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    @AlexR we're in agreement. You described roster management in service of gameplay, which is exactly what I do, and what I understand.

    @JoeHandle "faux productivity" is basically the MO of clicker games, which is why I suggest them to people who enjoy that aspect. I don't want MPQ to become that to serve those players, though. Also no, I write the same post every time! (and probably will keep doing it forever!)

    Can we talk about supports in PvP again?

  • Godzillafan67
    Godzillafan67 Posts: 616 Critical Contributor

    I waited until I had participated in a few PvP events before tossing my two cents to the Witcher. I play PvP for progression awards, node awards, and Top 100 placement awards. The TLDR is that I'm digging them. 👍

    At the start, I hated supports in PvP. I, like many others, only had knowledge on a few of them and was often surprised by the board behaving oddly. In the first PvP, I lost more matches than I'm used to and had to stop playing when I ran out of health packs. Since then, I've learned more about supports -- only a handful are common and watching board/character behaviors are excellent indicators that research is needed. It would be a good feature if we could click on both the character and the support on the matching screen so that we can view underlying details before pressing FIGHT. Additionally, we need to be able to see details on the supports and to whom they're attached during the match as well.

    I'm using BRB & Polaris more now since they're getting true heals from their supports. Ironically, I rarely used MThor/Shang previously because the combo was too unpredictable for me; I pretty much always paired Shang with Valk or Agent May. Now, however, their supports give me much better control and continued playability, which means that they've now become a regular go-to team for me.

    Final thoughts: Keep supports in PvP; make it easier to get supports and power them up; and update the supports' UI with the myriad of suggestions already presented.

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:
    @AlexR we're in agreement. You described roster management in service of gameplay, which is exactly what I do, and what I understand.

    @JoeHandle "faux productivity" is basically the MO of clicker games, which is why I suggest them to people who enjoy that aspect. I don't want MPQ to become that to serve those players, though. Also no, I write the same post every time! (and probably will keep doing it forever!)

    Can we talk about supports in PvP again?

    If we have to ... say something about supports :D

    No interest in 'clicker' games. MPQ is my procrastination of choice. The super-repetitive "fights' just pass the time.

  • captainheath
    captainheath Posts: 257 Mover and Shaker

    I wish the Simulator would have supports enabled also. It seems strange that it hasn't.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,000 Chairperson of the Boards

    So far the responses are still fitting the same pattern -- players who are able to use supports to get an advantage (because theirs are optimized and their opponents aren't) are in favor of the change.

    Players facing peers (ie those who aren't consistently punching down) hate it.

    A question for those who are enjoying this: how many times have you gotten wrecked by the AI due to free AP/free power casts/free cascades from supports?

Categories