PVP Supports: Feedback Thread

S0kun
S0kun ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 704 Critical Contributor
in MPQ General Discussion

Now that we've had the weekend to sink our teeth into the inaugural PVP Supports enabled Season, let's start a thread dedicated to player feedback to ensure that we're able to make adjustments to the system that makes it enjoyable for everyone.

What's great? What's broken? What's borked? General thoughts?

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Comments

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    Had a ball in the 3Kaine event. Wheeeee.

    A point does not trend define. Should be fine tho.

  • WhiteBomber
    WhiteBomber Posts: 399 Mover and Shaker

    Definitely still a bit early to tell, but the increase in diversity and strategy has been overwhelmingly positive for me (but I like running fun teams, not just burning through it).

    I'm sure this is already a thing, but if this stays, you'll probably want more reliable ways for people to get supports as well as better ways to engage players with them. Most non competitive players I know don't know much about them and they sure don't spend the time to lab them to determine what works best.

    I personally would love to see them added to Simulator since that is the one place you can actually be the most strategic and placement matters less. Either way, thank you for the breathe of fresh air in PVP, once we remove health packs we won't even need a practice mode!

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,955 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 1 July 2024, 21:09

    I guess I'd ask what you want the game to be. It appears that the consensus so far is that players just want to get PvP over with as fast as possible -- that this change would be good if it only applied to offense, so they could win 25 fights in a minute and a half and not have to bother with playing the game.

    If you're interested in listening to players who want to "get it over with" rather than enjoying interesting gameplay, why not go all the way and make PvP autowin? They'd love it!

    I think if players want to autowin on offense with supports, I should be able to construct a team that autowins on defense too.

    The first event was a hodgepodge of all different stuff. Players haven't figured out how to optimize this, so the strategy is still fun. In a month or two everything will be solved and we'll see the same teams every event with the same supports.

    I still think this whole thing is a terrible idea. Speeding up an already-fast game is not necessary at all. It reduces diversity and locks out strong but slower characters. I'd prefer the free AP supports be removed from PvE as well.

  • TheXMan
    TheXMan Posts: 188 Tile Toppler

    @entrailbucket said:
    I guess I'd ask what you want the game to be. It appears that the consensus so far is that players just want to get PvP over with as fast as possible -- that this change would be good if it only applied to offense, so they could win 25 fights in a minute and a half and not have to bother with playing the game.

    If you're interested in listening to players who want to "get it over with" rather than enjoying interesting gameplay, why not go all the way and make PvP autowin? They'd love it!

    I think if players want to autowin on offense with supports, I should be able to construct a team that autowins on defense too.

    The first event was a hodgepodge of all different stuff. Players haven't figured out how to optimize this, so the strategy is still fun. In a month or two everything will be solved and we'll see the same teams every event with the same supports.

    I still think this whole thing is a terrible idea. Speeding up an already-fast game is not necessary at all. It reduces diversity and locks out strong but slower characters. I'd prefer the free AP supports be removed from PvE as well.

    Do you use boosts? Or should those also be turned off?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,955 Chairperson of the Boards

    @TheXMan said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    I guess I'd ask what you want the game to be. It appears that the consensus so far is that players just want to get PvP over with as fast as possible -- that this change would be good if it only applied to offense, so they could win 25 fights in a minute and a half and not have to bother with playing the game.

    If you're interested in listening to players who want to "get it over with" rather than enjoying interesting gameplay, why not go all the way and make PvP autowin? They'd love it!

    I think if players want to autowin on offense with supports, I should be able to construct a team that autowins on defense too.

    The first event was a hodgepodge of all different stuff. Players haven't figured out how to optimize this, so the strategy is still fun. In a month or two everything will be solved and we'll see the same teams every event with the same supports.

    I still think this whole thing is a terrible idea. Speeding up an already-fast game is not necessary at all. It reduces diversity and locks out strong but slower characters. I'd prefer the free AP supports be removed from PvE as well.

    Do you use boosts? Or should those also be turned off?

    Do you think they should be increased to +6ap per color?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,955 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Tony_Foot said:
    Pve is more PvP than the actual PvP. MPQ PvP is like when those clowns on Xbox all gather together to take it in turns killing each other for some meaningless achievement rather than play the game.

    Yes I want it over quickly because I only tolerate it for rewards.

    Then maybe they should focus on making it fun, rather than making it easy to ignore/skip/autowin?

  • TheXMan
    TheXMan Posts: 188 Tile Toppler

    @entrailbucket said:

    @TheXMan said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    I guess I'd ask what you want the game to be. It appears that the consensus so far is that players just want to get PvP over with as fast as possible -- that this change would be good if it only applied to offense, so they could win 25 fights in a minute and a half and not have to bother with playing the game.

    If you're interested in listening to players who want to "get it over with" rather than enjoying interesting gameplay, why not go all the way and make PvP autowin? They'd love it!

    I think if players want to autowin on offense with supports, I should be able to construct a team that autowins on defense too.

    The first event was a hodgepodge of all different stuff. Players haven't figured out how to optimize this, so the strategy is still fun. In a month or two everything will be solved and we'll see the same teams every event with the same supports.

    I still think this whole thing is a terrible idea. Speeding up an already-fast game is not necessary at all. It reduces diversity and locks out strong but slower characters. I'd prefer the free AP supports be removed from PvE as well.

    Do you use boosts? Or should those also be turned off?

    Do you think they should be increased to +6ap per color?

    Nope, I rarely use them and would actually be ok with them off. But I am curious if you think those are ok on offense only but not supports?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,955 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 2 July 2024, 00:17

    @TheXMan said:

    @entrailbucket said:

    @TheXMan said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    I guess I'd ask what you want the game to be. It appears that the consensus so far is that players just want to get PvP over with as fast as possible -- that this change would be good if it only applied to offense, so they could win 25 fights in a minute and a half and not have to bother with playing the game.

    If you're interested in listening to players who want to "get it over with" rather than enjoying interesting gameplay, why not go all the way and make PvP autowin? They'd love it!

    I think if players want to autowin on offense with supports, I should be able to construct a team that autowins on defense too.

    The first event was a hodgepodge of all different stuff. Players haven't figured out how to optimize this, so the strategy is still fun. In a month or two everything will be solved and we'll see the same teams every event with the same supports.

    I still think this whole thing is a terrible idea. Speeding up an already-fast game is not necessary at all. It reduces diversity and locks out strong but slower characters. I'd prefer the free AP supports be removed from PvE as well.

    Do you use boosts? Or should those also be turned off?

    Do you think they should be increased to +6ap per color?

    Nope, I rarely use them and would actually be ok with them off. But I am curious if you think those are ok on offense only but not supports?

    Haha, sorry! I thought you were trying to "gotcha!" me!

    I very very rarely use boosts, never in PvE and in PvP only sometimes, usually to fight one particular player who runs 672/672/672 almost every event. I'd be ok with removing them.

    I do think character powers are balanced now with boosts in mind, though. It's why they (mostly) got rid of 2-3AP powers after limiting boosts to two of each type.

    I don't understand why they allow supports that basically do the same thing, but I guess this dev team hasn't learned the lessons about cheap powers yet (witness Spidey's old 2AP stun or Mags' 2AP boardshake).

  • fnedude
    fnedude Posts: 388 Mover and Shaker

    One observation, FantastiCar made the match MUCHHHH longer than w/o Supports. Such a Pain in the Butt-icts (PITA).

    When speed is essential with snipers or other opponents fighting for points, have an enemy support slow you down is bogus, because you can't do anything to speed it up, and it all depends on if it does/does not activate to lengthen your battle. Which means you can be hit more, loose more points, and rank/position in PVP.

    it would suck if Supports in PVP add another way to screw your opponent, "I'll use FantastiCar to prolong the fight..." is a terrible defensive tactic

  • DarthDeVo
    DarthDeVo Posts: 2,178 Chairperson of the Boards

    Can't remember the last time I logged in, but I'm doing it now to say that Supports in PvP suuuuuuuucccccckkkkkkkksssssss. So many matches, enemy 1* Spidey (at 672, of course) was able to fire his purple each turn for the first 2-3 turns, and sometimes also got a freebie power fire because of a Power Stone Support.

    Did it make some of my matches go faster? Of course, but I would say I had more unnecessary losses than easier wins. And of course, this also makes the snipers/griefers faster as well. That was already the worst part of PvP, and you just made their job easier.

    Also heard from others that some teams with much smaller comparative rosters were able to punch way above their weight because they found some character/Support combos that allowed them to do so. More power to them for figuring that out, I guess, but if I were a big spender who did so to gain an advantage in PvP and found myself taking cheap shots from broken/OP teams, I may find myself wondering what the point of spending all that money would be.

    I sense a lot of time and resources was put into adding Supports in PvP, so this feels like useless screaming into the void. I don't imagine they'll just go away completely. But for what it's worth: Thanks, I hate it.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,955 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 2 July 2024, 13:44

    @The_Boogie said:

    @Tony_Foot said:
    Pve is more PvP than the actual PvP.

    OMG preach - This is the truth! To the majority of the most vocal and willing to spend MPQ players, Story mode is where the real competition exists in the game, to the point where Player A will ask their alliance mates to hit Player B in PvP during their closing hits of PvE so the pop-ups in game will screw up Player B’s chances of finishing optimally.

    Versus mode is a place where you can (mostly) only succeed at the highest levels if you cooperate with a large group of like minded people.

    For those of us who embrace the “Versus” element of it…we love supports in PvP. Allows us to easier protect the small piece of turf in MPQ where we put our flag in the ground.

    Someone in another thread suggested breaking coordination by hiding player names. That wouldn't work -- there are a bunch of ways to get around it.

    The nuclear bomb that (basically) stops coordination is "disable the skip button while you're shielded." I don't think they'd do it, but it's a pretty easy change.

    Edit: ooof, dumb idea. Don't listen to me.

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