PVP Supports: Feedback Thread

WhiteBomber

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
Sim is supposed to be the flat, no boost zone, right? I assume that extends thematically to supports

...they probably just forgot about sim.

That was actually kinda funny.

I don't have any issues with any of the supports. I can see how leapfrog is better than a lot of the others, but there are also multiple ways around it. I personally never skip because of supports, I'm not at 550 yet though, maybe something there gets significantly worse.

The need for speed makes people not want to have to continually adapt to change, swapping kits and retaining that much info is time consuming, but I'm lovin it playing different teams. SIM really is only that 1 single team though, if they add supports I would have more tools to easier stop that 1 team.

entrailbucket

@WhiteBomber said:

@entrailbucket said:

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
Sim is supposed to be the flat, no boost zone, right? I assume that extends thematically to supports

...they probably just forgot about sim.

That was actually kinda funny.

I don't have any issues with any of the supports. I can see how leapfrog is better than a lot of the others, but there are also multiple ways around it. I personally never skip because of supports, I'm not at 550 yet though, maybe something there gets significantly worse.

The need for speed makes people not want to have to continually adapt to change, swapping kits and retaining that much info is time consuming, but I'm lovin it playing different teams. SIM really is only that 1 single team though, if they add supports I would have more tools to easier stop that 1 team.

I don't like supports in PvP, and probably never will, but I've gotten used to it. I've never skipped anybody based on team comp or supports anyway, and I've figured out how to deal with the supports that players use. The rest aren't relevant so there's no point learning them.

I'd like to see more good options so that we don't all have to use the same 7 or 8 supports (or whatever the actual number is).

Here's what I was after with the rants: if you HATE this, or you've quit because of it, or you've got an idea that'll fix the whole thing...don't hold your breath. Decide whether you can live with it like it is (maybe we'll get some buffs to the bad supports eventually), but if you're waiting on some massive overhaul, I really really doubt we'll ever see that.

Bubba3210

I love supports in pvp and I play more than I ever have as a result.

bluewolf

I don't mind Supports right now, to be clear. I like them fairly well because I'm going for 25 wins most of the time and calling it good, and it's faster.

I kind of doubt the various defense troll supports will move to ubiquity like the meta teams do each week, because they're not always fun or reliable. However, I could be wrong there.

I do wish the devs were providing some feedback or data about what they've seen and were trying occasional tweaks to even adjust, as I said before, which ones are available in different PVPs. So far we saw some PVPs where they were accidentally (maybe just 1? 2?) disabled, which isn't really the same thing. An on/off switch isn't really the kind of adjustment tool that should be used.

However.....I do not think there is much spare capacity to do these kinds of things. I'm not even sure how easy it is to create limited pools of supports for different PVPs. Maybe the kinds of things they talked about are hard to execute, or at minimum too time consuming to spend resources on. (I'd rather they focused on the new engine if that's a choice that is being made.)

I think the only appropriate expectation, as already said, is that they keep doing it like this for quite a while.

Pylgrim

Further feedback: I used to play more SIM than PVP events. I only have a comparative few 5* (and most of them old), so in PVP events, I'm usually fighting 550+ level teams with 450 level teams. At least in SIM, it's all 450-500 in my matchmaking. However, with supports, now I'having a much easier time in PVP against those 550+ teams, while in comparison, SIM feels like an utter slog.

I'd much rather now have a loss that came in 1-2 turns due to supports (and some wins like that) than the 5-10 turn losses I get in SIM when the board refuses to give me the colours I need, while the opponent cascades every turn. Much less frustrating.

ThaRoadWarrior

The other one I see a lot (on boosted juggernaut) is the implanted bomb one. Forgot about that one.

KGB

@bluewolf said:
I do wish the devs were providing some feedback or data about what they've seen and were trying occasional tweaks to even adjust, as I said before, which ones are available in different PVPs. So far we saw some PVPs where they were accidentally (maybe just 1? 2?) disabled, which isn't really the same thing. An on/off switch isn't really the kind of adjustment tool that should be used.

I suspect we are not getting data on purpose. The obvious reason being that players would immediately try and manipulate the data in order to prove whatever outcome they desired they desired (supports not OK in PvP, supports OK in PvP, a need for rotating list of supports, some supports need Nerf, some supports need boost etc).

KGB

entrailbucket

@KGB said:

@bluewolf said:
I do wish the devs were providing some feedback or data about what they've seen and were trying occasional tweaks to even adjust, as I said before, which ones are available in different PVPs. So far we saw some PVPs where they were accidentally (maybe just 1? 2?) disabled, which isn't really the same thing. An on/off switch isn't really the kind of adjustment tool that should be used.

I suspect we are not getting data on purpose. The obvious reason being that players would immediately try and manipulate the data in order to prove whatever outcome they desired they desired (supports not OK in PvP, supports OK in PvP, a need for rotating list of supports, some supports need Nerf, some supports need boost etc).

KGB

I used to think this too (that they don't share data with us because everybody would use it to beat on them) but I think I changed my mind. I've asked a couple of questions like this in the Q&As (that I thought they'd never touch) and they've answered them. They've answered them from others too.

Currently, I think that they think nobody cares about this stuff -- and if the stats they've given about average rosters and playstyles are correct, maybe they're right! Most MPQ players are very casual.

BriMan2222

@ThaRoadWarrior said:
The other one I see a lot (on boosted juggernaut) is the implanted bomb one. Forgot about that one.

Yeah, that one's great. One match i managed to one shot a 672 full health juggernaut with nearly 700k hp with my juggernauts red thanks to the bombs boost

ThaRoadWarrior

I managed to stun an enemy juggernaut for 3 turns, expecting him to die for not making a move or firing a power in that amount of turns, and he did not. It was delightful.

BriMan2222

@Tony_Foot said:

@Pylgrim said:
Further feedback: I used to play more SIM than PVP events. I only have a comparative few 5* (and most of them old), so in PVP events, I'm usually fighting 550+ level teams with 450 level teams. At least in SIM, it's all 450-500 in my matchmaking. However, with supports, now I'having a much easier time in PVP against those 550+ teams, while in comparison, SIM feels like an utter slog.

I'd much rather now have a loss that came in 1-2 turns due to supports (and some wins like that) than the 5-10 turn losses I get in SIM when the board refuses to give me the colours I need, while the opponent cascades every turn. Much less frustrating.

I’m exactly the same, I’ve stopped in sim. I now just try and fail to play 1 match per day to boost my PvP score a bit but I’ve also gone the full season without touching it. I wish it was just a tryout zone with no affect on season score. It’s so utterly boring playing the same team over and over. I’d play it if they introduced supports but only until I’d worked out my best team and then they would be no variety again.

If you're problem with sim is hitting the wall of OR, chasm, 3may teams try using Wanda, polaris, and goose against them. Works great for me, make sure to have goose in the middle so they start off making matches against her and making more strike tiles.

Pantera236

@BriMan2222 said:

@Tony_Foot said:

@Pylgrim said:
Further feedback: I used to play more SIM than PVP events. I only have a comparative few 5* (and most of them old), so in PVP events, I'm usually fighting 550+ level teams with 450 level teams. At least in SIM, it's all 450-500 in my matchmaking. However, with supports, now I'having a much easier time in PVP against those 550+ teams, while in comparison, SIM feels like an utter slog.

I'd much rather now have a loss that came in 1-2 turns due to supports (and some wins like that) than the 5-10 turn losses I get in SIM when the board refuses to give me the colours I need, while the opponent cascades every turn. Much less frustrating.

I’m exactly the same, I’ve stopped in sim. I now just try and fail to play 1 match per day to boost my PvP score a bit but I’ve also gone the full season without touching it. I wish it was just a tryout zone with no affect on season score. It’s so utterly boring playing the same team over and over. I’d play it if they introduced supports but only until I’d worked out my best team and then they would be no variety again.

If you're problem with sim is hitting the wall of OR, chasm, 3may teams try using Wanda, polaris, and goose against them. Works great for me, make sure to have goose in the middle so they start off making matches against her and making more strike tiles.

Instead of Wanda you could do Electro for not only damage mitigation but also yellow generation for either her's or Goose's yellow. Kittie/ascended Nico would be decent. Apoc would give you not only damage boost but that 1st turn stun wouldn't work on him with Polaris being there.

ThaRoadWarrior

@Pantera236 said:

@BriMan2222 said:

@Tony_Foot said:

@Pylgrim said:
Further feedback: I used to play more SIM than PVP events. I only have a comparative few 5* (and most of them old), so in PVP events, I'm usually fighting 550+ level teams with 450 level teams. At least in SIM, it's all 450-500 in my matchmaking. However, with supports, now I'having a much easier time in PVP against those 550+ teams, while in comparison, SIM feels like an utter slog.

I'd much rather now have a loss that came in 1-2 turns due to supports (and some wins like that) than the 5-10 turn losses I get in SIM when the board refuses to give me the colours I need, while the opponent cascades every turn. Much less frustrating.

I’m exactly the same, I’ve stopped in sim. I now just try and fail to play 1 match per day to boost my PvP score a bit but I’ve also gone the full season without touching it. I wish it was just a tryout zone with no affect on season score. It’s so utterly boring playing the same team over and over. I’d play it if they introduced supports but only until I’d worked out my best team and then they would be no variety again.

If you're problem with sim is hitting the wall of OR, chasm, 3may teams try using Wanda, polaris, and goose against them. Works great for me, make sure to have goose in the middle so they start off making matches against her and making more strike tiles.

Instead of Wanda you could do Electro for not only damage mitigation but also yellow generation for either her's or Goose's yellow. Kittie/ascended Nico would be decent. Apoc would give you not only damage boost but that 1st turn stun wouldn't work on him with Polaris being there.

I continue to look for a good way to maximize Deadliest Woman using Polaris. I haven't spent much time with Goose, but it could be that the board would flood fast enough to work with that squad as well.

Pantera236

@ThaRoadWarrior said:

@Pantera236 said:

@BriMan2222 said:

@Tony_Foot said:

@Pylgrim said:
Further feedback: I used to play more SIM than PVP events. I only have a comparative few 5* (and most of them old), so in PVP events, I'm usually fighting 550+ level teams with 450 level teams. At least in SIM, it's all 450-500 in my matchmaking. However, with supports, now I'having a much easier time in PVP against those 550+ teams, while in comparison, SIM feels like an utter slog.

I'd much rather now have a loss that came in 1-2 turns due to supports (and some wins like that) than the 5-10 turn losses I get in SIM when the board refuses to give me the colours I need, while the opponent cascades every turn. Much less frustrating.

I’m exactly the same, I’ve stopped in sim. I now just try and fail to play 1 match per day to boost my PvP score a bit but I’ve also gone the full season without touching it. I wish it was just a tryout zone with no affect on season score. It’s so utterly boring playing the same team over and over. I’d play it if they introduced supports but only until I’d worked out my best team and then they would be no variety again.

If you're problem with sim is hitting the wall of OR, chasm, 3may teams try using Wanda, polaris, and goose against them. Works great for me, make sure to have goose in the middle so they start off making matches against her and making more strike tiles.

Instead of Wanda you could do Electro for not only damage mitigation but also yellow generation for either her's or Goose's yellow. Kittie/ascended Nico would be decent. Apoc would give you not only damage boost but that 1st turn stun wouldn't work on him with Polaris being there.

I continue to look for a good way to maximize Deadliest Woman using Polaris. I haven't spent much time with Goose, but it could be that the board would flood fast enough to work with that squad as well.

Would depend on how the power treats void and web tiles. Both are neutral so might work.

ThaRoadWarrior

Not sure if it’s support related, but I just had immortal hulk perma-die with an airborne vulture against a bolt/reptil/mThor that had a fantasticar, Eros arrow, and quantum realm equipped for seemingly no reason.

CHRISJN

I am in favor of supports. I hope devs will include them in Simulator PVP too.
I also play 50 wins every PVP and just a bonus if a made it in top 25 or lucky top 10. In terms of PVE is made the game faster for clears and grinds.

MegaBee

I see a team in the 5-star Agatha PvP with Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Omnipotence City equipped. No way am I fighting that!

WhiteBomber

@MegaBee said:
I see a team in the 5-star Agatha PvP with Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Omnipotence City equipped. No way am I fighting that!

Who are the characters they are on? Could still be an easy win.

MegaBee

@WhiteBomber said:

@MegaBee said:
I see a team in the 5-star Agatha PvP with Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Omnipotence City equipped. No way am I fighting that!

Who are the characters they are on? Could still be an easy win.

Shang-Chi and MThor.

entrailbucket

@MegaBee said:
I see a team in the 5-star Agatha PvP with Fantasticar, Leapfrog and Omnipotence City equipped. No way am I fighting that!

I'd like to find a target that didn't have that set of supports equipped.