Ascended Winners and Losers

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  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor
    edited 16 November 2024, 15:37

    @entrailbucket said:

    @WhiteBomber said:
    Ugh, I just realized he's also 52 levels in and still that weak. @entrailbucket make him better please.

    Remember [1]he got nerfed pretty hard, and I believe** [2]it was pre BCS** -- [3]I don't think he ever did any damage to speak of, but he basically had the Bishop passive when paired with Hawkeye.

    I wouldn't be surprised if he got revisited at some point. [4]BCS seem[s] to be undoing some of the more punitive Demiurge nerfs.

    1. Yes, yes he did. :( Was one of the few chars I went all-in on during my first ~8yrs of play, becasue I was a Cap guy from way back, and it was an exciting design and great movie reference.

    2. Yes, yes, it was. Clipped him hard just a few months after his Sept 2019 release.

    3. Now this one got me wondering. How would Worthy Cap 1.0 (potentially) scale at 450 ... 550 ... 672? Watch this space, I have it laid out but need to get scaling ratios at home this evening. He had an all-too brief moment in the sun, and, at least in my context at the time ... 5yrs ago in 4* / low 5* land, Worthy Cap was laying waste, slagging fools like crazy. Paired with today's options for creating charged tiles and boosting dmg numbers ... would be nuts.

    4. Yes they are, slowly tuning up the dustiest, most neglected chars, which are often those gutted by the prev administration. Here's hoping for Hammer Cap!

    And here we go, taking the lvl 270 numbers from Worthy Cap 1.0, and applying typical scaling ratios up to lvls 370, 450, 550, and 672. Bear in mind this was before power creep started doubling all the numbers in the 5★ tier!

    Ofc, this makes a big assumption, that no other changes would have been applied to Wothy Cap 1.0's ascended version. For instance, Worthy Cap 1.0 blue dealt a blow for every charged tile, up to 6 tiles. Worthy Cap 2.0, and 2.0's ascended version, both do damage per tile, up to 9 tiles ... but less dmg per tile.

  • WhiteBomber
    WhiteBomber Posts: 399 Mover and Shaker

    @entrailbucket How did she do on defense?

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    @WhiteBomber said:
    @entrailbucket How did she do on defense?

    A handful of wins! Most likely from folks who didn't remember what she did.

    Roughly the same number of losses to m'Thor teams.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    Second event in a row of absolute Mantis dominance.

    Note that her passive fires when you match or destroy any enemy special tile, which is pretty fantastic with 5* Namor blowing up half the board on both his abilities. Against Rocket teams, I ran a +6 green support, blasted the board turn 0, and ended up with 3-5 Mantis CDs.

    She's really, really good. I think she belongs on the "guys you should ascend quickly" list.

    I might try something like Mantis/Prowler unboosted and see if that actually works -- I bet it does.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,470 Chairperson of the Boards

    Try one or the other of the carnage’s maybe too; and/or EB venom

  • dramatist
    dramatist Posts: 226 Tile Toppler

    I am not sure this thread is the place to ask this; but… are there any characters that once they are ascended give any shard or cover rewards or do they all just give iso, cp, hp and tokens?

    I’m trying to figure out when to ascend characters in the future.

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,470 Chairperson of the Boards

    3* Doctor Doom ascended to 4* is the only one I am aware of.

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @dramatist said:
    I am not sure this thread is the place to ask this; but… are there any characters that once they are ascended give any shard or cover rewards or do they all just give iso, cp, hp and tokens?

    I’m trying to figure out when to ascend characters in the future.

    ALL ascended chars pay out "nonfeeder" rewards ... with a few exceptions ....

    When a 4★ feeder is updated to feeding a new characters (or characters), then the champ rewards paid out by ascended 4★>5★ copies, for level 450 to 475, are changed for 1 weeks after the update, to retroactively pay out covers and shards for the 5★ character the 4★ character now feeds. (I'm sure this is perfectly clear ....)

    For whatever reason, probably a dev error that hasn't been fixed yet ... 3★ > 4★ Doom still feeds.

    As far as ascended characters "just" giving iso, cp, hp, and tokens ... is that a complaint?

  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,470 Chairperson of the Boards

    If I’m mechanically indifferent to the character, I’ll just prioritize whoever has the most saved covers waiting to unlock usually.

  • dramatist
    dramatist Posts: 226 Tile Toppler

    @JoeHandle said:

    As far as ascended characters "just" giving iso, cp, hp, and tokens ... is that a complaint?

    Not a complaint. I’m just planning more now than when ascension started. At first I ascended many that were eligible. Now that I’ve ascended many usable 4*s I’ll probably max/max ascend the meh characters from now on.

    When I ascend a 2* to a 4* I’ll ascend as soon as the second 3* gets championed and not wait to max max.

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor
    edited 23 November 2024, 18:02

    @dramatist said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    As far as ascended characters "just" giving iso, cp, hp, and tokens ... is that a complaint?

    Not a complaint. I’m just planning more now than when ascension started. At first I ascended many that were eligible. Now that I’ve ascended many usable 4*s I’ll probably max/max ascend the meh characters from now on.

    When I ascend a 2* to a 4* I’ll ascend as soon as the second 3* gets championed and not wait to max max.

    Cool ... I asked if that was a complaint because I often see posters overvaluing feeder rewards. The first time building a character ... or an entire tier ... feeding is very helpful. But the 2nd time building a character ... or 3rd .... 4th ... 5th ... I'll almost always want the tokens / CP more, for general roster development. Pareto principle (80%) or Sturgeon's Law (90%) of everything sucks, I'll take a chance at pulling something else.

    Max/max'ing 4★s is the way to go. It doesn't take any longer to get to 550 that way, and pays you more in the process. The tradeoff is shifting into 5★ performance later rather than sooner. In most cases ... big whoop. Yeah, there are meta exceptions, but that's just it, those are exceptions!

    Also yes, max+min those 1s and 2s through the lower tiers. You can be spending those covers for 4★ and 5★ rewards, why 'waste' them in exchange for 2★ and 3★ rewards instead? Get them to 4★ as quickly as possible.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    I can't find it now, but I was talking with someone about 2* Cap, and they had a guess at what the numbers for 3->5 Cap would look like (2* Cap is pretty bad -- high AP costs but relatively low damage).

    Well, I ascended 3* Cap just now, and uh...

    3* Cap (base 450, boosted to 569)

    2* Cap (base 550, boosted to 672)

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    Huh. What did they do here?

    3* Cap (same level as above)

    2* Cap

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:
    I can't find it now, but I was talking with someone about 2* Cap, and they had a guess at what the numbers for 3->5 Cap would look like (2* Cap is pretty bad -- high AP costs but relatively low damage).

    Well, I ascended 3* Cap just now, and uh...

    I have mentioned a times that 2Cap would be my first 2>5, he's been way ahead since ascension went live. Now only 32 covers away from max+max'ing him up to 5★ ... **** or not he was/is going to be my trophy :D

    And fitting ... I remember playing PvE all those years ago with OBW, 2Cap, and 3Falcon, before having 3Cap up to speed. 10.5yrs ago ...

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    I can't find it now, but I was talking with someone about 2* Cap, and they had a guess at what the numbers for 3->5 Cap would look like (2* Cap is pretty bad -- high AP costs but relatively low damage).

    Well, I ascended 3* Cap just now, and uh...

    I have mentioned a times that 2Cap would be my first 2>5, he's been way ahead since ascension went live. Now only 32 covers away from max+max'ing him up to 5★ ... **** or not he was/is going to be my trophy :D

    And fitting ... I remember playing PvE all those years ago with OBW, 2Cap, and 3Falcon, before having 3Cap up to speed. 10.5yrs ago ...

    I don't think 3->5 Cap is actually any good either, but it's extremely weird that he SO completely trashes 2* Cap. Given scaling, the yellow numbers are probably equal, but why would they give the 3* that much more damage on red?

  • JoeHandle
    JoeHandle Posts: 535 Critical Contributor

    @entrailbucket said:

    @JoeHandle said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    I can't find it now, but I was talking with someone about 2* Cap, and they had a guess at what the numbers for 3->5 Cap would look like (2* Cap is pretty bad -- high AP costs but relatively low damage).

    Well, I ascended 3* Cap just now, and uh...

    I have mentioned a times that 2Cap would be my first 2>5, he's been way ahead since ascension went live. Now only 32 covers away from max+max'ing him up to 5★ ... **** or not he was/is going to be my trophy :D

    And fitting ... I remember playing PvE all those years ago with OBW, 2Cap, and 3Falcon, before having 3Cap up to speed. 10.5yrs ago ...

    I don't think 3->5 Cap is actually any good either, but it's extremely weird that he SO completely trashes 2* Cap. Given scaling, the yellow numbers are probably equal, but why would they give the 3* that much more damage on red?

    ... because 2Cap red has always been a wet noodle?

    I have 2Cap and 3Cap both in the mid 350s right now, and 3Cap red dmg is nigh triple that of 2Cap ... 12.4K compared to 4.3K.

    I'm surprised that, as a 5★, 2Cap's red # is that high :D ... it looks like they did 'rebalance' that number upward ... for the 5★ version anyway, but didn't want to still didn't want to grant him parity with his 3★ self.

    It will be interesting to see how the other "rarity clones" play out ... 2Thor vs 3Thor, 3Torch vs 3Torch, 2Daken vs 3Daken ...

  • Scofie
    Scofie GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,394 Chairperson of the Boards

    I think it's only fair that the 3☆ version of every character is better than the 2☆ version at comparable levels. The naturally higher character should be slightly better.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,963 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Scofie said:
    I think it's only fair that the 3☆ version of every character is better than the 2☆ version at comparable levels. The naturally higher character should be slightly better.

    Well...let's check Daken.

    3* Daken at 450 (no boost)



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