Prevalence of MThor and could she be the target of a rebalance?

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  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    Juggernaut 1* at 5 level: destroys 16 tiles dealing damage with them.
    Mthor at level 5: destroys 1 adjacent tile next to a charged tile, not dealing damage nor gaining AP.
    What a difference isn't it? (Yeah, I know, let's nerf jugg 1!).
    I think the answer is pretty easy: just match or destroy charged tiles and she can't do nothing.
    I think I already suggested that in this thread lol. So it's becoming repetitive.
    Oh, by the way, are there still people attached to the past thinking that natural 5    s are OP anymore? :D

  • DrClever
    DrClever Posts: 584 Critical Contributor

    @kuntilanak said:
    I'm not bothered with her removing specials every turn

    Whereas I'm only bothered by that - that's the thing that makes too many playstyles unworkable against her as things stand

    @Bad said:
    Juggernaut 1* at 5 level: destroys 16 tiles dealing damage with them.
    Mthor at level 5: destroys 1 adjacent tile next to a charged tile, not dealing damage nor gaining AP.
    What a difference isn't it?

    Juggs power is not passive and does not target special tiles, so yeah.

    Oh, by the way, are there still people attached to the past thinking that natural 5*s are OP anymore?

    Depends on your level. If you are in 3/4* territory and a 5* MThor makes all your strong teams unusable (or vastly stronger if you are lucky enough to have it yourself) then yes, it's natural five stars you care about as no one has ascended four stars.

    At your level it's different.

  • DrClever
    DrClever Posts: 584 Critical Contributor

    Bad again
    I think the answer is pretty easy: just match or destroy charged tiles and she can't do nothing.

    This is the right approach of course but easier said than done.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @DrClever said:

    Depends on your level. If you are in 3/4* territory and a 5* MThor makes all your strong teams unusable (or vastly stronger if you are lucky enough to have it yourself) then yes, it's natural five stars you care about as no one has ascended four stars.

    At your level it's different.

    There are many offers and people buying them. To the point I know MMR doesn't separate supporting players and f2p. So you can expect to see them soon, and not only 1* ascended to 5.
    Mthor won't be nerfed because of the many reasons already repeated and because was fan favorite and everyone went for her so the outrage would be max.
    You'd do better asking for counters for her. Better use of energy and time

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @DrClever said:

    @Bad said:
    Juggernaut 1* at 5 level: destroys 16 tiles dealing damage with them.
    Mthor at level 5: destroys 1 adjacent tile next to a charged tile, not dealing damage nor gaining AP.
    What a difference isn't it?

    Juggs power is not passive and does not target special tiles, so yeah.

    If you think that comparation is right, then you are another one making a huge hyperbole or simply misleading.

  • Zalasta
    Zalasta Posts: 294 Mover and Shaker

    I wonder how an ascended Cosmo would do against her. Cosmos blue would reduce her AP accumulation, and shut down her powers until the next turn (assuming she matches or destroys a charged tile).

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,974 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Zalasta said:
    I wonder how an ascended Cosmo would do against her. Cosmos blue would reduce her AP accumulation, and shut down her powers until the next turn (assuming she matches or destroys a charged tile).

    Ascended Cosmo will completely shut her down, I think.

    Ascended Alligator Loki is already very good at it -- I tried him out and it works pretty well.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    I've just fought Mthor SC in cyclops pvp with kingpin and Omega. I know, I love to live dangerously!
    I matched one charged tile, she almost didn't destroy any sap, omega repeater neither.
    I destroyed her with just match damage.
    What an OP character is mthor! She gave me sweet an easy points, people in this thread should be amazed!
    Just saying.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,974 Chairperson of the Boards

    Maybe if she's the best boardshake/anti ALL special tiles character, she shouldn't also do 200,000 damage for 6 AP on her active powers?

  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,284 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited November 2023

    As a developer, I know you can code almost anything.

    They could code her board shake passive so that the destruction doesn't generate any matches at all (thus no free AP), it just destroys a few tiles and shakes the board up (similar to Quakes board rearrangement that doesn't generate any matches).

    KGB

  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,328 Chairperson of the Boards

    @entrailbucket said:
    Maybe if she's the best boardshake/anti ALL special tiles character, she shouldn't also do 200,000 damage for 6 AP on her active powers?

    Her red usually hits me for like 30k, if she's able to use it at all. You are leaving off the part where she hits for 200k only after she has been able to fire her powers many times previously to achieve the conditions of having destroyed enough charge tiles for the extra damage.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,974 Chairperson of the Boards

    @BriMan2222 said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    Maybe if she's the best boardshake/anti ALL special tiles character, she shouldn't also do 200,000 damage for 6 AP on her active powers?

    Her red usually hits me for like 30k, if she's able to use it at all. You are leaving off the part where she hits for 200k only after she has been able to fire her powers many times previously to achieve the conditions of having destroyed enough charge tiles for the extra damage.

    Sorta, but mostly I meant on offense. The best boardshake character shouldn't also be the best anti special tile character and the best damage character.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @entrailbucket said:

    Sorta, but mostly I meant on offense. The best boardshake character shouldn't also be the best anti special tile character and the best damage character.

    Anti special tile usually is pretty much included in boardshake character.
    And in order to deal 200k damage, a lot of turns are needed.
    There are already a lot of slow characters who can deal given time 200k damage.
    And pvp is about speed.

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited November 2023

    @entrailbucket said:
    Maybe if she's the best boardshake/anti ALL special tiles character, she shouldn't also do 200,000 damage for 6 AP on her active powers?

    She doesn't for most players entrail. Maybe your perception is being warped by having her at 550?

    For me in baby champ land her red is kinda bad for damage output until the very end of a long match (when I might have destroyed dozens of charged tiles). And even then she might be doing 80-100k unboosted. That's nice in the abstract, but in practice it's not really available until way too late in the match to be a primary strategy.

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards

    @entrailbucket said:
    Eh, she'd still easily do 100k+ on her red and yellow, unboosted. I'm not sure the boardshake is the best thing she does -- she can also just straight up murder you.

    There are lots and lots of characters that can straight up murder opponents. There are not a lot of characters that provide substantial, passive boardshake. That is the thing that makes her stand out.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,974 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Vhailorx said:

    @entrailbucket said:
    Eh, she'd still easily do 100k+ on her red and yellow, unboosted. I'm not sure the boardshake is the best thing she does -- she can also just straight up murder you.

    There are lots and lots of characters that can straight up murder opponents. There are not a lot of characters that provide substantial, passive boardshake. That is the thing that makes her stand out.

    The point was that characters that do substantial, passive boardshake and removal to that level should probably not also do huge damage for cheap.

  • DrClever
    DrClever Posts: 584 Critical Contributor
    edited November 2023

    @Bad said:
    Mthor won't be nerfed...
    You'd do better asking for counters for her.

    ?

    That's precisely what I've suggested from the start.

    My point there was just that for a lot of players ascended 4* characters just won't be seen whereas natural 5s will, and will be difficult.

  • bbigler
    bbigler Posts: 2,111 Chairperson of the Boards

    1. I’m surprised this discussion is still going, but I do fight her everyday and still have matches that feel unfair.

    2. Fighting 1 match against her does not educate you enough to understand the frustration here. Try fighting her 20 times and tell me how many times it goes well for you (meaning no health packs or losses).

    3. Matching her charged tiles is not a solution because she creates those tiles faster than you can match them.

    4. If all characters were “only good when boosted”, then we would have a changing meta every week, and that would be great!

  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,328 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited November 2023

    @bbigler said:
    1. I’m surprised this discussion is still going, but I do fight her everyday and still have matches that feel unfair.

    1. Fighting 1 match against her does not educate you enough to understand the frustration here. Try fighting her 20 times and tell me how many times it goes well for you (meaning no health packs or losses).

    2. Matching her charged tiles is not a solution because she creates those tiles faster than you can match them.

    3. If all characters were “only good when boosted”, then we would have a changing meta every week, and that would be great!

    I go 20 for 20 most times without needing health packs. I used to go through my health packs every day from pvp, but with fighting mostly mthor/shang teams I'm up to 30 health packs saved because I almost never need them. Collosus shrugs off their match damage and uses her charged tiles against her to crush her with his big match damage.

    She does not create them faster than I can destroy them. She creates 1 each turn and i destroy 1 each turn for net neutral. She only gets more if she fires a power, and 99 percent of the time I can end her easily before she ever gets the chance.

    Id much rather fight mthor/shang than the other meta team going around of collosus/omega red. They're perfectly beatable too, but the matches are much more of a slog.

  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards

    @bbigler said:

    1. Fighting 1 match against her does not educate you enough to understand the frustration here. Try fighting her 20 times and tell me how many times it goes well for you (meaning no health packs or losses).

    2. Matching her charged tiles is not a solution because she creates those tiles faster than you can match them.

    1. Fighting her 20 times? And what makes you think I don't do precisely that in each pvp?
      Fighting her with SC and Mthor I don't need any healthpack because SC regenerates. I explained my kingping and omega match in order to showcase that EVERYONE can beat her, even if they use sap or repeaters. And omega regenerates too.
    2. You slow her and you gain a lot of AP meanwhile. But you can choose to not destroy charges and die cascades down. Everyone is free.

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