Prevalence of MThor and could she be the target of a rebalance?

658_2

Ascended DP is solid against her but nothing amazing. Personally, I don’t have any trouble beating Thor. That’s not why I’d favor a limited and targeted nerf (don’t hit repeaters and countdowns, although I like the upthread idea of just randomizing what blue hits, but still allowing it to hit specials). I don’t like that so many characters are either useless against her, or useless to partner with her, since so many are reliant on specials, many almost entirely so. Imo, this greatly affects top end diversity, because it’s not just in Sim, she’s everywhere right now. It’s monotonous to play her all the time.

bbigler

@BriMan2222
My roster is still “new” so I don’t have that many 5-Star champs, but I imagine boosted 5-stars can take her down easily.

As for Colossus & Omega fighting MThor: the way the match goes is highly dependent on whether or not Jane can destroy Omega’s CD tile. If she can’t, then she’s down in 4 turns. If she can destroy it every turn, then it could take 8+ turns, which is a long time for her to gather AP & hit me. Usually, it’s somewhere in between: she gets hit from Omega’s AOE a couple times, then Omega’s Red and Colossus’ black hit her and Omega always fires his yellow for protects, usually multiple times. Half of those protects stay on the board the whole match.

The point here is that she doesn’t stop Omega completely, just partially. Colossus does his fair share of dmg too, especially matching charged tiles on his colors. Since I can climb higher with those guys, I still fight MThor even though it’s not fun. They can also take down boosted 5s if they’re not very good, otherwise I would have to resort to Shang, which invites attacks.

We need a name for the Colossus + Omega team: …. RedSteel? Colmega? Omegassus? COR?

EDIT: I like Omegassus, it sounds like Pegasus

BriMan2222

@bbigler said:
@BriMan2222
My roster is still “new” so I don’t have that many 5-Star champs, but I imagine boosted 5-stars can take her down easily.

As for Colossus & Omega fighting MThor: the way the match goes is highly dependent on whether or not Jane can destroy Omega’s CD tile. If she can’t, then she’s down in 4 turns. If she can destroy it every turn, then it could take 8+ turns, which is a long time for her to gather AP & hit me. Usually, it’s somewhere in between: she gets hit from Omega’s AOE a couple times, then Omega’s Red and Colossus’ black hit her and Omega always fires his yellow for protects, usually multiple times. Half of those protects stay on the board the whole match.

The point here is that she doesn’t stop Omega completely, just partially. Colossus does his fair share of dmg too, especially matching charged tiles on his colors. Since I can climb higher with those guys, I still fight MThor even though it’s not fun. They can also take down boosted 5s if they’re not very good, otherwise I would have to resort to Shang, which invites attacks.

We need a name for the Colossus + Omega team: …. RedSteel? Colmega? Omegassus? COR?

EDIT: I like Omegassus, it sounds like Pegasus

It sounds like the problem is that you are missing quite a few tools in your tool kit. If your allowing her to hang around for 8+ turns, then yeah she's probably gonna get out of hand.

I think this is less a problem of Mthor being too strong and more a problem of, she's a screw and you don't own a screw driver.

Bad

She is everywhere because she has been fan favorite and a big amount of people went for her. And because her toolkit is more appealing than a lot of 5*s.
It's up to the devs to start releasing counters for her. A perfect one would be a character removing charged tiles at the start of the turn (as destroying them could benefit her).
However that character should have a good pvp synergy and a nice toolkit if not nobody would play him.
And a hard counter like that could really harm the new character who isn't OP at all, grandma peggy.
Maybe actually what is needed is another character featuring another effective meta.

bbigler

How about a character that stops or reduces AP collection from cascades? Or a character that limits how much AP you can collect each turn. But the best counter would be someone that passively removes charged tiles.

Scofie

@DAZ0273 said:

@Scofie said:

@entrailbucket said:

I do think there's room for defensive characters in this game, but here's how it should work: defensive characters should be terrible on offense. That's balance. We've never had that. The good characters are just really really good all the time, and all that means is that they're too strong.

That's because PvE is more "popular" (played more). A defensive character is largely pointless unless you're massively punching up on the SCL and can't afford the health packs. And even then it's going to take forever. I rarely ever play with defensive characters because they're not fun for me and I can't remember a time where I think "I wish I took less damage there" compared to "I'm glad I have a rainbow-coloured nuke arsenal".

I knew you was an honoury Gooner!

Only until next Saturday.... 😉

revskip

@bbigler said:
How about a character that stops or reduces AP collection from cascades? Or a character that limits how much AP you can collect each turn. But the best counter would be someone that passively removes charged tiles.

Or better yet hammers you for damage any time they are created. Passively, like her massively OP board shake.

bbigler

@BriMan2222 said:

@bbigler said:
@BriMan2222
My roster is still “new” so I don’t have that many 5-Star champs, but I imagine boosted 5-stars can take her down easily.

As for Colossus & Omega fighting MThor: the way the match goes is highly dependent on whether or not Jane can destroy Omega’s CD tile. If she can’t, then she’s down in 4 turns. If she can destroy it every turn, then it could take 8+ turns, which is a long time for her to gather AP & hit me. Usually, it’s somewhere in between: she gets hit from Omega’s AOE a couple times, then Omega’s Red and Colossus’ black hit her and Omega always fires his yellow for protects, usually multiple times. Half of those protects stay on the board the whole match.

The point here is that she doesn’t stop Omega completely, just partially. Colossus does his fair share of dmg too, especially matching charged tiles on his colors. Since I can climb higher with those guys, I still fight MThor even though it’s not fun. They can also take down boosted 5s if they’re not very good, otherwise I would have to resort to Shang, which invites attacks.

We need a name for the Colossus + Omega team: …. RedSteel? Colmega? Omegassus? COR?

EDIT: I like Omegassus, it sounds like Pegasus

It sounds like the problem is that you are missing quite a few tools in your tool kit. If your allowing her to hang around for 8+ turns, then yeah she's probably gonna get out of hand.

I think this is less a problem of Mthor being too strong and more a problem of, she's a screw and you don't own a screw driver.

Late reply … if I used a different team to fight MThor I would get attacked more and not climb so high.

DrClever

I'd like to see 5Magneto's red trigger on tile charging, more countdown & repeater fortification, and a passive along the lines of "If a friendly SAP tile is destroyed (not matched) by an enemy power, create a new fortified one of 40/60/80/100/120% the strength of the original."

BriMan2222

@bbigler said:

@BriMan2222 said:

@bbigler said:
@BriMan2222
My roster is still “new” so I don’t have that many 5-Star champs, but I imagine boosted 5-stars can take her down easily.

As for Colossus & Omega fighting MThor: the way the match goes is highly dependent on whether or not Jane can destroy Omega’s CD tile. If she can’t, then she’s down in 4 turns. If she can destroy it every turn, then it could take 8+ turns, which is a long time for her to gather AP & hit me. Usually, it’s somewhere in between: she gets hit from Omega’s AOE a couple times, then Omega’s Red and Colossus’ black hit her and Omega always fires his yellow for protects, usually multiple times. Half of those protects stay on the board the whole match.

The point here is that she doesn’t stop Omega completely, just partially. Colossus does his fair share of dmg too, especially matching charged tiles on his colors. Since I can climb higher with those guys, I still fight MThor even though it’s not fun. They can also take down boosted 5s if they’re not very good, otherwise I would have to resort to Shang, which invites attacks.

We need a name for the Colossus + Omega team: …. RedSteel? Colmega? Omegassus? COR?

EDIT: I like Omegassus, it sounds like Pegasus

It sounds like the problem is that you are missing quite a few tools in your tool kit. If your allowing her to hang around for 8+ turns, then yeah she's probably gonna get out of hand.

I think this is less a problem of Mthor being too strong and more a problem of, she's a screw and you don't own a screw driver.

Late reply … if I used a different team to fight MThor I would get attacked more and not climb so high.

Once you're worth enough points, no team is really a deterrent. There is no "chasm" immortal teams that scare anyone away any more. Even 550 collosus/omega teams can't float. Good boosted 550's at lvl 672 can to an extent, but even they are not completely safe.

bbigler

@BriMan2222
Sure, no team is immune to attacks, but my point is that I’m fighting MThor with the best strategic team to climb. If I used Colossus & Shang to fight MThor, I could take her down faster, but I would also invite more attacks, so ultimately that is a bad strategy.

Bad

I've just fought ascended coulson with gargantos and HE.
How could I say it? Nerf Mthor and they just will rule as the unstoppable team.

DAZ0273

@DrClever said:

@DAZ0273 said:

@Scofie said:

A defensive character is largely pointless ... arsenal

I knew you was an honoury Gooner!

1-0 to the Mighty Thor.

The Man in the Raincoat would have played Chasm non stop.

Lol, oh well Saudi money bribed sour grapes

entrailbucket

@Bad said:
I've just fought ascended coulson with gargantos and HE.
How could I say it? Nerf Mthor and they just will rule as the unstoppable team.

I saw this and a few other comments about this team, and thought "no way that'll work against Thor -- she'll blow up all the CD tiles immediately."

Boy, was I wrong! Coulson spams so hard that she can't even get close to cleaning up after him.

I don't know if this can stay the way it is, honestly. At minimum we need a guy who punishes enemy CD tiles expiring (and we've needed that guy for a long time, it's a reason why Worthy Cap was out of control too).

DrClever

Can you outspam them with MThor & Polaris + BRB or whoever?

entrailbucket

I'm not sure. I've only used the team, haven't fought against it.

Philbert101

They don’t need to “nerf” MThor to pull her teeth. Just change her passive so that it doesn’t fire every round regardless of the ap pool. Only after she fires a power.
That gives a person a few rounds to protect those special tiles and form a defense/remove her.

revskip

@Philbert101 said:
They don’t need to “nerf” MThor to pull her teeth. Just change her passive so that it doesn’t fire every round regardless of the ap pool. Only after she fires a power.
That gives a person a few rounds to protect those special tiles and form a defense/remove her.

That's the exact change I'd like to see. Make her board shake conditional with firing powers rather than passive every turn PLUS when she fires powers. That little change would fix the OP part of her kit which is the random cascades she causes starting turn 1 for free.

Vhailorx

@revskip said:

@Philbert101 said:
They don’t need to “nerf” MThor to pull her teeth. Just change her passive so that it doesn’t fire every round regardless of the ap pool. Only after she fires a power.
That gives a person a few rounds to protect those special tiles and form a defense/remove her.

That's the exact change I'd like to see. Make her board shake conditional with firing powers rather than passive every turn PLUS when she fires powers. That little change would fix the OP part of her kit which is the random cascades she causes starting turn 1 for free.

This is nerfing the single best thing about her. Her passive boardshake is far and away her best attribute. The fact that her actives are all decent or better is nice. But she is viable with just the boardshake.

I honestly don't know exactly how she would play after this change (I suspect the answer is "good when boosted"), but suggesting this is something other than a "nerf" is absurd.

entrailbucket

Eh, she'd still easily do 100k+ on her red and yellow, unboosted. I'm not sure the boardshake is the best thing she does -- she can also just straight up murder you.