***** Magik (Phoenix Five) *****

MoosePrime

@GrimSkald said:

@rainkingucd said:

@GrimSkald said:

@Bowgentle said:
Since it's a complete change I expect retro rewards from her for both Magik and Hela.
That's what they did when they changed Shuri.

I definitely agree it'd be out of character, but I'd feel better if it was explicitly stated.

The image shows retro rewards for 5* Magik, but doesn't state for Hela. Killmonger was new to Shuri, so retro rewards were there. But, Hela is already fed, so this may be like the War Machine / Iron Man changes.

You're absolutely right - I missed that! Awesome.

I agree, I would assume that we won't get the shards for Hela. It's a pity, too, the secondary feeder is at a lower rate -- looking at Shuri she gives (if my math is right) 1130 shards, total, for Killmonger. That's 2 covers worth, as opposed to 6.

Not really complaining, Hela is a very meh 5 star, but they probably should give her a full feeder sooner or later. Hopefully they'll give us a 4 star that makes sense at some point.

Any Hela shards you would get from a retro reward would be less than you already got from normal progression to whatever level your 4* Magik is at. Therefore, it doesn't make sense to give those shards out.

Bowgentle

I still think we're getting retro rewards for both 5s, but we'll see.

killahKlown

@IceIX if it's not too late can you and team consider changing one thing here? Change to "Whenever a Demon tile is matched OR DESTROYED,two more Demons rush in to replace it"

This one little change makes her more useful and actually pretty good but not ridiculously overpowered. Otherwise she has a very exploitable flaw that nullifies her best feature.

HoundofShadow

I think they did that deliberately so that you won't see a sea of mThor/Magik.

Codex

@HoundofShadow said:
I think they did that deliberately so that you won't see a sea of mThor/Magik.

Would that be a bad thing? It would be average on defense and definitely not as annoying chahulk.

entrailbucket

It's really difficult to make a "this would be too good" argument in a game where Chasm/Thor/Kang/etc exist and are seemingly ok.

I don't even know what their power level target for characters is now, because they've been pretty consistently breaking the ceiling since they took over. The result of this is that decent, middle-tier characters like Wong and Magik look grossly underpowered, just because they're not completely insane.

wymtime

Feels like a great partner for MThor and to go against MThor. Although repeaters might never go off. I do wonder if MThor/Kang becomes a strong Meta if she just disappoints. While adding extra Demons makes her scary of those repeaters never fire are they still good??

Edit. I just reread her demon power. It looks like that demon tile needs to be matched not destroyed. This would make MThor just a hard counter to those Demon tiles. Definitely pulling for Kang and HitMonkey

entrailbucket

@wymtime said:
Feels like a great partner for MThor and to go against MThor. Although repeaters might never go off. I do wonder if MThor/Kang becomes a strong Meta if she just disappoints. While adding extra Demons makes her scary of those repeaters never fire are they still good??

What are you seeing there as far as synergy or countering? I'd avoid using her with Thor...Thor will blow up Magik's repeaters immediately, and I'd much rather use Thor's red power than Magik's. The only thing Magik brings to the table in that team is a mediocre-but-cheap purple AOE, unless I'm missing something -- I'd much rather have quite a few other characters.

IrisRyu

I’m not seeing the synergy between MThor or Magik either, but maybe I’m missing something.

I wouldn’t describe Magik’s Phoenix Claws as mediocre though. At 450, the damage output is higher than a 550 KK’s AOE and just under Crystal. Maxed, boosted and paired with Emm5 and she should be doing approx. 124k permanent team damage for 6AP. I’ll take that!

entrailbucket

I guess I don't have a great sense of where 5* AOE powers should be today, damage-wise. I tend to measure them against Thor still -- I think Magik is cheaper but lower-damage?

Any 6ap AOE with a power booster on board is probably going to be pretty good. I think (depending on which of Magik's stuff is eligible for boost) the Okoye/Apocalypse/Emma with Magik team might be quite good, except that most of Magik's powers are active. In general I'd take Hulk plus a booster over Magik plus a booster because Hulk is free and Magik isn't.

658_2

The drain may make it take a minute, but Okoye or Emma/Colossus/Magik will probably wipe the floor with Immortal teams in Sim. Nothing to fight but Immortal after 1500 is solved.

Chrynos1989

As an engineer, I can 100% say, that when your feeder tree gets more complex than any CAD file, you’re doing it wrong!

Punisher5784

Forget Hela. I'm more excited about them sweet Morbin shards

DjinnBabba

What does the red passive do exactly at 5 covers? +35% of match damage is permanent? Or 135% is permanent?

Borstock

What if demon tiles destroyed only helped from one side? Like if you destroy your own tiles, no help. But if the enemy does, it helps. This makes her more powerful, but only in certain situations (like as a counter to Dr. Thor).

entrailbucket

@Borstock said:
What if demon tiles destroyed only helped from one side? Like if you destroy your own tiles, no help. But if the enemy does, it helps. This makes her more powerful, but only in certain situations (like as a counter to Dr. Thor).

I don't think that would help very much. Wouldn't Thor just immediately destroy the new tiles too?

If you wanted to counter Thor, you'd make it so the tiles did damage when they were destroyed by the enemy, like Daredevil's green tile does. (BTW Daredevil green is super fun against enemy Thor).

Borstock

@entrailbucket said:

@Borstock said:
What if demon tiles destroyed only helped from one side? Like if you destroy your own tiles, no help. But if the enemy does, it helps. This makes her more powerful, but only in certain situations (like as a counter to Dr. Thor).

I don't think that would help very much. Wouldn't Thor just immediately destroy the new tiles too?

If you wanted to counter Thor, you'd make it so the tiles did damage when they were destroyed by the enemy, like Daredevil's green tile does. (BTW Daredevil green is super fun against enemy Thor).

If I worded myself wrong, I apologize. But that's what I meant.

If you pair her with your own Thor and destroy demon tiles, they're gone. Doesn't help you, because you did it to yourself.

But if you go against an enemy Thor, and she destroys the demon tiles, it's the same as if they got matched. It helps you.

entrailbucket

Ah ok, so you'd have them do something besides replicating themselves when destroyed. Otherwise enemy Thor would destroy them, they'd replicate, then she'd just destroy the new ones too, before any of them ever did anything.

GrimSkald

@dianetics said:
Yeah, but they would also start to fill out the board faster than Thor could destroy them. It would be stupidly broken.

**edit: Nevermind, with the max tile counts it wouldn't be.

We're discussing a hypothetical, right? My read on the power as it exists is that they won't propagate if they're destroyed, only if they're a part of a match.

entrailbucket

I think so? Right now, Thor counters this power completely -- it won't do anything against an enemy Thor or with a friendly one. Some people offered suggestions to fix that, but the power would need some pretty significant tweaking.