Adventures with 5* Wasp.

kuntilanak

@Mr_F said:
I'm not done testing but have some initial thoughts on why it goes so slow:

1. I hate mThor even more.
2. I'm starting to disliking Shang Chi too.
3. Current meta is not suitable for testing anything which is not counter to AoE, mThor, SC and Ascended Polaris.
4. I hate mThor cascades even more.
5. I hate how fast mThor can generate AP to steamroll anything.
6. I do not know why I see so many double/triple 500+lv 5* and sometimes even double/triple 550 when I barely scratch 480.
7. I do not like very much how mThor and such are in so many vaults and offers. I understand why, I simply do not like the that.
8. Majority of MPQ players I see are most likely clone of each other, gueassing by how everybody use same teams 99.99% of the time. This of serious pandemic of lacking time.

SC i can get by. MThor is just cheap and broken...

Mr_F

Some initial thoughts:

Ant-Man is awesome here (Blue2/Purple2 are easy to fire and do 50k damage), Janet is usefull and Hope... It saddens me that I have to say that, Hope is useless with them. 99% of time I never used her for more than a mere tank. Janet's powers (cept yellow) and Ant-Man are just better.

In general, compared to other non-meta teams, it is a ok team - even good if ya swap Hope for somebody else like Strange or Crystal. I dunno yet who wold be best as 3rd one - so far did not do any testing with Hope beig out. Compared to meta, unless it's Polaris/mThor or Aunt/OR, Chams, above average and extremly luck dependant. No 6 blue for Janet's passive mean no damage at all and dying fast. During 1st day of testing I manage to win all fights. Just today I never got 6 blue and lost all but one. In both days, same opponents were choosen - mix of meta and non-meta.

So... Ascended Ant-Man and Wasp change nothing for 5* Wasp. Same stuff as before: use other partners.

Side notes: mThor and Polaris need reworking. I would really like to mThor ap generation beaing less effective and Polaris SAP generation and passive damage being lower.

entrailbucket

It's fine for some characters to be better than others in this game -- total balance is impossible and some guys will always have an edge.

It is NOT FINE, in any way, for some characters to totally outclass others at the same tier/level.

Mr_F

Totally agree. Not gonna start another "mThor topic" here - we have enough of those. enough was said and we are not gonna discover America again here.

What is worth mentioning is that some characters enters meta and some do not. Spider-Girl I see from time to time but Martyr or Weapon Hex are absent. I'm seeing some Agatha and Mephisto too.

Back on topic. I forgot tomention: that team is capable of soloing some CN nodes. I did the 1st from Thieves but failded with Mindles Ones on day 2. Propably if I swaped Hope for Strange it would help a bit but I was still trying to do some testings.

The best part is that this team is capable of doing simulator 50 wins on alone which is nice. Still need to figure a 5* team for Hope in current meta. My old pairings aren't good anymore cause of level dirrerence or still not being modernised. at least if i "can't" use Hope, I will use Janet.

WhiteBomber

Hope honestly reads like she is better than the other 2 (even ascended). Mine is favorited now and will be giving her ISO. I'll be on the look out for good partners to help the cause. Hard to imagine she isn't good with Deathlok.

Mr_F

@WhiteBomber

She is not. 1st, she is terrible in one vs one when her yellow is useless and blue and black cost are ruining her. In team, Simply you need swarm tiles to deal damage and only characters who creates them are Janet,Hope and Scott BUT just as I specified above - almost always it's better to fire Janet's or Scott's powers than hers and her's blue become useless too. If you go and pair her with somebody else, she is just support. Blue for ap steal, yellow to protect some one but Her Call The Swarm and Grow the swarm/Pain tacticts "just happens" when you collect more AP. I mean I never work toward firing them - it just happens.

With direct comparision: Janet's abilities are cheaper and more usefull. She does not need swarm tiles so her yellow do have some usage. Scott is similaty expensive but with when paired with Janet he can easier activate his Grow Ability which do whooping 52k damage on lv 475. Double what my 486 Hopes do.

Sadly, Janet and Scott aren't her best partners. It's deathlock and 4 Widow to create winfinite or i dunno... anybody else in 5* ;and who does not use blue (and maybe black)?

WhiteBomber

@Mr_F said:
@WhiteBomber

She is not. 1st, she is terrible in one vs one when her yellow is useless and blue and black cost are ruining her. In team, Simply you need swarm tiles to deal damage and only characters who creates them are Janet,Hope and Scott BUT just as I specified above - almost always it's better to fire Janet's or Scott's powers than hers and her's blue become useless too. If you go and pair her with somebody else, she is just support. Blue for ap steal, yellow to protect some one but Her Call The Swarm and Grow the swarm/Pain tacticts "just happens" when you collect more AP. I mean I never work toward firing them - it just happens.

With direct comparision: Janet's abilities are cheaper and more usefull. She does not need swarm tiles so her yellow do have some usage. Scott is similaty expensive but with when paired with Janet he can easier activate his Grow Ability which do whooping 52k damage on lv 475. Double what my 486 Hopes do.

Sadly, Janet and Scott aren't her best partners. It's deathlock and 4 Widow to create winfinite or i dunno... anybody else in 5* ;and who does not use blue (and maybe black)?

Yeah, I just played my first matches with her and her BFF ant friends are awful partners for her.

I only have her at 2,2,2, but holy hell does she go infinite pretty fast. She might also be one of the only characters who can just endlessly fire and AOE until the round is over... that's kinda crazy. Even at 2,2,2 I am finding her quite good and enjoyable (her blue is very good), with the right people she is super oppressive. Given the fact that her black dishes out ok damage already, I imagine championed it get's things done very quickly, so in my instance, she was the damage dealer.

I will keep testing with her as I level her up. Once stronger I will take her in to meta PVP's and also continue to try to remove her cuffs from Deathlok (but they are just too good together). In the meantime:

• Hope, Deathlok, Shuri: Match blue and you are basically already on your way to winning (just maybe not against big meta).
• Hope, Magik3, Deathlok / other: All the additional black gets her AOE infinite going pretty quickly. Magik's strikes also help boost the damage.

If available Pizzadog is great here to keep people healthy / prolong the match. Also, Refreshment cart at 3... you spam so many damn abilities this support pops off, causing more random matches and generating free AP every cast (the countdowns also count as healing for Pizzadog when matched).

entrailbucket

Unfortunately they're really sort of bad at making characters combo on purpose. They've tried to do it a few times, and I can't think of a time it's worked out for them (anybody? Hopefully there's something I'm forgetting!).

WhiteBomber

They do have better partners, but I think these ones synergize: Polaris + Mags5, Beast4 + Apoc, some of the XMen like Logan, Ice5 and Proffessa5. Definitely the spiders, those are the ones that only really for sure rely on each other and of course only because they all play off their own tile type. There was for sure a missed opportunity here with the ant team, super unfortunate they changed Antman not that long ago and he is still the worst of them.

I noticed Hopes abilities don't really change much with adding covers, what the heck is up with that? Really her blue is just very good, black is pretty good (especially if you get the scenario for infinite use) and yellow... should maybe true heal? I didn't read it, but is the concept of her yellow that you are eating the swarm to heal? mmm

Since I happened to be checking out Antman also (note I don't have him ascended), but I'm not sure he can be saved. He is way too expensive for how bad he is; even if his punch is hitting for 52k, that is nothing for the specific needs and cost.

entrailbucket

@WhiteBomber said:
They do have better partners, but I think these ones synergize: Polaris + Mags5, Beast4 + Apoc, some of the XMen like Logan, Ice5 and Proffessa5. Definitely the spiders, those are the ones that only really for sure rely on each other and of course only because they all play off their own tile type.

I noticed Hopes abilities don't really change much with adding covers, what the heck is up with that? Really her blue is just very good, black is pretty good (especially if you get the scenario for infinite use) and yellow... should maybe true heal? I didn't read it, but is the concept of her yellow that you are eating the swarm to heal? mmm

Since I happened to be checking out Antman also (note I don't have him ascended), but I'm not sure he can be saved. He is way too expensive for how bad he is; even if his punch is hitting for 52k, that is nothing for the specific needs and cost.

I was thinking about Luke Cage/Iron Fist, the heroes for hire in general, all the abilities where there's an extra bonus if x specific character is on the team. The Ant people are definitely a good example of an intended combo that's not very good.

I actually think the Spiders are an example of a bad combo too! Until very recently, all the web people had their active powers on the same colors, so they'd work in theory but in practice they were all competing for the same AP resources.

It's not that big a deal, lots of these characters are good and have good combo partners that aren't the intended ones. It's just sort of weird.

WhiteBomber

Woah yeah, the ones like IronCage and Moonlady and... other moon lady? I think for all anyone knows, those might not even function since they are so bad you would never notice or even check. Note for new development team: research "synergy"

Mr_F

@WhiteBomber said:

I noticed Hopes abilities don't really change much with adding covers, what the heck is up with that? Really her blue is just very good, black is pretty good (especially if you get the scenario for infinite use) and yellow... should maybe true heal? I didn't read it, but is the concept of her yellow that you are eating the swarm to heal? mmm

Welcome aboard of one build for Hope: 5/3/5 cause Yellow at 4 or 5 is not any better.

@WhiteBomber said:

Since I happened to be checking out Antman also (note I don't have him ascended), but I'm not sure he can be saved. He is way too expensive for how bad he is; even if his punch is hitting for 52k, that is nothing for the specific needs and cost.

I'll give ya hint: Janet helps with that. It actually happens a lot when her Blue creates Blue or Purple swarm making him less expensive on spot. And ONE blue swarm tile shut downs any SAP creator (cept for Polaris) cause ya steal them. That's how I did Honor among thieves 3rd day CN. I forgot about that initially but when I got into that... sweet babies.

entrailbucket

@WhiteBomber said:
Woah yeah, the ones like IronCage and Moonlady and... other moon lady? I think for all anyone knows, those might not even function since they are so bad you would never notice or even check. Note for new development team: research "synergy"

I honestly was like "moonstone?" in response to this...I totally forgot that both Phylae have these weird bonuses tacked onto them!

In general I think those are ok. They're almost always useless, but as long as they don't take up too much of the power budget I'm not bothered by them being there. It is annoying that they don't seem to know how to do synergy at all, though.

That kind of stuff is WAY better than some of the old attempts at it, too. The first version of Civil War Cap was completely useless unless his teammates were all Team Cap, and most of those guys were awful and had no synergy with him anyway.

But it's still weird that so many characters who have obvious lore connections don't work together. And it's even weirder that most of our best combos have no lore connection at all!

DAZ0273

@entrailbucket said:
Unfortunately they're really sort of bad at making characters combo on purpose. They've tried to do it a few times, and I can't think of a time it's worked out for them (anybody? Hopefully there's something I'm forgetting!).

Probably R4G + Guardian of the Galaxy is the only really useful on purpose one I can think of.

I suppose Hydra Stomper + Peggy for double stun immunity sounds good on paper but you are never going to find anybody using Hydra Stomper.