***** Carnage (Prophet of Knull) *****

Twomp_thaDJ

Wish it was Omega Red.. but with absolute carnage still running in the comics pretty sure it’s carnage.

Warbringa

Still waiting for more 5* decent active blue powers......

leoperez90

How is it that 4* land is getting the better characters? 
All the new 5* that we are getting are not as good or cant even be considered as competitive characters? 

 Am I not seeing something here? 

ThaRoadWarrior

Probably been awhile since we had a stronger Latest 3 than this, but I don’t know that they are truly meta defining or anything

jp1

ThaRoadWarrior said:

Probably been awhile since we had a stronger Latest 3 than this, but I don’t know that they are truly meta defining or anything

Can’t comment on the Professor just yet. Storm and Iceman are on par with like Hela and GED.

Omegased

leoperez90 said:

How is it that 4* land is getting the better characters? 
All the new 5* that we are getting are not as good or cant even be considered as competitive characters? 

 Am I not seeing something here? 

I dunno, the current three are pretty amazing. Prof5 is an absolute beast of a character. His Purple is SO versatile, (nuke, targeted tile destruction, attack tiles for kitty, AOE, Heal, board shuffle in that order of usefulness) are all VERY powerful. His blue power can take down a 4star character in 1 match if you're lucky.

5torm can do some great damage, and her board control certainly helps fuel Prof5s blue attack.

Iceman's blue - i mean, I can stun someone for 11+ turns. that's certifiably insane. esp when used with 5torm to help clear out other colours on the board.

Daredevil217

jp1 said:

ThaRoadWarrior said:

Probably been awhile since we had a stronger Latest 3 than this, but I don’t know that they are truly meta defining or anything

Can’t comment on the Professor just yet. Storm and Iceman are on par with like Hela and GED.

I think Storm is a tier below, and the decision to chase her versus the new 5* is going to be a tough one.

I will say that I believe Jessica stood in her own tier of not QUITE meta (Thor, Okoye, Kitty, Thanos), but better than everyone who isn't meta for a while (maybe you could put Daredevil/Black Bolt there, but Jessica was definitely above them and just below the top tier).  I'm ultimately okay with more "tier 2" characters (Professor, Jessica, Iceman, Daredevil, Hela, Doom, Black Bolt) being created (less Rescue, Wasp, Kingpin please), because anything "meta-defining" at this point would have to be turn-0 victories or a ridiculously broken to face on defense 5* (which we have some of those in the 4* tier, so I do not put it past them).

As I'm writing this, something just popped in my head (sorry if it is off-topic), but what if they created a character that did random passive damage if the blue/purple/black AP tiles on the board hit a certain threshold.  They could give this character a power that put those colors on the board.  As Thor saps the red/yellow/green from the board he'd actually hurt his own team and if run at half health, could possibly kill himself.  I guess really hard counters to the current meta could also be "meta shaking" like if Sabretooth was a 5.  Look at that, brought it back on topic.

jp1

Storm is definitely better than Cable or Loki, so it depends on how many tiers we are talking about here. 

I place Rescue above Cable as well to be honest. Not sure why she gets such a bad rap, she is a great third for Gritty.

I think if we are talking about trash, mediocre, good, great. Storm scrapes in on the low end of good for her self acceleration and board shake.

abenness

jp1 said:

Storm is definitely better than Cable or Loki, so it depends on how many tiers we are talking about here. 

I place Rescue above Cable as well to be honest. Not sure why she gets such a bad rap, she is a great third for Gritty.

I think if we are talking about trash, mediocre, good, great. Storm scrapes in on the low end of good for her self acceleration and board shake.

Rescue's red worked very well with Gritty offensively in pve, but can you imagine fighting them in pvp, and the AI decides to fire Rescue's "Your Shield", essentially crippling her team's offence?  I would laugh...

jp1

abenness said:

jp1 said:

Storm is definitely better than Cable or Loki, so it depends on how many tiers we are talking about here. 

I place Rescue above Cable as well to be honest. Not sure why she gets such a bad rap, she is a great third for Gritty.

I think if we are talking about trash, mediocre, good, great. Storm scrapes in on the low end of good for her self acceleration and board shake.

Rescue's red worked very well with Gritty offensively in pve, but can you imagine fighting them in pvp, and the AI decides to fire Rescue's "Your Shield", essentially crippling her team's offence?  I would laugh...

Yeah, she isn’t great in the hands of AI. I think it is pretty nice to be able to switch to a heavy defense with healing if needed though, if you had Rockets blue out, that could become a problem quickly. 

She isn’t top tier or anything, I just find it odd that she is considered trash like Wa5p as much as she is.

Daredevil217

jp1 said:

Storm is definitely better than Cable or Loki, so it depends on how many tiers we are talking about here. 

I place Rescue above Cable as well to be honest. Not sure why she gets such a bad rap, she is a great third for Gritty.

I think if we are talking about trash, mediocre, good, great. Storm scrapes in on the low end of good for her self acceleration and board shake.

I agree it really depends on how many tiers you think exist, but I put Storm alongside Parker, Strange, Goblin, IW Cap, Hawkeye (no Worthy), Loki and Cable (both of whom I admittedly may be higher on than you... I play Loki especially a ton). Without numbers, “insert character here” feels like they fit with this group as well. But I’m okay with others seeing it differently. 

BuzzedLightbeer

Daredevil217 said:

jp1 said:

Storm is definitely better than Cable or Loki, so it depends on how many tiers we are talking about here. 

I place Rescue above Cable as well to be honest. Not sure why she gets such a bad rap, she is a great third for Gritty.

I think if we are talking about trash, mediocre, good, great. Storm scrapes in on the low end of good for her self acceleration and board shake.

I agree it really depends on how many tiers you think exist, but I put Storm alongside Parker, Strange, Goblin, IW Cap, Hawkeye (no Worthy), Loki and Cable (both of whom I admittedly may be higher on than you... I play Loki especially a ton). Without numbers, “insert character here” feels like they fit with this group as well. But I’m okay with others seeing it differently. 

Shouldn’t we know definitely who “insert character here” is by now, and more on their numbers?  

jamesh

leoperez90 said:

How is it that 4* land is getting the better characters? 
All the new 5* that we are getting are not as good or cant even be considered as competitive characters? 

 Am I not seeing something here? 

Note that the new 4* characters that 5* players are complaining about probably wouldn't be as threatening if they were scaled up to 5* levels. You wouldn't see anywhere near as many complaints about Bishop or Captain America if their passives didn't trigger off of simple match damage for these players.

They'd still be great characters, but you could treat battles against them as a puzzle, as happens if you face them with a 4* team.

Sm0keyJ0e

It's hard to define tiers across the MPQ landscape. Some toons are really, really good in PVE but not so in PVP (Thanos). Others are strong in PVP on offense and defense (JJ) but otherwise not really usable in PVE. Obviously I'm talking about Mr. Competitive and not Joe Casual.

That said, there is only one useful toon in the current latests that can be run in both places effectively (PX). Storm is unusable in PVE--she's just too slow plopping down that charged every single turn unconditionally and takes several turns to launch her AOE. Iceman could be decent with the right green generating support for wave nodes (possibly), but I didn't have any luck with him. Just too slow and stuns are mostly meaningless in PVE. But PX shines quite nicely in PVE. The match-4/5 mechanic kills most toons in one move and Thanos does the rest. With a purple generating support, he's one match away from either nuking a single toon or wiping out waves. I have found him to be on par with JJ in PVP, both offensively and defensively. 

jp1

How you like to play is for sure the defining characteristic for how we might rate characters differently.

I am not, and probably never will be a top 10 player in PVE and certainly not PVP. My concern for an extra few seconds here and there is so much different from someone who is looking to chase a better spot in top 5. So, for me characters like Storm are better than others might see her. I also have a 4* lvl 200 vintage shield on her which improves her substantially for PVE. I know not everyone is going to have the support though.

I think it’s a great idea (as you did) to state your motives with a given character when you rate them here on the forums. This way someone who might be looking for someone that is fun to play, functional solo, and has some synergy with others won’t miss out if they aren’t competitive players.

I agree, for the most part, that she will never be replacing my Meta characters as a choice in any aspect of the game. I may choose to take her along though to break up the monotonous nature of the grind.

Play style matters so much too. As @Daredevil217 pointed out, he values Cable and Loki more than I do. I won’t use them unless forced to because they (especially Cable) are not fun in their mechanics and offer me less than some of my better 4*s in pretty much every way. Maybe I’m missing the boat on them, but it’s such an annoyance to bring them out unless they are boosted that I just don’t bother.

Khanwulf

So... I'd appreciate practical advice: to cash in hoard or not for [Carnag5]?

Is it better to dump the accumulation now before he moves into Latest?

I know the quick answer is "it's too early to tell"--but part of the equation is whether the current Latest are significantly valuable. In my case I have zero PX and a handful of Iceman and Storm covers... enough that when boosted they are useful for 4* PVE-land.

--Khanwulf

wymtime

Khanwulf said:

So... I'd appreciate practical advice: to cash in hoard or not for [Carnag5]?

Is it better to dump the accumulation now before he moves into Latest?

I know the quick answer is "it's too early to tell"--but part of the equation is whether the current Latest are significantly valuable. In my case I have zero PX and a handful of Iceman and Storm covers... enough that when boosted they are useful for 4* PVE-land.

--Khanwulf

It will depend on how many pulls do you have.  Do you have enough pulls to cover Storm?  Also do you have a strong partner for her?  If you will not comfortable cover storm keep hoarding.

Khanwulf

wymtime said:

Khanwulf said:

So... I'd appreciate practical advice: to cash in hoard or not for [Carnag5]?

Is it better to dump the accumulation now before he moves into Latest?

I know the quick answer is "it's too early to tell"--but part of the equation is whether the current Latest are significantly valuable. In my case I have zero PX and a handful of Iceman and Storm covers... enough that when boosted they are useful for 4* PVE-land.

--Khanwulf

It will depend on how many pulls do you have.  Do you have enough pulls to cover Storm?  Also do you have a strong partner for her?  If you will not comfortable cover storm keep hoarding.

Storm currently has 4 covers and Iceman 5. Current hoard is 105+ pulls (52 LL, remainder CC)... so not enough to guarantee coverage. 

The rest of my 5* roster is similarly scattered. I think Hawkeye and Thanos are most complete at 11 and 12 covers, respectively, and then a few at 8 and less. BB, notably, is at 4 covers.

I don't have PX at all, and am willing to accept that Storm may need to slide off the list in order to ensure acquisition of a full clean slate later.

--Khanwulf 

Daredevil217

jp1 said:

Play style matters so much too. As @Daredevil217 pointed out, he values Cable and Loki more than I do. I won’t use them unless forced to because they (especially Cable) are not fun in their mechanics and offer me less than some of my better 4*s in pretty much every way. Maybe I’m missing the boat on them, but it’s such an annoyance to bring them out unless they are boosted that I just don’t bother.

Loki is a natural pair with Doom as a climbing team. They both have gigantic nukes and true heal. They also provide a puzzle aspect I like. Basically, Loki places his tiles on black. Obviously you want to match them to fuel Doom (and get more countdowns), but if the AI matches them you still get more CDs and siphon their black thanks to Doom’s passive. When Loki dies and drops his trap it can often land in a hard to reach place. Doom’s board shuffle has allowed me to revive Loki more than a few times. Not only that, his cascades into matches have multiplied Loki’s CD tiles as well. Before Professor came along Loki had the best purple in the tier. So there is value in that alone, as strong 5* purples are hard to find. 

Cable is a bit tougher. I’m hard pressed to find many better active greens, but the tier isn’t exactly hurting for those. He was my “charged tile guy” but now I have Storm. He was my “stun guy” (paired with DD), but now I have Iceman. Even OML works better for strikes and I JUST champed him (fan favorites store). He does a lot of things okay, but doesn’t excel at anything. As I’m writing this, maybe he is a tier lower than the other people I mentioned. I used him a lot more before the current batch of Latests dropped. I think his current place on my roster would be a third on an X-Men theme team (Storm/ Gambit, Professor/ Someone). Pretty niche. I do also sometimes just pair him with another self-sustaining character with minimal overlap like IW Cap or Jessica Jones just for the heck of it. His CD/Repeater fortification is nice, but I have Goblin who fortifies more and does so without having to chase a color. 

wymtime

Khanwulf said:

wymtime said:

Khanwulf said:

So... I'd appreciate practical advice: to cash in hoard or not for [Carnag5]?

Is it better to dump the accumulation now before he moves into Latest?

I know the quick answer is "it's too early to tell"--but part of the equation is whether the current Latest are significantly valuable. In my case I have zero PX and a handful of Iceman and Storm covers... enough that when boosted they are useful for 4* PVE-land.

--Khanwulf

It will depend on how many pulls do you have.  Do you have enough pulls to cover Storm?  Also do you have a strong partner for her?  If you will not comfortable cover storm keep hoarding.

Storm currently has 4 covers and Iceman 5. Current hoard is 105+ pulls (52 LL, remainder CC)... so not enough to guarantee coverage. 

The rest of my 5* roster is similarly scattered. I think Hawkeye and Thanos are most complete at 11 and 12 covers, respectively, and then a few at 8 and less. BB, notably, is at 4 covers.

I don't have PX at all, and am willing to accept that Storm may need to slide off the list in order to ensure acquisition of a full clean slate later.

--Khanwulf 

Yea I would keep hoarding