Nerf Bishop

jgomes32

First thing i said about Bishop after his release pvp event was exactly that. Following Sim was prove. He is broken.

Steel_Colt

I'm not having that much problems facing Bishop, using JJ, Chavez and my own Bishop and matching either purple, green or yellow usually doesn't trigger him. 
But wouldn't an easy fix be to have his blue generating passive only proc once per turn?
That gives you some more time to come up with a counter move before being stun locked, without making Bishop completely useless.
Discuss. 

ammenell

i like playing bishop on autopilot to 2k in simulator, hunting gritty teams.

please just separate 4* und 5* players if he is too much for 5* rosters, lol

Zeofar

Steel_Colt said:

I'm not having that much problems facing Bishop, using JJ, Chavez and my own Bishop and matching either purple, green or yellow usually doesn't trigger him. 
But wouldn't an easy fix be to have his blue generating passive only proc once per turn?
That gives you some more time to come up with a counter move before being stun locked, without making Bishop completely useless.
Discuss. 

If you're going to go in that direction, it should just work as written and stop adding Blue AP once you're over 10 instead of continuing during cascades. Frankly, I'm a Bishop fan but the ability to go from 0 Blue to 20 in one turn is a bit much.

WEBGAS

NO NERFS..... only buffs !
upgrade 4* and 5* characters that need a revamp, or create a good counter.
But NO NERFS ANYMORE! 

peterdark

I'm not sure how giving Bishop a 'nerf' will help
 

AlexR

Can't we just add a clause to him that you can't run him with 5* team mates? Then he'd be useless for 5* land because you'd literally have to commit to running an entire 4* team against champed 5*, but remains unchanged for 4* land. No more Gritty/Bishop, but he'd get to still do his job in 4* land where fighting him isn't as difficult. 

Because I really want to keep Bishop for 4* land against all the Gritty teams. That's what he's there for. If a 4* isn't supposed to be a problem for 5* players, fine, but then I don't see why that needs to mean that 5* players should take our counter to the 5* that runs rampant in 4* land. 

#saveBishopIn4*land

DAZ0273

My earlier post was mostly in jest as I don't want anybody nerfed but to take this further it seems like the nerf Bishop crowd are justifying it because it applies to a certain sector in the game i.e. 5* play. How is this different to Kitty, who quite clearly is impacting 4* and below play? Kitty is everywhere and not just with R4G. If there is a team that can make specials, Kitty is on it. Everywhere, even over characters who are more highly levelled on players rosters. There are 1 cover Yellow Kitty teams out there apparently doing OK - HOW IS THAT NOT BROKEN? The given reason for nerfing OML was exactly the same - overuse by the playerbase with 1 or 2 covers in yellow. It is ridiculous. Kitty is ridiculous. Bishop is broken for a certain tier BUT so is Kitty for another tier and below.

So if you nerf Bishop, that doesn't solve the problem for the rest of the playerbase. So - nerf Bishop + nerf Kitty. It is the only fair way. Or leave them be and see how the game evolves.

Rod5

AlexR said:

Can't we just add a clause to him that you can't run him with 5* team mates? Then he'd be useless for 5* land because you'd literally have to commit to running an entire 4* team against champed 5*, but remains unchanged for 4* land. No more Gritty/Bishop, but he'd get to still do his job in 4* land where fighting him isn't as difficult. 

Because I really want to keep Bishop for 4* land against all the Gritty teams. That's what he's there for. If a 4* isn't supposed to be a problem for 5* players, fine, but then I don't see why that needs to mean that 5* players should take our counter to the 5* that runs rampant in 4* land. 

#saveBishopIn4*land

 You could basically do this by removing base match damage from the things which trigger his passive. Keep damage from powers and strike/attack tiles, but standard match damage should be ignored. That way he’s still a Gritty counter.

Daredevil217

Is it possible to add a poll? I’d like to see a quick snapshot of where people are at on this issue. 

tiomono

DAZ0273 said:

My earlier post was mostly in jest as I don't want anybody nerfed but to take this further it seems like the nerf Bishop crowd are justifying it because it applies to a certain sector in the game i.e. 5* play. How is this different to Kitty, who quite clearly is impacting 4* and below play? Kitty is everywhere and not just with R4G. If there is a team that can make specials, Kitty is on it. Everywhere, even over characters who are more highly levelled on players rosters. There are 1 cover Yellow Kitty teams out there apparently doing OK - HOW IS THAT NOT BROKEN? The given reason for nerfing OML was exactly the same - overuse by the playerbase with 1 or 2 covers in yellow. It is ridiculous. Kitty is ridiculous. Bishop is broken for a certain tier BUT so is Kitty for another tier and below.

So if you nerf Bishop, that doesn't solve the problem for the rest of the playerbase. So - nerf Bishop + nerf Kitty. It is the only fair way. Or leave them be and see how the game evolves.

Kitty and Logan are not the same. Kitty needs certain teams to be good. Logan was good on every team (although he was already not the top meta in 5* when he was nerfed). He was strong in lower tiers because he tanked nearly everything and healed off nearly all damage done to him.

To me kitty is like medusa. A good character on her own that shines when paired with certain characters. If you can put a character into any team at a tier and they dominate something may be off. IMO Characters are designed well when they are useable on their own but really shine when you build a team around them.

I have seen several people say bishop is working as intended because he shuts down gritty. But he doesn't just shut down gritty. He shuts down the entire 5* tier.

Name one other character in any tier that counters the entire tier above them.

DAZ0273

tiomono said:

DAZ0273 said:

My earlier post was mostly in jest as I don't want anybody nerfed but to take this further it seems like the nerf Bishop crowd are justifying it because it applies to a certain sector in the game i.e. 5* play. How is this different to Kitty, who quite clearly is impacting 4* and below play? Kitty is everywhere and not just with R4G. If there is a team that can make specials, Kitty is on it. Everywhere, even over characters who are more highly levelled on players rosters. There are 1 cover Yellow Kitty teams out there apparently doing OK - HOW IS THAT NOT BROKEN? The given reason for nerfing OML was exactly the same - overuse by the playerbase with 1 or 2 covers in yellow. It is ridiculous. Kitty is ridiculous. Bishop is broken for a certain tier BUT so is Kitty for another tier and below.

So if you nerf Bishop, that doesn't solve the problem for the rest of the playerbase. So - nerf Bishop + nerf Kitty. It is the only fair way. Or leave them be and see how the game evolves.

Kitty and Logan are not the same. Kitty needs certain teams to be good. Logan was good on every team (although he was already not the top meta in 5* when he was nerfed). He was strong in lower tiers because he tanked nearly everything and healed off nearly all damage done to him.

To me kitty is like medusa. A good character on her own that shines when paired with certain characters. If you can put a character into any team at a tier and they dominate something may be off. IMO Characters are designed well when they are useable on their own but really shine when you build a team around them.

I have seen several people say bishop is working as intended because he shuts down gritty. But he doesn't just shut down gritty. He shuts down the entire 5* tier.

Name one other character in any tier that counters the entire tier above them.

You say that yet I see her on many, many, many, many teams that are clearly "not good" whether they are poor Gritty's or other varieties and yet are apparently doing OK for that player as they are running that Kitty cover over other options they have in their roster who are levelled higher. Kitty + Daken? Check. Kitty + low cover OML? Check. Kitty + Carnage? Check. Kitty + Gamora w/out Rocket? Check. Goes on and on. So much Kitty, everywhere.

Her yellow starts it's work as soon as there are enough specials with ANY applicable partner, I see it as an exact correlation with OML (and he should not have been Nerfed either). Unless you can do something about her straight away or just overpower her then she shuts down the 4* tier and below in the same way that Bishop shuts down the 5* tier as being nothing more than an iso skip because she rampsup from nothing to you are all dead in very little time. Just based on her Yellow passive.

And Bishop is a good character on his own who shines against 5* teams. Don't see the difference with your "Kitty is a good character" example/paragraph.

Nerf Bishop, no problem by me but why is it that you don't play fair and nerf the issue that is affecting the 4* tier at the same time? 5* players want a 4* character nerfed that is affecting their tier of play, surely is is reasonable for 4* players to ask for a 5* character to be nerfed who is doing the exact same thing (but in greater numbers)?. 5* players can still run their 5* teams, 4* players can team R4G with somebody else for PvE.

The comparisons with Gambit are not relevant for me either as he was pretty much a 5* tier problem.

Not looking to fight over this or anything, I just don't see how players can call for such a significant Nerf without being willing the trade-off of another nerf so everybody gets a benefit.

Or wait and see how the game evolves and nerf nobody.

Borstock

I still say that all you need to do is remove his stun. It's not the AP generation that's bad. It's the stun lock. Let him generate all the blue AP he wants, but force teams to bring a stunner if they want to play the stun lock game. That way, they can't just lock you out and match dmg you to death with Gritty... because you can't bring Gritty and stun lock at the same time in that scenario.

Or just say he can't stun anyone if someone on the other team is already stunned. Turn it into a different power that destroys specials or something. That way, he is still a Gritty counter, still has his stun, but you still have a chance to... ya know... play.

MegaBee

It's selfish, but I'd like Bishop to remain as is.

BigSoftieFF

Maybe they’ll release a 2* character that the 4* guys have to drop down and use 2*s for. Then they can get hammered by everyone in their MMR as well 🤔 

DAZ0273

BigSoftieFF said:

Maybe they’ll release a 2* character that the 4* guys have to drop down and use 2*s for. Then they can get hammered by everyone in their MMR as well 🤔 

Your example is confusing - are you saying 5* players have to use 3* characters against Bishop?

BigSoftieFF

No we all know the delta between a 4 and 5 is too large as is, which is why 4*’s become pretty useless unless huge and boosted.

4 to 5 is very similar in power strength as 2 to 4. Technically something between a 2* and 3* would be better representative of the power gap.

Make it a 3* if you like. I’m sure the Grockamedusa folds would love dropping down a tier to deal with a 3*

DAZ0273

4* characters as useless as...Bishop and R4G!

It is simple - Nerf Bishop (no more 4* interfering in 5* play) AND nerf Kitty (no more 5* interfering in 4* play). Fair to all involved.

BigSoftieFF

I don’t care about 4*’s interfering in 5* play, just give me a suitable counter to chase.

tiomono

DAZ0273 said:

tiomono said:

DAZ0273 said:

My earlier post was mostly in jest as I don't want anybody nerfed but to take this further it seems like the nerf Bishop crowd are justifying it because it applies to a certain sector in the game i.e. 5* play. How is this different to Kitty, who quite clearly is impacting 4* and below play? Kitty is everywhere and not just with R4G. If there is a team that can make specials, Kitty is on it. Everywhere, even over characters who are more highly levelled on players rosters. There are 1 cover Yellow Kitty teams out there apparently doing OK - HOW IS THAT NOT BROKEN? The given reason for nerfing OML was exactly the same - overuse by the playerbase with 1 or 2 covers in yellow. It is ridiculous. Kitty is ridiculous. Bishop is broken for a certain tier BUT so is Kitty for another tier and below.

So if you nerf Bishop, that doesn't solve the problem for the rest of the playerbase. So - nerf Bishop + nerf Kitty. It is the only fair way. Or leave them be and see how the game evolves.

Kitty and Logan are not the same. Kitty needs certain teams to be good. Logan was good on every team (although he was already not the top meta in 5* when he was nerfed). He was strong in lower tiers because he tanked nearly everything and healed off nearly all damage done to him.

To me kitty is like medusa. A good character on her own that shines when paired with certain characters. If you can put a character into any team at a tier and they dominate something may be off. IMO Characters are designed well when they are useable on their own but really shine when you build a team around them.

I have seen several people say bishop is working as intended because he shuts down gritty. But he doesn't just shut down gritty. He shuts down the entire 5* tier.

Name one other character in any tier that counters the entire tier above them.

You say that yet I see her on many, many, many, many teams that are clearly "not good" whether they are poor Gritty's or other varieties and yet are apparently doing OK for that player as they are running that Kitty cover over other options they have in their roster who are levelled higher. Kitty + Daken? Check. Kitty + low cover OML? Check. Kitty + Carnage? Check. Kitty + Gamora w/out Rocket? Check. Goes on and on. So much Kitty, everywhere.

Her yellow starts it's work as soon as there are enough specials with ANY applicable partner, I see it as an exact correlation with OML (and he should not have been Nerfed either). Unless you can do something about her straight away or just overpower her then she shuts down the 4* tier and below in the same way that Bishop shuts down the 5* tier as being nothing more than an iso skip because she rampsup from nothing to you are all dead in very little time. Just based on her Yellow passive.

And Bishop is a good character on his own who shines against 5* teams. Don't see the difference with your "Kitty is a good character" example/paragraph.

Nerf Bishop, no problem by me but why is it that you don't play fair and nerf the issue that is affecting the 4* tier at the same time? 5* players want a 4* character nerfed that is affecting their tier of play, surely is is reasonable for 4* players to ask for a 5* character to be nerfed who is doing the exact same thing (but in greater numbers)?. 5* players can still run their 5* teams, 4* players can team R4G with somebody else for PvE.

The comparisons with Gambit are not relevant for me either as he was pretty much a 5* tier problem.

Not looking to fight over this or anything, I just don't see how players can call for such a significant Nerf without being willing the trade-off of another nerf so everybody gets a benefit.

Or wait and see how the game evolves and nerf nobody.

Kitty is with teammates, once conditions are met.

Bishop is once a 5* player makes a match 3, he hits you back for more damage and gains 5 blue. No team or conditions required.

There are also other options than just bishop to deal with kitty. Thanos, sabertooth, mehulk, medusa (if they dont have enough purple on kitty to overwrite cooldowns)

The game is made so that higher tiers are more powerful. So why should you have to change a character in a higher tier that is good vs the tier below them? The main problem with kitty. The one thing that takes her from strong to op is a 4* trashpanda.