Story Event Minimum Points - Trial Run (3/9/18)

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Comments

  • killerkoala
    killerkoala Posts: 1,185 Chairperson of the Boards
    grunth13 said:
    Seriously said:
    Hmm, are we seriously discussing milliseconds of play having an impact on results? Do players living near the servers have an inbuilt advantage?! Totes unfair. Please be trolling :open_mouth:
    You do understand that the tapping is an issue in CL 9 for 1 and only 1 reason...the top 5 legendary token.  People are spending hours...not minutes, not seconds, HOURS tapping a node in each sub so that they can get 1 extra legendary token for not the sub..but EVENT.  So, yes, for these people, milliseconds will count because it will impact their play.
    why is it a bad thing to tap?  if someone is willing to spend all that time, isn't it their choice and as a matter a fact ur choice not to
  • Jomu5
    Jomu5 Posts: 32 Just Dropped In
    Sm0keyJ0e said:
    Jomu5 said:
    This is such an experimental and outlandish step, I'm glad they are just trialling it in a single event. 

    Experimental and outlandish? What are you talking about? They're just duplicating what already exists for easy nodes. This is about the least outlandish thing they've ever tried.
    I guess my hyperbole was not as exaggerated as I hoped. Do I need to find tags for sarcasm?
  • Hadronic
    Hadronic Posts: 338 Mover and Shaker
    killerkoala said:
    grunth13 said:
    Seriously said:
    Hmm, are we seriously discussing milliseconds of play having an impact on results? Do players living near the servers have an inbuilt advantage?! Totes unfair. Please be trolling :open_mouth:
    You do understand that the tapping is an issue in CL 9 for 1 and only 1 reason...the top 5 legendary token.  People are spending hours...not minutes, not seconds, HOURS tapping a node in each sub so that they can get 1 extra legendary token for not the sub..but EVENT.  So, yes, for these people, milliseconds will count because it will impact their play.
    why is it a bad thing to tap?  if someone is willing to spend all that time, isn't it their choice and as a matter a fact ur choice not to
    The problem with tapping is that its monotonous. 
    When monotonous tasks are left in game and they give an advantage, they will inevitably lead to bots.
  • NewMcG
    NewMcG Posts: 368 Mover and Shaker
    grunth13 said:
    So, as I said, CL 9 is another beast compared to the other CL because top 5 gets a legendary token which is what caused the proliferation of the tapping in the first place. 
    People are tapping in other brackets as well, just 9 is the most obvious, as the big fish play up there.

    And if it's a difference of "milliseconds" like you say, then for every thousand times they tap they save a few seconds, and make up maybe one more tap... Woo freaking hoo.

    It's not a matter of faster connection when you're talking about hours of time tapping. It isn't cutting tap times in half if it's "milliseconds". It's adding that tiny extra amount of saved time converted into maybe a few more points worth of taps.
  • PenniesForEveryone
    PenniesForEveryone Posts: 294 Mover and Shaker
    Seriously said:
    Hmm, are we seriously discussing milliseconds of play having an impact on results? Do players living near the servers have an inbuilt advantage?! Totes unfair. Please be trolling :open_mouth:
    It adds up.  When you have to tap the screen 10 times between fights, a difference of 0.05 seconds between each screen across platforms would be a little over 100 points different over the course of a full 100,000 point event.

    30 seconds slower for each sub makes a noticeable difference.  That's 30 seconds of refresh that you don't get on all nodes.  When T5 scores differ by single digit points sometimes the device/platform can absolutely mean the difference between getting an LT vs. not.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 5,850 Chairperson of the Boards
    It's nice that they're finally fixing this.  Now we can get back to what pve is truly about: who can get the first Court Death off fastest.
  • grunth13
    grunth13 Posts: 608 Critical Contributor
    edited March 2018
    New McG said:
    grunth13 said:
    So, as I said, CL 9 is another beast compared to the other CL because top 5 gets a legendary token which is what caused the proliferation of the tapping in the first place. 
    People are tapping in other brackets as well, just 9 is the most obvious, as the big fish play up there.

    And if it's a difference of "milliseconds" like you say, then for every thousand times they tap they save a few seconds, and make up maybe one more tap... Woo freaking hoo.

    It's not a matter of faster connection when you're talking about hours of time tapping. It isn't cutting tap times in half if it's "milliseconds". It's adding that tiny extra amount of saved time converted into maybe a few more points worth of taps.
    As you said in a previous post, you missed a clear by 10 minutes and dropped from 2nd to 12th place in CL7 or 8.  In CL9, that would have dropped you from 2nd to out of top 20 most likely.  If I was playing cl 7 or 8, top 10 or top 25 or top 50 isn't a big thing because the rewards are very similar.  In CL 9, if you aren't top 5, you may as well be top 20 because the rewards aren't much different outside of top 5.  But, if you want top 5, you have to be exact and have the strongest speed of internet with strongest phone because the other 5 are going to be just as exact or more so than you.  In strange sights, I was 7th in prejoin 4.9 with a score of 112346.  5th place was 112421.  Thats 75 points difference over 3 subs, 25 points per sub.  Do you think seconds or milliseconds could have acounted for that score change.  As someone noted there are 6 screens between finishing 1 match to starting the second match.  If each screen takes milliseconds longer depending on strength of internet or speed of phone, that adds up because you have to do that at minimum 198-216 times (depending on wave nodes) in your inital clears and another minimum 162 times at end clear per SUB.  It definitely adds up.
  • Punter1
    Punter1 Posts: 729 Critical Contributor
    aesthetocyst said:
    Have to stop screwing around and close the exploit completely. Kill it at the root.

    Or just remove placement rewards, or make placement rewards less meaningful. 

    Boss events have all the rewards in prog (for sure not enough) but a model like that would work much better for PVE style play.  No competition other than you vs. the game.

  • bluewolf
    bluewolf Posts: 5,824 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2018
    Punter1 said:
    aesthetocyst said:
    Have to stop screwing around and close the exploit completely. Kill it at the root.

    Or just remove placement rewards, or make placement rewards less meaningful. 

    Boss events have all the rewards in prog (for sure not enough) but a model like that would work much better for PVE style play.  No competition other than you vs. the game.

    I would make the point that the current plan - to run boss Events more often - is an effective way to reduce the overall importance of placement in the game, at least a little.
  • Freelancer
    Freelancer Posts: 122 Tile Toppler
    I'm all for this test. I was actually surprised that this new system wasn't what they introduced when they got rid of the old 'Tapping'.

    Hopefully the data gathered from this test dosen't cause the dev's to panic when they find out that a number of users play-time has reduced a fair bit.
  • STERLING21JJ
    STERLING21JJ Posts: 103 Tile Toppler
    This is great news :) 
  • rixmith
    rixmith Posts: 707 Critical Contributor
    I don't tap. Therefore this is good for me.  Yay!
  • Kevmcg
    Kevmcg Posts: 122 Tile Toppler
    Great News! Turns PVE back into a race of initial clears and then risk/reward of how long you can wait to start final grind and still finish. First PVE with wave nodes will reward those players that can time their clears (and connection speed) right . lol
  • Dartmaster01
    Dartmaster01 Posts: 634 Critical Contributor
    rixmith said:
    I don't tap. Therefore this is good for me.  Yay!
    I do tap and this is good for me also. Praise be to our merciful overlords for saving us from ourselves.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited March 2018
    Looking at the comments in here, the majority of the players are happy to see this implemented. I'm happy as well. Let's remember that it's a trial and if the responses after post-trial still indicate that majority of the players are happy, D3 could implement it in the long run. 

    On the other hand, there are players worrying about not having the fastest internet
    speed and latest phone model and they expect D3 to do something about it. I'm not sure if they have a genuine concern or if they are trolling. I don't think D3 can do anything about it and having in-game stopwatch doesn't help because if your connection can't send data fast enough (due to your internet service provider or because some of your family members are sucking up the bandwidth for their Netflix etc) to their servers or if your device freeze up, you might have a worse tradeoff. I'm sure there are players who are going to put a stopwatch beside them if this is implemented. Another point is you don't need to send GB of data per match to their server. Probably a couple of MBs or even a few hundred KBs of data?

  • NewMcG
    NewMcG Posts: 368 Mover and Shaker
    grunth13 said:
    As you said in a previous post, you missed a clear by 10 minutes and dropped from 2nd to 12th place in CL7 or 8.  In CL9, that would have dropped you from 2nd to out of top 20 most likely.  If I was playing cl 7 or 8, top 10 or top 25 or top 50 isn't a big thing because the rewards are very similar.  In CL 9, if you aren't top 5, you may as well be top 20 because the rewards aren't much different outside of top 5.  But, if you want top 5, you have to be exact and have the strongest speed of internet with strongest phone because the other 5 are going to be just as exact or more so than you.  In strange sights, I was 7th in prejoin 4.9 with a score of 112346.  5th place was 112421.  Thats 75 points difference over 3 subs, 25 points per sub.  Do you think seconds or milliseconds could have acounted for that score change.  As someone noted there are 6 screens between finishing 1 match to starting the second match.  If each screen takes milliseconds longer depending on strength of internet or speed of phone, that adds up because you have to do that at minimum 198-216 times (depending on wave nodes) in your inital clears and another minimum 162 times at end clear per SUB.  It definitely adds up.
    I missed top 10 by about 500, and top 5 by about 1500, and didn't hit almost half of the final 3 clears. I might have left 2000 points on the table with time running out before I hit most of the easy nodes at all, and hitting the hard and required nodes twice each before I ran out of time.

    Refresh rates for most nodes seem to be about a point every 10-15 minutes, give or take. So, no, seconds or milliseconds don't account for points that easily. Bigger rosters that can go faster account for that. If you give my roster with baby champed 5s the fastest connection in the world, and a whale with 550s the worst, slowest device that will run the game, I'm still not competing with that kind of roster when it comes to speed of clears. And 9 is where those rosters run, and if they end up in your bracket, well, good luck, because you can't keep up, no matter what you're playing on. (And deservedly so, for what they're investing to get those rosters.)
  • Stax the Foyer
    Stax the Foyer Posts: 941 Critical Contributor
    My proposal of scoring a node based on time elapsed from match start to winning move would remove a bunch of variables with respect to connection speed, and would allow it to be independent of start times.  Slow gameplay would still be an issue.

    So there's stuff that they could do, but those are more drastic changes, whereas this is a quick move in a positive direction.

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