End of WIN Season Follow up, how did you enjoy the WIN system?

Magic

No i disliked the win based system but played more

Many have said it before so no point in speaking a lot - i just want to add a voice to the vote.

I don't like the system and was forced to play more (74 wins in SIM). But I've got substantially less rewards. I did not hit max progression for the season (8500 points and something like 260 wins). I have also not get a single 4* (as 26-28 wins in one event was my max - the rest - 16-20 wins). 

5* players with 2 champions (OML and Strange). Overall - a bad change for me but with potential. I still love the fact that I can get the progression without worrying about points loss. It's just how far the carrot is that I don't like.

Lower the 4* to 30 wins (max), lower the max season requirement to 20 wins per PvP + the SIM, lower the SIM to 50-60 wins max and open up the MMR after certain amount of wins or give all players 10 seeds to start with. Couple of simple solutions that would work for me.

Daredevil217

Beer40 said:

I like the win based system in theory.

Much like most other things in the game the implementation is just wrong.

1) Command points should be moved back into progression. 
2) Put the 4* cover at 28 wins.
3) Put the 15 CP at 40 wins.

I wonder if the 5* players would be mad if the CP was moved back into progression at 40. Might make a separate thread about this, but I could see people saying “before I could hop in late, find a lower bracket and place top 10 easily.  Now they are MAKING me slog through 40 Panthos and Gambolt teams!  I’m not doing it!!”

Cwilk78 said:

Please go back to the old system ASAP!!

When will people understand this isn’t happening?  The old system was broken and in desperate need of fixing. You could argue the new system is no better or perhaps even worse (I would disagree with that), but going back to the old system isn’t happening. Either roll out a third system (probably not happening) or tweak the one we have (best case scenario).

STOPTHIS said:

They also really need to do something about defensive wins. I know why they don't. It's super exploitable, but I was running a scumbag Gambat team and racking up defensive wins.

Lol. I was kind of with you until that last part. Not much sympathy after reading that!

Overall I liked it. I hit 40 every event, played a much wider variety of teams seeing as how defense and speed weren’t as important, saved a ton on hero points (which is important as I have an influx of 3* dupes around the corner all of which will be needing roster spots- damn me for trying to level evenly), I also got to play on my own time. I want to say 40 was a slog (and I mean it was), but am ashamed to admit that there were SOME times when I wanted to play but already hit my 40, finished Sim, and either hadn’t started PVE or was waiting to do my clears. 

I would sign any petition asking to lower the amount of wins or put the CP back in progression. Absolutely. But on the whole I much preferred this to the old system. 

broll

Yes I liked the win based system and played the same or less

I was on vacation for about 2 weeks of the season and didn't do any PvP (other than some Saakar seed rounds) that whole time, so it's not clear how much is not playing and how much is win based change.

Typically I end the season around 300 by ending most PvPs at around 900 and the sim ~1500.
This season I ranked 1391 and got the lowest reward.  I only missed out on 50 HP, 5 CP, and 1 HT so the difference is an absolute joke so I could care less...
As noted I missed several PvPs completely, the ones I did complete I got the 4* and stop and never shielded.  Making my ending points in the 500-600 range instead of the previous 900.

What's even more interesting is my alliance rank went up.  Typically we are in the 300-500 range somewhere. This season we were 216 so we all got additional 1000 ISO and 1 HT.  So all in all the reward change was +1000 ISO, -50 HP, & -5 CP.  Certainly not worth doing effort to correct.

The bigger loss is the individual placement rewards for each event, but again not so much that I'm call fora change to win based or put more effort than I did last season.

Jarvind

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

Miserable. I went from regularly hitting 900 to just over 600. I would've done less, even, and just stopped at 16 wins for the CP without shielding, but alliance is still gunning for t100 each event for now.

alaeth

Indifferent to the win based system and played more

As long as I have been able to start "on-time" (read: as soon as the event starts), I've had no issue getting seeds and making 100+ wins.

What I find more difficult is the competitiveness for top placement spots - due to moving CP from progression to placement.

Brackets from 6 through 8 are jam-packed at the top end with more competitive players than there are spots for CP placement.  Every single event this season, someone I know has missed out on CP due to too many players vying for too few spots.

Since CP is the ONLY top-end commodity that matters, this is accelerating the burn-out of top players.


The mechanics of PvP points still favors late-joining (+75 pts trumps +35pts every time).  I start early, but rarely make top placement... it's just too costly to burn 2000hp in shields every single event to stay on top.



The wins-based progression was an attempt to curb this disparity, but it's still not enough...

Pinko_McFly

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

Any time I did go for 40 wins and the CP was by utilizing a 0/0/5 3* Gambit.
Exploiting a broken character is the only thing that made the requirements bearable, and that's not a good thing.
I would not have felt the need to make this character if the old system was in place.

ZeiramMR

Yes I liked the win based system and played the same or less

Putting aside the Command Point discussion, my impact to this season had significant reduction from the Arena Lightning Rounds. When those were going, I prioritized play time on those and didn't push as high for progressions in some of the PVPs running simultaneously.

thedarkphoenix

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

I don’t like how man wins you needed to progress especially if you’re in 5 land.

otherwise it’s ok

if they just opened up the mmr after 12 progression wins I think it would be fine

aa25

No i disliked the win based system but played more

I really hate the change, but I ended up playing more chasing the 4*.

The truth is I partly wanted to see how enjoyable it is. After one full season, my conclusion is that this is no fun at all. It is nothing but a mindless grinding and tapping. To be honest, I'm surprised that some people found this wins-based "fun".

In the old pts-based, there is always the fun when you decide how to pick your opponents, calculate how long it will take, likelihood of getting tapped during those time, how to run a good, strong, and solid team, calculate risks of win vs. lose, etc. All of these are now gone, and are replaced with constant mind numbing tapping.

I really hope that there will be some announcement about fixing this (yes, I consider this 40-wins is a flaw, a big one even) before the next season. I can't picture myself playing PvP for 40 wins next season if this 40 wins continues, and it's very likely that I'll turn PvP to another variant of DDQ.

Set that aside, I hope that the devs know the different between "play more because PvP is more fun" and "play more because the rewards require more effort".

Just to be clear, my main issues are 1) 40-wins is way way way too high and 2) moving CP to placement is really bad to progressing rosters.

monsieurmojo

I Quit PVP due to the win based system

The first half of the season, I played a few events to 16 wins, and one to 40 (I believe it was for the Nightcrawler cover).  I also played SHIELD Sim to 74 wins, and only because it was a Rogue cover.  But these were all such a slog, that I more or less stopped playing PVP altogether in the second half of the season.  As others have commented, I found I hit 2000 points in Sim around 45 wins, and was usually hitting 900 points in the 22-26 wins range.  Having to play 150% more PVP for the same rewards is just not something I have any desire to do, and this is directing me (and many others I know) into a more casual, PVE-only style of play.

Addaran

Yes i liked the win based system and played more

Was playing very little before in PVP, cause it wasn't worth it.

Played a lot more. I went for 40 wins a few times, the others 24 for the HP. (had to skip Iron Fist totally cause i was away 2 of the 3 days).

Definitively prefer not losing progression when you lose/get attacked.

Having the number be a bit lower then 40 would be nice.
Seems it would help a lot of people to still have CP in progression or for more then just T10.

Blindman13

Yes I liked the win based system and played the same or less

I don't like the poll options. 
The problem is that I like the concept of wins based progression, but I don't like the high progression requirements they set.
I maybe played a little, more that I had in the past.  I reached full progression in SIM because I wanted the Rogue cover. I had never done that before, but I never tried because each time I made progress I would get hammered back down. Now I'm happy to leave myself out there as fodder for those going for placement while I get a win here and there between PvE grinds.

farlus

No i disliked the win based system but played more

I started the season in CL6 since I figured I would need to drop down from CL8 for CP placement, but after a couple of events getting near 2k scores in CL6 and still missing CP I decided to go back to CL8 and just go for progression rather than placement since it was almost certain I'd miss placement. I ended up getting the CP in CL8 almost every event with far lower scores, oddly enough. I really dislike the wins based system, especially with 1 champed 5*. Only positive is by not going for placement I saved a ton of HP on shields, so I guess that's the new strategy - start late, grind until your eyes bleed, and hope for CP. Really fun, let me tell you. /s

White_Deth

Indifferent to the win based system and played more

Got the rogue and was outta there. I do like the wins based system for each individual tourney though. I would always get beat down before the cp and if i ever got past the cp beat down even furthe lol

GKar

No i disliked the win based system but played more

I played much more, but I had the time (which I usually don't), and I don't see how this amount of play is good long term.  Idea is solid, but lower wins by 20-25%, and open up SCL9 for PVP and give CP down to top 50 to keep high end players out of SCL 5-7.

Players having to play this increased amount over time will lead to burn out, job loss, or spouse loss.

Beer40

Yes I liked the win based system and played the same or less

I found this on the NBA 2k18 Reddit page. I thought it was very interesting and since these PVP posts seem to drum up this particular discussion quite a bit, a la "Who pays the bills? Who are they gonna listen to?" I thought I'd share. Now its not a perfect comparison as you're comparing all micro transaction game vs paid copy + micro transactions, but it may give some insight as to where PVP will head in the near future.

I had the opportunity of speaking to someone who worked in Activision and helped the development of DLC for multiple COD games before leaving for another opportunity. I took the chance to ask them about MTX and whether they thought it was negatively or positively impacting the gaming industry and I was kind of stunned how few people it takes to make MTX insanely profitable.

They said that after GTA V came out and developers saw the huge success GTAV:O was having with their Shark Cards, it blew the industry wide open for everyone to try and find their own MTX system that worked. They said Advanced Warfare was the first "test case" so to speak where they tried to implement loot crates and they saw the huge potential but it needed a lot of refinement. Eventually, BO3 rolls around and it was ready to be released with a good system and plan in mind for MTX and loot crates were a huge profitable success.

They said that the most astonishing part though was how profitable these MTX schemes were by only having such small portion of player base buying into them. If at least a fraction (<10%) spent money, it was unbelievably profitable. Not only that, but there was the (<1%) who spend astronomical amounts of money alone and made up the bulk of the profits. They gave accounts of single individuals who would drop over $10k on loot crates alone. Those were the extremes, but it goes to show how effective the system could by pulling people to drop anywhere from small fortunes to $60 here and there on a frequent basis. Because of those few people, now we are where we are. The problem is that unless the larger community understands this situation and refuses to buy the ENTIRE game OUTRIGHT, it doesn't really matter or make a difference if we just ignore the MTX system when we play. By playing, we become complacent and agree to a small percentage of people dictating the experience the larger community has. Games are no longer being made for people like us, their being made for the few suckers that fall into the MTX system, but those few end up basically dictating the development of the entire game for the rest of us.

TLDR; Unless people stop purchasing entire games outright, and not just resorting to ignoring MTX after buying the game, the small fraction of players who buy into these systems will always dictate that games revolve around a system of MTX. The only way for us to counteract the huge incentives these companies make by including MTX is by making them lose out on far larger amounts by having masses of people refusing to pay the initial $60 for the game in the first place. If not, we've got a dreadful future to look forward to in the gaming community.

Meander

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

I think colog put it well,  and his comment about hitting 1200 in 20 matches or so sums up my last 2 events.  I joined slices 5 and 2 respectively,  hit pretty much anything that moved to t5 in my bracket,  dropped a 3 hour shield and called it good.  Both times i was around 1150 points and did finish t5, but had under 24 wins.  So from that aspect, I enjoyed the reduced time commitment,  less shields,  and getting cp under 1200, but loathed missing some rewards.  Overall,  i came out feeling not great about the system in general. And sim was awful.  My season rank was t250, which is a severe drop for me, but a large reason for that was missing 4 events for vacation

ZeroKarma

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

I found that I was doing well in the beginning and not really adjusting my play style. That still gave me T10 placement and all of the prog rewards. 

Then the season continued, and the slog took me. I had a busy schedule during the last couple of events and didn't get progression or cp. This system rewards grinders much like PvE and doesn't have space for much else. You can't mail it in occasionally like you could in the past. 

I don't really expect much to be changed at this point except they absolutely must fix Sim. I don't think there's a single positive review of that aspect. It's atrocious and boring. Even moreso than the rest of PvP. 

Outlook for next year is playing less. The changes to PvP and the failure on D3's part to trry and rein in cheating this season have really sapped my interest. If it wasn't for my alliance and friends on LINE I would have completely walked away already. 

tbighead21

No I disliked the win based system and played the same or less

This wins based system is pretty lame. 
It didn’t affect me that much and I Played about the same amount. 
Averaged 20 wins each pvp. High was 22. Low was 16. 
I did play more sim matches than ever before (50). 
I hope the amounts required are lowered. 

ZootSax

Indifferent to the win based system and played the same or less

I thought the old system was a tedious slog and never hit 1,200/Top10 anyway, so I am indifferent to the current system.   I hit 40 wins once, but it wasn't enjoyable, so I doubt i would do it again except for 4* characters I really like or if it would fully cover a 5/5/2.  I sympathize with the higher tier players for the loss of the CP, but frankly I still think matchmaking is FAR more of a problem in both systems than anything inherent to the systems themselves.  I'll likely remain a 10CP & done player, at best, which is the same as before.