**** Rogue (Classic) ****

D4Ni13

fahq1977 said:

Tiger Wong said:

Yeah. If they fire a red, yellow, or green power, she steps in front and mitigates the damage. It doesn’t affect attack tiles or passive damage though.

This is not accurate.  She steps in front if the opponent makes a red yellow or green MATCH.  Unless rogue is ALREADY in front before the enemies turn, she has no effect on a fired power, regardless of the color.  Since the turn is over after a non-match 5, the opponent will almost always fire powers first, which means rogue is ONLY able to reduce power damage if you made a match that put her in front.

She WILL cut any red, yellow or green match damage in half as long as two teammates are up and you have her fully covered in yellow.  That helps, but is not great.  As Himatako showed, it doesn't nerf strike tiles..  

But her true strength in yellow is 4 or 5 covers and matching strategically when the AI is ready to fire a power.

I may add that if the enemy activates a power and so makes a cascade, if that cascade result in red, green or yellow matches, Rogue would come to front and take the rest of the damage.

As so if Riri for example would use her blue, she will proceed to switch the center tiles and make red charged tiles. If she doesn't trigger any cascade, she must surely match red, so Rogue would get in front and take the (reduced if 4/5 yellow covers) ability damage that resolves afterwards. The same would happen with Daken, if he matches green when using his blue.

@Fahq1977 are you sure about strike tiles ? Where is the test you mentioned about ? It should reduce that damage too... maybe a bug ?

fork1977

D4Ni13 said:
I may add that if the enemy activates a power and so makes a cascade, if that cascade result in red, green or yellow matches, Rogue would come to front and take the rest of the damage.

As so if Riri for example would use her blue, she will proceed to switch the center tiles and make red charged tiles. If she doesn't trigger any cascade, she must surely match red, so Rogue would get in front and take the (reduced if 4/5 yellow covers) ability damage that resolves afterwards. The same would happen with Daken, if he matches green when using his blue.

@Fahq1977 are you sure about strike tiles ? Where is the test you mentioned about ? It should reduce that damage too... maybe a bug ?

Good point about Riri, situational based on a couple opponents, but still good counters nonetheless

as for the strike tiles, check page 5 of this thread. Those are his calculations. I haven’t tested it in detail. But it doesn’t seem to apply rogues mitigation as an even 50% to whatever match damage total strike tiles would cause. There seems to be good damage reduction to matches, just a little wonkier than halving the total

 But again, I can’t confirm, taking Himatako’s word. 

Jaedenkaal

fahq1977 said:
Good point about Riri, situational based on a couple opponents, but still good counters nonetheless

as for the strike tiles, check page 5 of this thread. Those are his calculations. I haven’t tested it in detail. But it doesn’t seem to apply rogues mitigation as an even 50% to whatever match damage total strike tiles would cause. There seems to be good damage reduction to matches, just a little wonkier than halving the total

 But again, I can’t confirm, taking Himatako’s word. 

Himatako's post is about strike tiles and Power Siphon, not strike tiles and Leading the Charge.

Anon

Her Power Siphon animation is easily my favorite in the game.

D4Ni13

fahq1977 said:

D4Ni13 said:
I may add that if the enemy activates a power and so makes a cascade, if that cascade result in red, green or yellow matches, Rogue would come to front and take the rest of the damage.

As so if Riri for example would use her blue, she will proceed to switch the center tiles and make red charged tiles. If she doesn't trigger any cascade, she must surely match red, so Rogue would get in front and take the (reduced if 4/5 yellow covers) ability damage that resolves afterwards. The same would happen with Daken, if he matches green when using his blue.

@Fahq1977 are you sure about strike tiles ? Where is the test you mentioned about ? It should reduce that damage too... maybe a bug ?

Good point about Riri, situational based on a couple opponents, but still good counters nonetheless

as for the strike tiles, check page 5 of this thread. Those are his calculations. I haven’t tested it in detail. But it doesn’t seem to apply rogues mitigation as an even 50% to whatever match damage total strike tiles would cause. There seems to be good damage reduction to matches, just a little wonkier than halving the total

 But again, I can’t confirm, taking Himatako’s word. 

Riri & Rogue can counter themselves, as Riri can get her gauntlets beyond Rogue, and I believe she won't reduce the damage even if she is in front (? - must be tested), and Rogue can jump in at Riri's blue.

About Himatako, he was talking about Power Siphon match bonus not stacking with other bonuses (take the bigger bonus instead). He used strike tiles to prove that. It has nothing to do with Rogue's damage mitigation.

fork1977

Okay, thanks for the correction. I’ll test strike tiles later today or tomorrow

D4Ni13

I think Rogue actually can reduce damage for herself as well (meaning she could reach 75% damage reduction at 5 covers). 

Played against her in Simulator and she had 4 covers in yellow (block 20% for each team mate). And when I did 5200 damage on the board she only took 2080 damage. The same happened when I matched for 4800, she only took about 1920 damage. This numbers represent 40% of the damage, meaning that she blocked 60% (so herself included).

Can someone test this to see if it is true for them as well ? 

@Brigby is this intended, or a bug. Should Rogue reduce damage for herself too or only for allies ? The label indicate that she would be similar to OML and count only allies, but what happened in Simulator indicates something else. 

D4Ni13

mexus said:

D4Ni13 said:

I think Rogue actually can reduce damage for herself as well (meaning she could reach 75% damage reduction at 5 covers). 

Played against her in Simulator and she had 4 covers in yellow (block 20% for each team mate). And when I did 5200 damage on the board she only took 2080 damage. The same happened when I matched for 4800, she only took about 1920 damage. This numbers represent 40% of the damage, meaning that she blocked 60% (so herself included).

Can someone test this to see if it is true for them as well ? 

@Brigby is this intended, or a bug. Should Rogue reduce damage for herself too or only for allies ? The label indicate that she would be similar to OML and count only allies, but what happened in Simulator indicates something else. 

Lets talk about Peggy:
"Stuns all enemies but the target for 3 turns and places one 3-turn Blue Countdown tile (that deals 102 damage) for each active ally"

When she + two allies are active she places 3 countdown tiles.

Added test results: 

https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/68168/rogue-reduces-damage-for-all-team-members-protect-tiles-greatly-increase-the-reduction-somehow/p1?new=1

Anon

Getting your ap denied sucks. Getting your damage reduced sucks as well. Getting both done while eating a nuke later on sucks even more.

Rogue is shaping up to be a premier defense character. She's already been introduced to my "Kill First" list.

I'm glad that they made her so ridiculously good without being overpowered.

Vhailorx

She does seem like an idea defensive character.  Punishes you for killing her firsr with damage resistance, but also punishes you for leaving her by jumping in front and eventually nuking.  

And that's before discussing her crazy good (at least when used by a human) power siphon.

Vhailorx

D4Ni13 said:

I think Rogue actually can reduce damage for herself as well (meaning she could reach 75% damage reduction at 5 covers). 

Played against her in Simulator and she had 4 covers in yellow (block 20% for each team mate). And when I did 5200 damage on the board she only took 2080 damage. The same happened when I matched for 4800, she only took about 1920 damage. This numbers represent 40% of the damage, meaning that she blocked 60% (so herself included).

Can someone test this to see if it is true for them as well ? 

@Brigby is this intended, or a bug. Should Rogue reduce damage for herself too or only for allies ? The label indicate that she would be similar to OML and count only allies, but what happened in Simulator indicates something else. 

I think OML is a special case post nerf.  He used to count himself as an ally (as peggy and apparently rogue still do).

So how about we un-nerf OML to fix the problem?  The nerf was never necessary, and looks even sillier now with spidey, dd, and gambit in the 5* tier.

Brigby

Hi Everyone. Yes. It is intended for Rogue to count herself as a teammate, when calculating damage reduction.

D4Ni13

Vhailorx said:

D4Ni13 said:

I think Rogue actually can reduce damage for herself as well (meaning she could reach 75% damage reduction at 5 covers). 

Played against her in Simulator and she had 4 covers in yellow (block 20% for each team mate). And when I did 5200 damage on the board she only took 2080 damage. The same happened when I matched for 4800, she only took about 1920 damage. This numbers represent 40% of the damage, meaning that she blocked 60% (so herself included).

Can someone test this to see if it is true for them as well ? 

@Brigby is this intended, or a bug. Should Rogue reduce damage for herself too or only for allies ? The label indicate that she would be similar to OML and count only allies, but what happened in Simulator indicates something else. 

I think OML is a special case post nerf.  He used to count himself as an ally (as peggy and apparently rogue still do).

So how about we un-nerf OML to fix the problem?  The nerf was never necessary, and looks even sillier now with spidey, dd, and gambit in the 5* tier.

Now that you mentioned, he did count before nerf. Oh, well.

I don't mind un-nerfing him, but I don't expect to ever see him as he was before, if that is the case. It's pretty clear they didn't like how easily he managed to save health packs. And it's not because they want people to buy packs, but rather the fact that having him in that state would give players a huge advantage in the last grind of a sub and the beginning of the next one. 

As it is now, you have to manage your health packs and be forced to switch heroes if you get out of them. Pre-Nerf OML was just too good at that. 

cpeyton3535

Anon said:

Getting your ap denied sucks. Getting your damage reduced sucks as well. Getting both done while eating a nuke later on sucks even more.

Rogue is shaping up to be a premier defense character. She's already been introduced to my "Kill First" list.

I'm glad that they made her so ridiculously good without being overpowered.

Well-stated!

The 3* Essential node in Round 1 of the Simulator with her, 5* Gambit and Teen Jean had me cussing to make a sailor blush last night.  Trying to get Gambit off the board before he gets going is tough when Rogue keeps jumping in front.  She just went up the list in my ISO-spend Chart!

atomzed

Agree! The simulator pve showed me how good she is, as a defence character. Wanted to kill gambit but Rogue just keep popping in front. I had to carefully avoid green, yellow, red so i can match dmg gambit. 

and now that it’s confirmed she has up to 75% dmg reduction, she is just too good a character. in the end i had to use stun to keep her passive suppressed while i kill her. 

i think she’s going to be a terrific pvp character. both on defence and on offence. 

D4Ni13

atomzed said:

Agree! The simulator pve showed me how good she is, as a defence character. Wanted to kill gambit but Rogue just keep popping in front. I had to carefully avoid green, yellow, red so i can match dmg gambit. 

and now that it’s confirmed she has up to 75% dmg reduction, she is just too good a character. in the end i had to use stun to keep her passive suppressed while i kill her. 

i think she’s going to be a terrific pvp character. both on defence and on offence. 

I just killed her first and then went for the others. Gambit was a bit of a pain afterwars because he had a lot of mana and kept activating powers, but it's hard to keep Rogue out of the fight without stunning her. You eventually need to match her colors. And if you rely on special tiles, matching her colors means you get the extra damage into her wall as well.

Gamora or Iceman are good against her. Cheap stun to keep her out of the way. Adding Grocket next to Gamora and having both champed made the nodes a lot more easier. But they won't be boosted all the time.

Rogue will indeed be a look out for. That's why I'm planning to chase her as soon as she hit the packs.

ammenell

when will she be available in tokens, next season or the season after that? 

D4Ni13

mexus said:

ammenell said:

when will she be available in tokens, next season or the season after that? 

 I really hope when next season starts aka in about a week.

Me too. I have my mini hoard ready for her. The wait is killing me.

hopper1979

I was looking forward to her just because of her green.  I needed to see the yellow in action and it is much better than I expected.  Time to start saving planing how to counter her we will be seeing her alot.

D4Ni13

hopper1979 said:

I was looking forward to her just because of her green.  I needed to see the yellow in action and it is much better than I expected.  Time to start saving planing how to counter her we will be seeing her alot.

I guess the best counter for her is to stun (Gamora or Iceman) or sent her airborne (Riri, Nova). In some matches prioritizing her would be good, but in others could be detrimental, since that is the role of tank, to keep the focus out of the other guys. Will be interesting to see new strategies around her.