**** Rogue (Classic) ****

Spoit

13k damage for 5 AP? That can't possibly be right, right?

DrDevilDinosaur

Spoit said:

13k damage for 5 AP? That can't possibly be right, right?

the 13k damage comes when you reach 14 AP in whichever colour you are targeting with Power Siphon.

1. 5AP to convert Gloves Off to Power Siphon (Siphon targets the opposing team's strongest colour)
2. At the start of your turn, Power Siphon attempts to spend 14 AP from the colour it is targeting - if I does, it deals damage and converts the ability to Gloves Off again.

It's still a good power, but the description in OP is a little confusing, since numbers are listed twice but don't match. I found it better to read the ability via the in-game preview.

D4Ni13

After reading the descriptions in game, I have just one question: does Power Siphon last until you manage to deal damage, or does it last only 1 turn ? 

SpringSoldier

Her design is great, her powers are interesting and she's a brand new shiny character in a game with a lot of duplicates/triplicates/quadruplicates. Now I can hope for Shadowcat and Nightcrawler as well.

D4Ni13

After playing with her in SHIELD Training, this is what I've seen. 

Green: 
You need 5 green AP to fire up, and it changes to a passive of the strongest color of the enemy in front. You can switch the enemies in front and see their strong color in the ability description. 

In the loner node you will have Moon Knight (Black), Daken (Black) and Magneto (Blue). So lets say Moon Knight is in front, this will change into a Black passive, and it will stay as so until you collect black 14 AP and deal the damage. 

So you can keep the power going indefinitely, if you have someone to consume that AP before it reaches to 14. This turns Rogue into a color blocker, which is something new in MPQ, and will be very good. 

Red: 
You can select a tile on the board, and it will deal damage, destroy that tile and a block around it (3x3) and generate AP. Very nice that you can select what to destroy

Yellow: 
It does what it says it does. 

I'm impressed. Really nice design. 

hopper1979

So she only takes damage from the green if you collect more than 14 ap in the color and it goes off, correct?  Also and probably more importantly, who does double or triple damage on the match, Rogue or the character whose color it is?  So using your example if you had OML on your team who would normally do black match damage, Rogue has her green out on Moon Nights black, when you match a black does OML do triple his normal match damage?  If that is the case she will be on every 5 star team from this point forward.

Jaedenkaal

D4Ni13 said:

After playing with her in SHIELD Training, this is what I've seen. 

Green: 
You need 5 green AP to fire up, and it changes to a passive of the strongest color of the enemy in front. You can switch the enemies in front and see their strong color in the ability description. 

In the loner node you will have Moon Knight (Black), Daken (Black) and Magneto (Blue). So lets say Moon Knight is in front, this will change into a Black passive, and it will stay as so until you collect black 14 AP and deal the damage. 

So you can keep the power going indefinitely, if you have someone to consume that AP before it reaches to 14. This turns Rogue into a color blocker, which is something new in MPQ, and will be very good. 

Red: 
You can select a tile on the board, and it will deal damage, destroy that tile and a block around it (3x3) and generate AP. Very nice that you can select what to destroy

Yellow: 
It does what it says it does. 

I'm impressed. Really nice design. 

To follow up on this, I just realized that Leading The Charge apparently reduces ALL enemy match and ability damage (at 4-5 covers), not just damage dealt to Rogue. Combine with Quake for extra hilarity vs otherwise devastating AOE attacks, presumably.
The catch is that Rogue won't be moved in front just because the enemy fires a power; she'd have to be there already. So if you can't reliably get Rogue in front, you're probably better off with 3 in Yellow, to catch a fair bit of match damage, plus Attack tiles (actually I haven't tested this, Attack tile damage isn't match damage OR power damage, strictly speaking). Characters that go invisible or airborne are obviously helpful in keeping this belle up front.

hopper1979

So the 3x match damage is determined by who is doing the match.  Cascades are now potentially game ending once green is cast, 5 Starlord might be looking really good to some people now

Jaedenkaal

hopper1979 said:

So the 3x match damage is determined by who is doing the match.  Cascades are now potentially game ending once green is cast, 5 Starlord might be looking really good to some people now

Still only on one color, though. Good if you can saturate the board with that color. SL might not be a great way to do that; if you're looking to take advantage of his green charged tiles, you need someone on the other team with Green as their strongest color; if that's also their team's strongest color then he'll also be converting Green tiles into Green Charged, limiting free matches.

hopper1979

Yes but it will definitely benefit 5 star teams immensely even if only one color gets the 3x damage boost we are talking about a jump from ~1000-1500 pts a match to ~3000-4500 without strike tiles even being taken into consideration.  So if she is the #3 on a well designed 5 star team watch out.  Also if you can select a green user from the other team then the charged tiles that 5 Starlord or SS spam again make those matches, assuming they are in the correct color, even more damaging.  It is going to add an interesting new dynamic to the game.  I like that

geno685

So as a player who might get one to two rogue covers and wont be able to test it----

How does her green mix with thanos purple?

If you fire off his purple and she fires green and it affects black, and thanos is matching black, does he get the double/triple after his increase from purple or before it? if it is the former i can see a lot of rogue and thanos teams

zodiac339

geno685 said:

So as a player who might get one to two rogue covers and wont be able to test it----

How does her green mix with thanos purple?

If you fire off his purple and she fires green and it affects black, and thanos is matching black, does he get the double/triple after his increase from purple or before it? if it is the former i can see a lot of rogue and thanos teams

You might have earned a place in Hell for suggesting this combo.

Anon

Just got her Red cover from Shield Training and now I can't get that stupid Fall Out Boy song out of my head.

Edit: Just realized something, doesn't her Green technically cost 19ap to get full damage? Yeah I get that she accelerates but still.

It's also funny how her Red is basically pre nerf Twin Pistols.

hopper1979

geno685 it will all depend on when the 3X is applied, the same question need to be checked for Vision (I know nobody uses him) and possibly Mr. Fantastic with his black out (I would have to reread that power).  Does the 3x occur then the extra damage is applied or does the damage occur than it is tripled, the second is definitely the preferred option.  I think Thanos is the easiest to answer of the three I mentioned his pink does 80% more damage, this occurs at match than the 3x would be applied.  I am have not tested it yet but the order or operations has no effect on the the buffs in this case since they are both multiplications.  As I said she will be the third on a lot of 5 star teams from this point forward just for the match damage benefit alone.

fork1977

hopper1979 said:

Yes but it will definitely benefit 5 star teams immensely even if only one color gets the 3x damage boost we are talking about a jump from ~1000-1500 pts a match to ~3000-4500 without strike tiles even being taken into consideration.  So if she is the #3 on a well designed 5 star team watch out.  Also if you can select a green user from the other team then the charged tiles that 5 Starlord or SS spam again make those matches, assuming they are in the correct color, even more damaging.  It is going to add an interesting new dynamic to the game.  I like that

She is a 5* support dream.  And the AP denial is fairly ridiculous.

My favorite attribute is that this makes her teammate use situational; to get the best synergy and benefit, you will need to anticipate the opponents best color and then find someone on your team who can use that color.  Seriously benefits the savvy player.

Also seems as if having red at 5 would be a bit of a waste, since the 3x3 and AP gain come with 1 cover and the extra damage ain't great (plus it's pricey).  I guess yellow at 3 covers is only losing 10% damage reduction, but I cannot see anyone sacrificing triple damage that comes with 5 green covers.

Thank you D3.  

D4Ni13

Anon said:

Just got her Red cover from Shield Training and now I can't get that stupid Fall Out Boy song out of my head.

Edit: Just realized something, doesn't her Green technically cost 19ap to get full damage? Yeah I get that she accelerates but still.

It's also funny how her Red is basically pre nerf Twin Pistols.

Yeah it seems like 19 AP, but the real deal for me is the fact that she blocks a color from the enemy team. Lets take Bl4de for example. You Power Siphon him and you block red AP for the enemy team. If you consume it before you reach 14 AP (which is duable even by herself), you basically shut down Bloodlust for as long as you want. 

Works with others too. So the damage is more of a bonus. The utility of the ability is far beyond that. So for utility 5AP, for damage 14 more.

Of course, there will be chars that are not affected by this, if they have different strong colors than their best ability (Rulk, for example, and there's no strong green user in the team to Siphon instead).

Jaedenkaal

fahq1977 said:

hopper1979 said:

Yes but it will definitely benefit 5 star teams immensely even if only one color gets the 3x damage boost we are talking about a jump from ~1000-1500 pts a match to ~3000-4500 without strike tiles even being taken into consideration.  So if she is the #3 on a well designed 5 star team watch out.  Also if you can select a green user from the other team then the charged tiles that 5 Starlord or SS spam again make those matches, assuming they are in the correct color, even more damaging.  It is going to add an interesting new dynamic to the game.  I like that

She is a 5* support dream.  And the AP denial is fairly ridiculous.

My favorite attribute is that this makes her teammate use situational; to get the best synergy and benefit, you will need to anticipate the opponents best color and then find someone on your team who can use that color.  Seriously benefits the savvy player.

Also seems as if having red at 5 would be a bit of a waste, since the 3x3 and AP gain come with 1 cover and the extra damage ain't great (plus it's pricey).  I guess yellow at 3 covers is only losing 10% damage reduction, but I cannot see anyone sacrificing triple damage that comes with 5 green covers.

Thank you D3.  

Yellow at 4-5 covers also reduces power damage (to everyone, it would seem, although I have not tested this. Also no word on attack tiles, although the wording would indicate not).

Agree that the Red damage at 5 covers isn't amazing, although it's pretty clearly better than Yancy Street Special (Poor Ben). With a lot of charged tiles out the damage can go up quite a bit, and it only takes 2 charged tiles to make back the AP cost (although not all in Red, more than likely). Also agree that neither of those last two points are more true at 5 covers than 3. 

DrDevilDinosaur

Very interested in the mechanical implications of Power Siphon. This is the first time we've seen an ability which changes colour. That is, it's possible for this ability to have a different colour every time it is fired in a match. This is different from other transforming abilities, which retain their original colour, and from Banner's transformation to Hulk, which counts as a separate "character" so the different colours aren't overwriting Banner's abilities.

I think Gloves Off/Power Siphon is going to be fairly well received as successful, so I look forward to how the devs decide to expand upon this new mechanic.

Jaedenkaal

mexus said:

My thoughts: 
Looks decent.

Green makes potentially good damage but at a high cost; both AP wise and also the self-harm aspect.
Red - good punch and a great way to get 3X3 AP from the tile destruction.
Yellow is tanky but I never fully understood the potential in damage reducing skills, protect tiles do it better.

If you spend the AP you get from Power Siphon before you hit 14, there's no high cost and no self damage (which is nominal anyways).

Her Yellow is MUCH better than protect tiles against pretty much any power (4-5 covers, of course). Most powers do so much damage that no amount of Protect tiles will protect against half of it. Not to mention that this is passive, and on defense will happen every time you fire a power at Rogue (unless she's the last one left, I guess). 

And, of course, it stacks with Protect tiles anyways (although probably not the 'good' way).  

vinsensual

The good defensive abilities are the ones that circumvent shield tiles and do their own thing, like percentage damage reduction with Spiderwoman.  Cutting the damage of a 5* ability in half or 75% is strong.