New Feature: Bonus Heroes! *Updated (3/1/17)

kyo28

Stax the Foyer wrote:

How ridiculous!
Everyone believes the craziest things on the Internet.

Everyone is free to believe what they want but again, my source is directly from one of the whales through a reliable intermediary, not some hearsay from the Internet.
I didn't mean to say they hire assistants only to play mpq, but the person I'm talking about has a personal assistant and asks that assistant, among other main tasks of course, to keep a cellphone handy and to grind the game.

fnedude wrote:

I imagine their real names are, like, Mariah Carey or Denzel Washington.... that way I don't shake may head in amazement on how much they spend.

Actually, you're not far off. The whale I'm talking about is not an actor but is involved in the Hollywood industry.

whitecat31 wrote:

Ok guys, Talking about unfounded rumors about how this somehow benefits whales and that whale feedback guides the ship, is a waste of time and better done in another thread.
What you want to talk about is how this change affects YOU.
Clearly the bonus heroes is a nice new addition to the game. It does very little to mitigate the vaulting, if you understand math.
So what we really are talking about is the vaulting.
Does the vaulting hurt you? If so, how?
Does the vaulting benefit you?. If so, how?
Will this cause you to buy ISO?
How do you think it will affect your game play when it comes to getting and spending tokens?
How do you think this affects the value of the Legendary Tokens and how you will spend them?

Not unfounded, but OK, whatever. If you feel better not believing it, that's fine by me.

To answer your questions:
Does the vaulting hurt you? If so, how? YES, it all but halts my current progress on older 4*s. I have a lot of older ones sitting at 5-13 covers. And that was my best route to transition from 3* to 4* status. Having to start over with the new ones puts me in an endless cycle of building the newer ones up to 10-13 covers, by that time they move out of the newest 12 vaults and I can start again. This is a huge gaping hole and Bonus Heroes is but a band-aid that doesn't even begin to fix that problem, at least for me.
Does the vaulting benefit you?. If so, how? NO, don't see any plus side to this. See comment above.
Will this cause you to buy ISO? NO, I never bought ISO before and won't start now. However, I used to have VIP and buy HP from time to time as it helped my transition but now I'll also stop doing that because see above comment, I'll be stuck in an endless cycle
How do you think it will affect your game play when it comes to getting and spending tokens? Well, I'll be getting less tokens: I won't be able to participate as much in required DDQ nodes and I'll probably not get the required older 4* covers and the newer ones take a long time to enter rotation. I'll also miss out on CP and tokens from champed 4*s (only have 2 so far but still). I'll use surplus HP to buy out vaults I'm interested in but won't be doing that as much as I used to as, again, I'll be stuck in an endless cycle.
How do you think this affects the value of the Legendary Tokens and how you will spend them? Legendary have less value to me as it's raining 4*s and 5*s. A 5* used to be a rainbow unicorn but now D3 is flooding the game with them. That lowers the value of the tokens but they are still basically as hard to get as before, aside from some tweaking here and there.

In my opinion there are 2 things that need to happen:
1. create more LT vaults and bring the older 4*s and 5*s in them, so we still have a clear path to get them
2. Increase the LT output either by introducing CL9 and perhaps CL10 which offer more LT's for progression rewards in PVE/PVP and or further tweak DDQ so we have a daily crash of the titans

There needs to be an incentive for casual players to keep playing and that is the only reason I'll be keeping my VIP and keep buying HP during sales. Otherwise I'll switch to very occasional play and stop paying for the game.

Stax the Foyer

kyo28 wrote:

Stax the Foyer wrote:

How ridiculous!
Everyone believes the craziest things on the Internet.

Everyone is free to believe what they want but again, my source is directly from one of the whales through a reliable intermediary, not some hearsay from the Internet.
I didn't mean to say they hire assistants only to play mpq, but the person I'm talking about has a personal assistant and asks that assistant, among other main tasks of course, to keep a cellphone handy and to grind the game.

My apologies, I can understand if the tone of my post came across as a little acrostic.

Bowgentle

Stax the Foyer wrote:

kyo28 wrote:

Stax the Foyer wrote:

How ridiculous!
Everyone believes the craziest things on the Internet.

Everyone is free to believe what they want but again, my source is directly from one of the whales through a reliable intermediary, not some hearsay from the Internet.
I didn't mean to say they hire assistants only to play mpq, but the person I'm talking about has a personal assistant and asks that assistant, among other main tasks of course, to keep a cellphone handy and to grind the game.

My apologies, I can understand if the tone of my post came across as a little acrostic.

Still not sure if I should count syllables in that previous post, it's haiku-esque.

Omega Red

Plenty of folks have their wives and kids assisting their game so I don't see what's the big deal with whales doing the same with their own assistants.

Tony_Foot

Omega Red wrote:

Plenty of folks have their wives and kids assisting their game so I don't see what's the big deal with whales doing the same with their own assistants.

Yep my son does all my DDQ except crash. TBH I find it so mind numbing that if he didn't do it I wouldn't. Thankfully child labour is free as I wouldn't pay someone to do it

TLCstormz

Cthulhu wrote:

We just had our initial conversation after the weekend and are discussing what to do next, please bear with us as we move as fast as we can without breaking anything!

No conversations should have been had, because little to none of this should have ever been implemented. I am still completely baffled as to HOW and WHY all of this was done, in the first place.

Truly. Baffled.

Quebbster

TLCstormz wrote:

Cthulhu wrote:

We just had our initial conversation after the weekend and are discussing what to do next, please bear with us as we move as fast as we can without breaking anything!

No conversations should have been had, because little to none of this should have ever been implemented. I am still completely baffled as to HOW and WHY all of this was done, in the first place.

Truly. Baffled.

So... you don't want the devs to try to improve the current situation? Baffled.
I get that you are not happy with the situation, but the devs are trying to improve the situation and should deserve credit for that, not scorn.

JHawkInc

Quebbster wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

Cthulhu wrote:

We just had our initial conversation after the weekend and are discussing what to do next, please bear with us as we move as fast as we can without breaking anything!

No conversations should have been had, because little to none of this should have ever been implemented. I am still completely baffled as to HOW and WHY all of this was done, in the first place.

Truly. Baffled.

So... you don't want the devs to try to improve the current situation? Baffled.
I get that you are not happy with the situation, but the devs are trying to improve the situation and should deserve credit for that, not scorn.

Nobody said the devs shouldn't try to improve the current situation. Throwing that baseless accusation in doesn't help anyone.

The problem is that, when trying to improve the game, vaulting, as is, is one of those ideas that should get scratched off the list, and never actually make it to a team to try and implement it, much less make it into the game. It's such an apparent no-brainer to the people that play the game that it's extremely frustrating to see it implemented as an "improvement." If the goal is to make the boat faster, you can't do that by putting holes in the bottom to make it lighter.

Crowl

JHawkInc wrote:

Nobody said the devs shouldn't try to improve the current situation. Throwing that baseless accusation in doesn't help anyone.

The problem is that, when trying to improve the game, vaulting, as is, is one of those ideas that should get scratched off the list, and never actually make it to a team to try and implement it, much less make it into the game. It's such an apparent no-brainer to the people that play the game that it's extremely frustrating to see it implemented as an "improvement." If the goal is to make the boat faster, you can't do that by putting holes in the bottom to make it lighter.

In principle vaulting could be made to work, but they have just been ludicrously heavy-handed with it and forcing a roster situation that is directly the opposite of the broad roster of champions approach that they have pushed people towards in the last year or so.

If their plan was to increase the speed of collecting the new characters and trying to address the issue of dilution with methods that did not amount to giving us far more covers, there were so many possible options and pretty much all of them would be better than their eventual idea. For example, they could have kept all the characters but then made the bonus heroes part of this change be a chance for us to pull an extra one of the newest 12 instead or they could have vaulted a vastly smaller amount of heroes and rotated who was vaulted each season so that development of your roster would not halt entirely.

Short of them adding a chance for your entire roster to be deleted instead of you getting a bonus hero, it is quite tough to think how they could have 'fixed' these problems in a worse manner.

alphabeta

Quebbster wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

Cthulhu wrote:

We just had our initial conversation after the weekend and are discussing what to do next, please bear with us as we move as fast as we can without breaking anything!

No conversations should have been had, because little to none of this should have ever been implemented. I am still completely baffled as to HOW and WHY all of this was done, in the first place.

Truly. Baffled.

So... you don't want the devs to try to improve the current situation? Baffled.
I get that you are not happy with the situation, but the devs are trying to improve the situation and should deserve credit for that, not scorn.

Sorry but no they don't they deserve the scorn they are getting.

They have a development process and if they couldn't foresee that this was going to be a hugely unpopular move than they should have reached out to a few long term players for some views.

This isn't development its throwing mud against a wall and seeing what sticks.

"Your supposed to lose" became "You are our beta testers" and no where since Boss Rush has this been more evident that in this roll out.

Scornful behaviour warrants scorn and while they should absolutely seek to improve the game the basis of this implementation shows a clear gap in understanding as to what the most common issues are and therefore I actually don't want them to try to 'improve' the game anymore - their priority needs to be understanding of its play out in the real world because that lack of understanding makes improvements retrograde steps.

jredd

obvious solution: put the new characters in 'latest' legends and the rest in 'classic' legends. take the classics out of latest. it's right there in the names. let us decide what we want to do.

break classics up into 2 separate 'vaults' if needs be. or at worst, but still better than getting rid of them, rotate characters in and out.

TLCstormz

Quebbster wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

Cthulhu wrote:

We just had our initial conversation after the weekend and are discussing what to do next, please bear with us as we move as fast as we can without breaking anything!

No conversations should have been had, because little to none of this should have ever been implemented. I am still completely baffled as to HOW and WHY all of this was done, in the first place.

Truly. Baffled.

So... you don't want the devs to try to improve the current situation? Baffled.

I get that you are not happy with the situation, but the devs are trying to improve the situation and should deserve credit for that, not scorn.

What.....on earth.....are you even talking about?

I simply said that this ENTIRE kerfluffle should have never happened in the first place, because of how ludicrous a move all of this was, in the first place.

fanghoul

Well, if they're looking into it, I hope they keep in mind some of us liked the vaulting. It's been my favorite week of classic legends draws ever so far.

BatteryHorse

kyo28 wrote:

Everyone is free to believe what they want but again, my source is directly from one of the whales through a reliable intermediary, not some hearsay from the Internet.
I didn't mean to say they hire assistants only to play mpq, but the person I'm talking about has a personal assistant and asks that assistant, among other main tasks of course, to keep a cellphone handy and to grind the game.

An old friend of mine was an investment banker with Goldman Sachs. He's moved away since, but when I knew him he played a different f2p game and he dumped thousands of dollars into it. He wasn't necessarily proud of it, but he wasn't really ashamed, either. He had an intern but I don't think he ever made him play his game for him. He traveled a lot, a lot of flights, a lot of hotel rooms, and that's how he decided to spend his money. His peers went to Vegas on weekends and gambled, others went to really expensive restaurants or clubs and got bottle service, because young, rich people tend to be exactly what you imagine.

He used to talk about how the guys he worked with would just get on a plane and fly to St. Martin on weekends, do a bunch of drugs, get drunk, drag themselves back to work on Monday. Instead, he liked to play his game and he wanted to enjoy the experience, so he just paid whatever he wanted.

I'm broke all the time, so I don't have that luxury, but there are definitely people out there with money to burn and these games are their vice.

whycantwesyncpc

jredd wrote:

obvious solution: put the new characters in 'latest' legends and the rest in 'classic' legends. take the classics out of latest. it's right there in the names. let us decide what we want to do.

break classics up into 2 separate 'vaults' if needs be. or at worst, but still better than getting rid of them, rotate characters in and out.

You know I was playing a different game a noticed how they were handling characters, and since they are saying they did the vaulting due to dilution why not get a little more creative about how to limit characters. Instead of taking characters out of circulation how about giving us other ways of limiting what we pull. Set all of the tokens back to the way they were, except keep latest as the most recent 12. Then add a limited time token that changes over a set period of time like a week or a month. This token would be themed and the characters in it are limited by the theme. They could even tie into things that are being promoted.

For example, the new wolverine movie just came out recently so you put a limited X-Men token. It would only feature the 3* and 4* x-characters with increased odds of pulling patch, x-force wolverine and x-23. Or they just started the space season so you can do a space themed ones with the guardians of the galaxy characters. Or they just did the ultron event so you do an Age of Ultron token with all the characters that were in the movie.

Granted the # of characters in each limited token would be different, but since each token is different the price could be adjusted for each one based on the number of characters inside, or they could fill it in with some other characters with a lower pull rate. It offers a better shot at pulling specific characters so people can choose when the theme has someone they want but without taking anyone away. Just an idea to address the issue a little with a little creativity.

Moon Roach

8.

That's how many Gwenpool covers I now have on the vine, waiting for me to champion her, all from tokens in the past 4 days or so.

There's been the odd Riri, Other Rubbish Venom, Spider-Woman and even a single Carol. But more than half of the 4* covers I've pulled have been 1 character.

I don't think I'd have the same number if the token opening had been done prior to vaulting.

Tony_Foot

Am I correct:

From the list on the front page Moon K and Kate dropped at the start of this season. Are the rest to drop off from the bottom up? So next season Peggy and Wasp drop out? I'm basically uninterested in any until medusa (have a champed peggy). So I am I right in thinking Medusa stays in for 3 seasons. So I hoard for 3 seasons and then bust my tokens in the hope of carol and medusa and with luck better new characters than the ones that don't personally interest me.

Although I am willing to bet my house the next re-works come from that 12 list that people don't consider good.

Quebbster

Tony Foot wrote:

Am I correct:

From the list on the front page Moon K and Kate dropped at the start of this season. Are the rest to drop off from the bottom up? So next season Peggy and Wasp drop out? I'm basically uninterested in any until medusa (have a champed peggy). So I am I right in thinking Medusa stays in for 3 seasons. So I hoard for 3 seasons and then bust my tokens in the hope of carol and medusa and with luck better new characters than the ones that don't personally interest me.

Although I am willing to bet my house the next re-works come from that 12 list that people don't consider good.

Older characters will be dropped as new characters are added to tokens, correct. Next season may only drop Peggy though as there may only be one new fourstar when the next season starts.

Tony_Foot

Thanks and I'm right that the oldest are at the bottom? So they should drop off the bottom of the list?

JHawkInc

Tony Foot wrote:

Thanks and I'm right that the oldest are at the bottom? So they should drop off the bottom of the list?

No.

Newest four characters are Agent Coulson, Mordo, Riri Williams, and Captain Marvel, and they are clearly not the top row. And I'm pretty sure Peggy is the oldest, and next to go.