**** Wolverine (X-Force) **** [PRE 2015-04]

mjh

I put together a little chart and wanted to share it as I have a shortage problem, as I'm sure most of you do:

All builds 5/5/3 as they should be

level 200
HP - 8154
76
68
59

3177dmg
489dmg/tile
heals for 3913

**********************************

level 222
HP - 9013
79
70
61

3293dmg
506dmg/tile
heals for 4059

**********************************
cost from 200 -> 222: 120k
gain 3, 2, 2
+116dmg, +17dmg/tile, 146 more heal
HP +859
**********************************

level 250
HP - 10,147
81
72
63

3388dmg
514dmg/tile
heals for 4178

**********************************
cost from 222 -> 250: 120k
gain 2, 2, 2
+95dmg, +8dmg/tile, 119 more heal
HP +1,134
**********************************

level 270 (Max)
HP - 10,960
82
73
64

3441dmg
522dmg/tile
heals for 4243

**********************************
cost from 250 -> MAX: unknown (a lot)
gain 1, 1, 1
+53dmg, +8dmg/tile, 65 more heal
HP +813

modmousests

Every time there is a good character people whine about it. Every game in existence has characters who are better than others. Just play and shut up. I have an xforce level 208 that i play. I regularly beat level 270 xforces. Get some tinykitties and put in some effort. Furthermore i have 7 characters maxed at 166 and ive spent a total of 99 cents on this game. I have all characters and ive never worried about hero pointz cuz i dont waste em shield hopping. People need to buck up

Unknown

Don't worry. When Thoress with her 16k health comes out and destroys everyones teams with a blue --> red combo, people will find a new thing to whine about

babinro

He's too powerful. FUN...but broken.
I've been calling for this before Sentry nerf was announced by D3 as Xforce deserves a nerf.

His black ability is too good for the cost. It frequently does absurd damage 4k-6k while almost always draining the AI's best colour and adding enough AP to your for you to follow up with 1 or more follow up skills. There's just too much control going on here and the match is almost always decided on the first team who surgical strikes. There's a TON of ways to nerf this but I don't know what would be best. Maybe scale down the damage considerably...maybe remove AP drain...maybe cap the AP gain to 5 based on covers.

His green is pretty strong as well. I don't think it needs to be nerfed but I wouldn't be upset if they scaled it down about 500 damage so it averages around 4k instead of 4.5k to 5k+

The damage done by his yellow should be considerably buffed to help compensate and make that cover more enticing. I'm talking at least doubled if not tripled.

In response to people always going after good characters...I'd disagree. BP is a fantastic character and people don't cry for a nerf with him. Captain America is also completely insane on offense when he goes online. Fury is an excellent character but people tend to accept him as well. The main different with these people are that their abilities cost more and they don't have true healing. They can't be abused to sustained play for hours on end like X-force can.

franckynight

Amazing.. What a nice and constructive advice You re giving to all of us.. Im sure ppl will feel a lot better now they know what can be accomplished..

babinro

JessyC01 wrote:

Don't worry. When Thoress with her 16k health comes out and destroys everyone's teams with a blue --> red combo, people will find a new thing to whine about

There's no question she's going to be a beast especially when combined with xforce (and hood as a 3rd when able). You'll get a near full rainbow team with 4 colours that are major threats and all the utility to handle anything this game can throw at you. Thors only drawback is the lack of true healing. She'll be just another BP/Fury. An excellent character with amazing powers that see's limited use because of health pack drain. Where Fury/BP might only see 2 battles, she'll probably see 3 or 4.

That said...I'm expecting to see a xforce/Thor/(featured) on defense for the bulk of 2015.

Unknown

Thor/X Force/The Hood is only usable in a freeform PvP event (counting stuff like Nefarious Foes as freeform) or Unholy Outlaw.

Needing a 4 match red + 3 match blue to down a single person isn't exactly some kind of amazing display of firepower. A lot of top characters can down a character with a single 4 match move with some restriction. Thor is simply a lot weaker compared to X Force because unless The Hood gets hit with a huge nerf that takes away his status as an auto-include in the top teams, the difference between Thor/Nick Fury and X Force is that X Force covers green while those do not, and as powerful as the 4* are, you're pretty much starting with a huge handicap when you concede green to your opponent unless your featured character happens to cover it (roughly 50% of the time by sheer probability, but generally considerably lower as you'd also need a good green power too, so for example Beast doesn't count as covering green even if you had him maxed). While X Force doesn't cover red, conceding red is a considerably less of a handicap compared to conceding green.

Surgical Strike probably needs to lose one of its 'but wait there's more' deal. All of its individual components are okay for the power you'd expect for a 4*. The problem is Surgical Strike does everything: straight up damage, cascade, AP depletion, and AP generation. Even just doing 3 out of 4 would go a long way balancing the skill. For X Force I think if it doesn't do damage for the tiles destroyed it can be considered as somewhat balanced. You usually get at least 1000 more damage just from the 15 tiles destroyed + cascades on top of its listed damage, and that puts it a bit over the top when combined with the cascades and the ability to remove a very large number of tiles that will generally screw up your opponent's plan to use any special tiles.

ronin_san

babinro wrote:

He's too powerful. FUN...but broken.
I've been calling for this before Sentry nerf was announced by D3 as Xforce deserves a nerf.

His black ability is too good for the cost. It frequently does absurd damage 4k-6k while almost always draining the AI's best colour and adding enough AP to your for you to follow up with 1 or more follow up skills. There's just too much control going on here and the match is almost always decided on the first team who surgical strikes. There's a TON of ways to nerf this but I don't know what would be best. Maybe scale down the damage considerably...maybe remove AP drain...maybe cap the AP gain to 5 based on covers.

His green is pretty strong as well. I don't think it needs to be nerfed but I wouldn't be upset if they scaled it down about 500 damage so it averages around 4k instead of 4.5k to 5k+

The damage done by his yellow should be considerably buffed to help compensate and make that cover more enticing. I'm talking at least doubled if not tripled.

In response to people always going after good characters...I'd disagree. BP is a fantastic character and people don't cry for a nerf with him. Captain America is also completely insane on offense when he goes online. Fury is an excellent character but people tend to accept him as well. The main different with these people are that their abilities cost more and they don't have true healing. They can't be abused to sustained play for hours on end like X-force can.

So XFW should be fixed by decreasing his attacks and raising the damage on the heal? Do.....do you..because...

RE: You only get the AP gain when you're at 5. Mischief managed.

RE: How is 500 damage going to ~fix~ it? Any reduction in damage is a nerf. So saying "scale down" still means nerf.

Your argument is bad. It's really bad.

Unknown

X-force is not OP, you just have to take green and black and he will do nothing. Take a good damage dealer like Thor and focus him at the start of the round, he will die fast without doing so much damages to you.
If people complain about X-force IMO, it's just because after 700 points we see him in every teams. And people who haven't him yet are jealous
For the fun I kill team with him with a Daken/Patch/Deadpool, it's not hard at all.

Actually if you really want to balance characters like X-Force, you need to change the OP cascades, just take it back like it was before and X-Force will just be very good but not so scary (has some people think he is).

Unknown

Jojo-Teddybigboyz wrote:

X-force is not OP, you just have to take green and black and he will do nothing.

Unknown

Op? Old ragnarok says he can show you all what op mean.

Unknown

X-Force is perfect!!! Shut up moaning!!
4* character.
Deadly assassin, metal claws, cuts through anything in his path.
Metal bones n heals from any wound.
He's the best there is at what he does for a reason.
If you think what he does best isn't very nice then you're damn right bub!
D3p turned this guy from worse than bagman to his rightful place as the deadliest character in the game! For that I applaud them!

Unknown

And even if they nerf X-Force, then who next ?... 4*Thor, LThor, Black Panther, Hood, Cmag (one more time) ...
If you can win against X-Force with normal 3* roster then he is fine. If the problem is the shield op, then it's the game design which has a problem...
D3P should work on the bracket more and make a special bracket for people in transition, a bracket for people with at least 3 3*, and a bracket for people who have full leveled required characters + 3* and more.

Unknown

I have said before that part of the issue with x-force being the most powerful character in the game is everyone has some level of x-force by day 180 which is fairly young in MPQ age you are literally handed one of each color of x-force which is not true for any other character until past a year out you are handed a full set of IW.

SO everyone has a small x-force, everyone seems to know how OP he is so everyone makes leveling x-force a priority. He is too common for how strong he is and people keep asking "What are we going to nerf Thoress next??" and I say Lady thor will never be as common a threat as X-force is now. Maybe by year 3 of MPQ but anything could happen by then, so that is a false comparison.

And for the record, I have no idea what to do about that except settle in and accept x-force as our new overlord. Play him if you got him. but don't pretend like he isn't dominating the meta in a somewhat unhealthy manner. I would hope they felt comfortable changing the meta regularly to keep things from stagnating but past experience says we have at least a few months before they will change anything if even then.

GrumpySmurf1002

Phantron wrote:

Thor is simply a lot weaker compared to X Force because unless The Hood gets hit with a huge nerf that takes away his status as an auto-include in the top teams

The nice part about the Daken event was the distinct lack of Hood climbing to 1100. Yeah, he was out there on a few teams, but he was by no means an auto-include. If you use him lots, you'll see him lots because thats how people have to retaliate. I fought a ton of XForce sure, but it was Fury/Mags/Thor/Hulk/Dino that was joining him. Very few XForce/Hoods, and it's quite easy to just skip them.

To the topic at hand, unless XForce actually breaks a game mechanic, don't expect a nerf. What they've nerfed so far have been things that generate (or in the case of Hood/Thorina, will generate) infinite turns, or reduce the games to trivial match time. XForce, while a beast does not reduce matches to triviality as Sentry did, and doesn't generate infinite turns. He's strong, but he still takes time to do his thing, and he's by no means an auto-win button.

And that's before even talking about the fact the devs clearly don't like re-visiting a character even once, so twice seems completely out of the question.

Unknown

Totally agree w OP.
Simple logic : 4 > 3
Some people invest their $$$ (P2W) for him while others (F2P) invest their valuable time to build him. Nerfing or balancing will make his build cost irrelevant.
Besides, with boost + TU any char is defeatable.

Unknown

JessyC01 wrote:

Don't worry. When Thoress with her 16k health comes out and destroys everyones teams with a blue --> red combo, people will find a new thing to whine about

Totally, few realize that stun is the most powerful ability in any game. In terms of stun,no char in par with MBA widow sting (except old spidey).
Am using MBW+M.storm to transitioned to 2* by stun-locking the entire team, battle took long but able to defeat couple of 85.
So it's a dream come true that Thoress have the same cost+ability. OBW+Thoress for offense, defense and shieldhop.

evil panda

We need to stop calling for nerfs in general. It really discourages people who heavily invest in the game (and not necessarily money), who I would think are the people D3 would want to keep playing the game. If you spend hundreds of dollars in this game, you can only invest in so many Ragnaroks, Spidey, CMags, Sentry before feeling ripped off. If you're a F2P player it might be even worse because you'll either never get a competitive roster because the characters you need to focus on keeps shifting, or you spend sooo much time getting there only to enjoy it for a couple of weeks or months.

There will always be OP characters. The game is just too diverse to ensure there won't be. And as someone else keeps saying, shouldn't a 4* be able to lay waste to 3*'s?

IamTheDanger

Of course he can tear everybody a new one, he's Wolve - friggin - rine! Enough said.

Unknown

This will probably be an unpopular suggestion, but why not increase the cost of the skill at covers 4 and 5? It's still be worth it at 12 AP to drain your opponents AP, and still be more than worth it at 13 AP to generate AP.