Character Rebalance Plan

PorkBelly

Quebbster wrote:

Classic Magneto's rework was more of a lateral move, and it was quite well received - he was still powerful after the redesign, but not quite as powerful as he'd been Before.

Quebbster

PorkBelly wrote:

Two can play that game you know.

IamTheDanger

Jabrony Geoff wrote:

Loki needs a boost, this guy is responsible for bringing the Avengers together.
Time traveller, magician, illusionist, politician, powerhouse.
Absolute ZERO respect shown to Loki in this game.

Sentry needs a boost ...ripped two people in half, brought down asgard.
ZERO respect shown to sentry in this game.

Thor needs a boost, Stan Lee created him to beat the Hulk. When Stan wrote comics the Hulk feared Thor.
However, writers have lost their way with Thor and treat him like an idiot. ZERO respect shown in comics and zero respect shown in this game.

Phoenix needs a boost.
Phoenix destroys planets, wipes them clean so it can start anew. In MPQ old man Logan is more powerful... let that sink in for a second. Old man Logan is more powerful than Phoenix.
(compose yourself)
Plenty of Respect shown in the Comics ZERO respect shown in MPQ.


Vision needs a boost, he has a flaming infinity gem in the middle of his head...Come on.... ZERO respect shown in MPQ.

Dr Doom needs a boost....this villain has it all, magician,technician, genius and squirrel girl beat him. ZERO respect shown in comics ZERO respect shown in MPQ

In all seriousness you don't need to nerf that many only the obvious but more need boosting.


#PVPisBroken #justsaying #deleteordecay

Plus one to this post. And about Sentry, there was an event, (been a while, so fuzzy on details), involving Kang and the Apocalypse Twins. There was a celestial guardian destroyer guy that gave Earth a thumbs down and began to destroy it. So Rogue, (still waiting on her Demi. X men are rumored to be on hold, but she was a villain and an Avenger, so where's Avenger Rogue?), took all the powers from all the heroes and attacked the Destroyer guy. But she wasn't having much luck until....
Sentry, (who was dead btw, just brought back as a horseman) came in and took the thing off and away. Sentry took him to galaxy far, far away.

So I have said for a while now, Sentry really should be top tier.

BraneDedDev

Quebbster wrote:

Classic Magneto's rework was more of a lateral move, and it was quite well received

Square-Chopper

Just to join in the chorus..... As far as the 5* tier goes, I would absolutely LOVE to use different characters besides my go-to A team. I'd switch over to any combination of IM or GG or Bolt or.... (you get the idea). How about taking a look at implementing an actual path to 5* progression so there are other options to choose from.

As many have said, I can't play characters that RNGeezus hasn't seen fit to give me.

Nerfing characters will do nothing to balance the broken systems currently in place, it will just make any sort of progression in the game even more slow and frustrating than it already is.

Quebbster

BraneDedDev wrote:

Quebbster wrote:

Classic Magneto's rework was more of a lateral move, and it was quite well received

Late to the punch there. Next time just upvote the first guy if you have nothing to add.

IamTheDanger

BraneDedDev wrote:

Quebbster wrote:

Classic Magneto's rework was more of a lateral move, and it was quite well received

This is true. His was less a nerf and more a rework. His abilities were not reduced, just changed. I think they are just as good as the old power set. Just different. Be nice if they did that more often.

Anyway, all this is useless speculation. We will know for sure on the 19th when they release all the info.

I am a little worried about one 3* though. Look back at XFW. He was useless. Not good at all. Then he became a game ending beast. Then he was nerfed down to not so good. Now look at IM40. He was pretty much useless. Then He got buffed Into super good. Question is, what happens next? Will he get beat down? Will he be left alone?

To find out, tune on Sept 19th. Same Bat time, same Bat channel.

Maceo511

nwman wrote:

Here are my thoughts on any 5* nerfs.

Don't. Just buff other 5*s. A lot of people have ss and he sucks. Make him stronger and get diversity. Or offer the oldest 5 star covers as progression (hope to see in 8-10 clearance) so people can use other characters.

I have a lvl 500 oml, and if oml gets nerfed I imagine I will easily crush most everyone with my other champed 5s. Oh, and in crazy scaling pve he gets killed often enough. But it's boring and i rarely play, hope these clearance levels add something.

Bss already exists and completely shuts down oml. If you nerf his healing, you know the one thing wolverine does very well, then you might as well get rid of him.

If you don't believe me, take your oml, and transform without saving up ap. Watch how useless he is, especially vs bss, or even gg, im, bolt, hell even banner.

Wow, I hope they don't nerf OML, but I imagine with a level 500 OML and I assume a bunch of other champed 5*, you never have a problem hitting the CP. But I agree about the PVE scaling, if nerfed I hope they take that into account.

ErikPeter

Weaker or stonger, guys. What this post is, to me, is an admission they're going to change how they were doing things (which was to rarely, rarely make sweeping changes) toward a more modern active approach (think Overwatch or League of Legends). I'm excited that we'll see some character buffs. If they tweak too far, they can pull it back a bit next season.

I can only think of two things that deserve a nerf: Whiteout can do 20% less damage and still be good. Recharge can make 2 green per tile instead of 3 and still be the best power in the tier.

Other "strong" characters are really only strong in meta roles. HB's fine. OML's fine. Seriously, OML's nothing without his black. They could nerf him by just making a 4-star Moonstone...

I'm more interested in seeing buffs to older characters that have fallen behind the power curve. Fury's Blue, for example, just doesn't pack as much of a punch against expanded health pools and the risk-reward nature compares terribly to powers like Moon Knight or Kate Bishop.

Xenoberyll

It will really suck to sell old and grown champions to have the ISO to champ the new best characters. If the nerfs to previous top characters are an indication this won't balance anything but just switch the balance to different characters who are then the new top. I really hope you prove me wrong tho, d3.

ngoni

BraneDedDev wrote:

Nobody uses the new characters because your system makes it impossible to.

Devs should have to write this on a blackboard 200 times at the start of every day. You want diversity? Make it possible.

DaveR4470

ngoni wrote:

BraneDedDev wrote:

Nobody uses the new characters because your system makes it impossible to.

Devs should have to write this on a blackboard 200 times at the start of every day. You want diversity? Make it possible.

It continues to baffle me that everyone who plays the game doesn't get a freebie, or easily earned, cover of every new character introduced (at least for the 2-3-4* characters). In the current game, single-cover characters are often completely unusable. So a freebie wouldn't destabilize competition. And it gives you a reason to compete for additional covers in the intro event, to make the character you now already have more useful to you. And a reason to spend on roster slots, which we understand to be the main revenue generator for MPQ.

This would seem to be a no-brainer for me, and yet D3/Demi steadfastly limit access to covers as a game mechanic. Why, again, should I spend time/money fighting for that one Black Widow cover that will be utterly useless to me for months?

/rant off

Calnexin

I applaud the effort. I have 97 characters in my roster and only routinely use 8 outside the boosted/required ones. Being able to use the other 90% in a competitive way sounds awesome.

I do hope that the characters who occupy a particular niche aren't drastically changed. Eg - tile punishers like Doc Ock and Squirrel Girl don't get a lot of play, but they're really useful in a strategic way against particular teams. Deterrent characters like Hulk and Sentry aren't great on offense, but require extra attention when you face them to mitigate their power. Raw usage statistics don't reflect their overall value. I don't want to see that go away - they're an ace up the sleeve.

Calnexin

DaveR4470 wrote:

It continues to baffle me that everyone who plays the game doesn't get a freebie, or easily earned, cover of every new character introduced (at least for the 2-3-4* characters). In the current game, single-cover characters are often completely unusable. So a freebie wouldn't destabilize competition. And it gives you a reason to compete for additional covers in the intro event, to make the character you now already have more useful to you. And a reason to spend on roster slots, which we understand to be the main revenue generator for MPQ.

This would seem to be a no-brainer for me, and yet D3/Demi steadfastly limit access to covers as a game mechanic. Why, again, should I spend time/money fighting for that one Black Widow cover that will be utterly useless to me for months?

/rant off

As a player, it would be nice to have the option to roster the new characters automatically. But remember - you need roster slots for them, and they affect scaling. It would make the game unplayable for newbies.

That might be a good revenue maker for the game, though. If everyone gets a cover it might drive HP sales. FTP players tend to generate just enough to roster one when it's randomly drawn. To get every character I've missed would've cost me 4k HP that I don't currently have.

Ezrius

DaveR4470 wrote:

ngoni wrote:

BraneDedDev wrote:

Nobody uses the new characters because your system makes it impossible to.

Devs should have to write this on a blackboard 200 times at the start of every day. You want diversity? Make it possible.

It continues to baffle me that everyone who plays the game doesn't get a freebie, or easily earned, cover of every new character introduced (at least for the 2-3-4* characters). In the current game, single-cover characters are often completely unusable. So a freebie wouldn't destabilize competition. And it gives you a reason to compete for additional covers in the intro event, to make the character you now already have more useful to you. And a reason to spend on roster slots, which we understand to be the main revenue generator for MPQ.

This would seem to be a no-brainer for me, and yet D3/Demi steadfastly limit access to covers as a game mechanic. Why, again, should I spend time/money fighting for that one Black Widow cover that will be utterly useless to me for months?

/rant off

They introduce new 2-3* characters?

Seriously though, that's part of the reason certain characters may seem less popular even at the 3* and 4* level: they're harder to build. I can tell you quite honestly that the only reason I have Beast championed over other options right now is because he'll eventually get me Jean Grey covers. If there was a 3* that was going to get me Spider-Gwen covers, as a random example of one of my partially covered 4*s, I'd probably prioritize that 3* over Captain Marvel or R&G. Just sayin'.

Edit: Sorry, meant to add that this is also why you'll almost always see more instances of HBIM, 4Thor, ProfX, etc. They have great or at least okay 3* champions that feed them covers, while Peggy Carter is only with players with luck or success in limited events.

Calnexin

JCTthe3rd81 wrote:

So I have said for a while now, Sentry really should be top tier.

Sentry was the hero they sent to stop the returning World War Hulk - and he did it. He's supposed to have the power of a billion suns or some such. But then he's also got that darkness that prompts destruction of those around him. Thematically, his powers fit. They're not very useful in the game, though, because damaging your team means you play less (or pay for more health packs).

I'd love if the damage heroes like Sentry and Hulk do to their own team worked on the same mechanic as the "boost" from characters like KK and Spiderman. Just like their powers are not "true heal", make the damage "untrue". It hurts the team in the mission but they get it back after the match.

wymtime

Calnexin wrote:

JCTthe3rd81 wrote:

So I have said for a while now, Sentry really should be top tier.

Sentry was the hero they sent to stop the returning World War Hulk - and he did it. He's supposed to have the power of a billion suns or some such. But then he's also got that darkness that prompts destruction of those around him. Thematically, his powers fit. They're not very useful in the game, though, because damaging your team means you play less (or pay for more health packs).

I'd love if the damage heroes like Sentry and Hulk do to their own team worked on the same mechanic as the "boost" from characters like KK and Spiderman. Just like their powers are not "true heal", make the damage "untrue". It hurts the team in the mission but they get it back after the match.

The issue with sentry is they over nerfed him. Not only did they make WR cost significantly more but the CD tiles went to 3 instead of 2. This made him significantly slower and a poor choice. If his CD went back to 2 turn he would be more usable today especially when buffed.

carrion_pigeons

fmftint wrote:

And who do non whales replace him with? A unleveled 10 cover SS? Do you have 400k iso to make that swap? No, you're still going to use your 390-430 OML. The whales diversify (they already do) nothing changes for the rest of us.

They say they want diversity, but the game design promotes maximizing your limited resources

I rather suspect that for every non-whale who lucked into a covered OML, there's another person who "lucked" into a covered SS who has been cursing his luck for the past year. Somehow I doubt that guy would feel like he was being punished with an OML nerf. The only non-whales getting "punished" here would be the ones who have been above-averagely lucky for a long time and have been reaping the rewards of that luck for just as long. I don't see why that should continue at anyone's expense, let alone the expense of those who have been the least lucky (and I say this as someone whose most covered 5 is actually OML).

Look, everybody is tired of fighting OML. Everybody knows OML is hurting the meta, whether it's because of OP-ness or because of age. If people can back away from thinking about the personal impact of a nerf and start thinking about *how much more interesting* the game will be once they can stop fighting endless clones of the same guy, maybe we can actually improve the game a little bit. People threatening to quit over OML getting nerfed are being ridiculous: the game will be better with him gone - why would an objective improvement to the way the game plays drive you away? Take your sunk-cost fallacy out of the equation for just a minute and try to think about the positives!

Calnexin

Uber303 wrote:

That said, when you make the right combos they are all really useful. except bullseye, I found literally no use for him whatsoever except maybe the 4* he covers when champed, even then I don't know cos I sold him to make room for a better char

Bullseye's best power (IMO) is his passive. You can leverage the tile destruction into a match-5 many times, and clearing out a couple strong tiles can be effective, but they're expensive and not used a lot. Downing an opponent throws up a LOT of strike tiles. But that's limited in PvP - you might have to sacrifice an optimal match for the effect, and since you've only got three opponents the power can only fire twice, max. He shines in PvE wave nodes. Play it right and you can literally fill the board. His ancillary powers can also build up and make short work of the annoying Muscle and Lieutenant strike tiles, potentially throwing up more strikes of your own .

I've never used him in PvP outside required. Since he needs to fire a power or tank the color for his best ability, he's only useful when you have control of the board. But he does have his niche.

freakygeek

wymtime wrote:

Calnexin wrote:

JCTthe3rd81 wrote:

So I have said for a while now, Sentry really should be top tier.

Sentry was the hero they sent to stop the returning World War Hulk - and he did it. He's supposed to have the power of a billion suns or some such. But then he's also got that darkness that prompts destruction of those around him. Thematically, his powers fit. They're not very useful in the game, though, because damaging your team means you play less (or pay for more health packs).

I'd love if the damage heroes like Sentry and Hulk do to their own team worked on the same mechanic as the "boost" from characters like KK and Spiderman. Just like their powers are not "true heal", make the damage "untrue". It hurts the team in the mission but they get it back after the match.

The issue with sentry is they over nerfed him. Not only did they make WR cost significantly more but the CD tiles went to 3 instead of 2. This made him significantly slower and a poor choice. If his CD went back to 2 turn he would be more usable today especially when buffed.

This is my biggest concern about potential rebalances. Every time a character is nerfed they are overnerfed. Spiderman, Ragnarok, Sentry, X-Force and 4Thor were all over nerfed. They were all game breaking in the state they were in and the current state of the game but they were all reduced to near useless. Worse, after the nerfs the power creep was such that they would no longer have needed the nerfs.