MPQ At Marvel.com: Champion Levels

fmftint

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

fmftint wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

fmftint wrote:

Simply put, to champion, you're taking iso from characters you are still leveling and putting it into those you were completed

You're taking iso from a character temporarily to open the door to increased rewards which (likely) includes recouping the iso you spent in the first place.

So not really that simple.

What magical game are you playing that you think they are going to open the iso faucet so a champion becomes a iso genetator? Where has anything allowed for positive iso conversions?

In case this is what you think, no I don't think you can take a 2* off the street, level him/her for 70k, champion for 5k, and get more than 75k out of the rewards. That's not happening.

Within the video, when they scroll through the Hulkbuster champion, there's at least 24k in there (2500 @ level 285, 289, 293; 3000 @ lvl 297, 301, 305, 309, 3500 @ lvl 333). Since the cost of championing is no more than 20k (and is probably ~15k for 4*), then on those characters you're already done, I 100% think they'll generate more iso for you, even after accounting for not getting the normal 1k for selling.

You have to figure the cover cost in your equasion,
2☆ 5k entry + 12,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 17,500
3☆ 7500 entry +57,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 57,500
4☆ 10,000? entry + 100,000 in covers. Total sunk cost 110,000

You can't honestly believe championing will generate iso

GrumpySmurf1002

fmftint wrote:

Youhave to figurethe cover cost in your equasion,
2☆ 5k entry + 12,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 17,500
3☆ 7500 entry +57,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 57,500
4☆ 10,000? entry + 100,000 in covers. Total sunk cost 110,000

You can't honestly believe championing will generate iso

We got our wires crossed.

Yes, I'm guessing on a 4* you're taking a 35k iso loss. Which is your point, I think.

My point was the 10k investment initially would be recouped (it would) and generate other rewards besides just the Iso. To me, however much HP/CP/Tokens are in there is well more valuable than the 35k iso loss.

You can still sell IW to make up for it.

Tatercat

ErikPeter wrote:

I know I just deleted Moonstone for the fifth time (to make room), but she's going to be one of the better 2* to Champ. A level 144 boosted to 219 would be really strong. Not looking forward to those level 200+ cyc and IF being featured characters But at least it will take a while before too many people have them.

Oh, god, I hadn't even considered that. Not even PVP will be safe now from seeing those same Dark Avengers characters again and again, and again.......

Unknown

fmftint wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

In case this is what you think, no I don't think you can take a 2* off the street, level him/her for 70k, champion for 5k, and get more than 75k out of the rewards. That's not happening.

Within the video, when they scroll through the Hulkbuster champion, there's at least 24k in there (2500 @ level 285, 289, 293; 3000 @ lvl 297, 301, 305, 309, 3500 @ lvl 333). Since the cost of championing is no more than 20k (and is probably ~15k for 4*), then on those characters you're already done, I 100% think they'll generate more iso for you, even after accounting for not getting the normal 1k for selling.

You have to figure the cover cost in your equasion,
2☆ 5k entry + 12,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 17,500
3☆ 7500 entry +57,500 in covers. Total sunk cost: 57,500
4☆ 10,000? entry + 100,000 in covers. Total sunk cost 110,000

You can't honestly believe championing will generate iso

Well, lets do the Hulkbuster math.

Looking at those levels, it's an Iso reward every 4 Champion levels. So to fully Champion Hulkbuster, you'd get 25 Iso rewards. First Iso reward would be at 3 covers, probably 2000 Iso, to estimate low.

However, at anything less then 4000 Iso per, it's a net loss, since you'd get 4000 Iso for selling said covers.

So taking guessing at the Iso rewards here...

2000 x2
2500 x2
3000 x4
...and lets assume you get 500 Iso boost every 4, then, although it may be slower, I guess?
3500 x 4
4000 x 4
4500 x 2

That'd add up to 60,000 Iso, significantly less then the 100,000 cover entry fee.

Granted, you're going to get CP and Legendary Tokens and other covers in the rankings as well, probably, which can be turned into covers, and turned into Iso, but it's probably not going to be cover that Iso entry fee unless the actual Iso gifts are more generous then what I'm estimating here. (Which is possible! I can see 5K and 10K iso being gift tiers at higher rankings here)

I mean, it's worth it for a Hulkbuster. Probably not worth it for an Invisible Woman, though.

BlackSheep101

You're also improving the character on your roster.

If you went back in time and offered people a deal where they could trade 10k, 20k or 40k ISO for some combination of HP, CP, covers and LT, wouldn't most people leap at the opportunity? (I say most because this forum is a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.)

Tatercat

Have they show any other examples of the reward system anywhere besides the Hulkbuster in that video? Those rewards look nice but they were kinda dependent on you having 113 covers of a 4* (plus all the resulting ISO to get them to 270 in the 1st place.) I'm more curious to see how this looks for the first 30 or so champion levels of a 2* or 3* than the last 30 or so of a 4*.

UPDATE: Just rewatched the video, caught the bit on 2* Wolv & 3* Cap, not sure how I missed that other than I'm at work and was keeping a look out for my boss. Nevermind.

fmftint

BlackSheep101 wrote:

You're also improving the character on your roster.

If you went back in time and offered people a deal where they could trade 10k, 20k or 40k ISO for some combination of HP, CP, covers and LT, wouldn't most people leap at the opportunity? (I say most because this forum is a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.)

Iso is the life's blood of the game, hp and comps are luxuries. A man in the desert wouldn't trade his water for gold

GrumpySmurf1002

colwag wrote:

It's probably not going to be cover that Iso entry fee unless the actual Iso gifts are more generous then what I'm estimating here. (Which is possible! I can see 5K and 10K iso being gift tiers at higher rankings here)

Someone was nice enough to post the transcript of rewards for IMHB: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=37558

There's at least one 15k iso reward.

It looks like there's a clear pattern: CP and tokens on every even level (tokens on the 0s), Iso and HP alternating on the odds.

So 10 LTs, at least 340 CP (14 of 40 levels shown), 38k iso (9 of 25 shown), 1250 HP (10 of 25 shown). I'll see if I can recreate the whole thing and put it in that thread.

Tatercat

BlackSheep101 wrote:

You're also improving the character on your roster.

If you went back in time and offered people a deal where they could trade 10k, 20k or 40k ISO for some combination of HP, CP, covers and LT, wouldn't most people leap at the opportunity? (I say most because this forum is a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.)

I do remember way back when you COULD buy covers with ISO in this game (before they set the 13 cover structure). But your example still relies on needing ISO to make it work. And even if you got all 4 of those things without spending ISO, you're still going to need ISO eventually to make those rewards effective.

UPDATE: I do agree with you on the forum being a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.

BlackSheep101

Tatercat wrote:

BlackSheep101 wrote:

You're also improving the character on your roster.

If you went back in time and offered people a deal where they could trade 10k, 20k or 40k ISO for some combination of HP, CP, covers and LT, wouldn't most people leap at the opportunity? (I say most because this forum is a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.)

I do remember way back when you COULD buy covers with ISO in this game (before they set the 13 cover structure). But your example still relies on needing ISO to make it work. And even if you got all 4 of those things without spending ISO, you're still going to need ISO eventually to make those rewards effective.

UPDATE: I do agree with you on the forum being a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.

The way I look at it is, I get ~5000 ISO daily from DDQ and a bunch more from lightning rounds with minimal time investment. I'm going to champion my small set of 2*s and the few 3*s desperately in need of a respec. (5 at long last!) I'll pop my 250-odd standard tokens and take my champions as high as they'll go, and I'll have way more stuff than I did the day before. As the opportunity arises, I'll add more and more champions and throw their DDQ covers at them for more stuff. I'll have a reason to shoot for the 3* rewards in PVP and PVE again. And I'll have a new way of obtaining 4* covers from championing. I don't care if I still have to sell Rags and IM40 covers for 500 ISO if I can do more stuff with my level-maxed characters.

Also, they mentioned at the very end of the video that they're going to take a look at PVE difficulty next, so I'm hopeful they'll make a positive change there in the near future.

Azoth658

The really exciting thing for me on this is being able to flip powers around and changing builds.

The flexibility on who I use will significantly increase and also it enables me to focus on characters I was going to max yet because the 13 covers I have are a bad build.

There are also some exciting opportunities with championing a 2* to 144 such as Hawkeye and that speedshot. Combined with Scarlet Witch will be like having a Professor X for those of us not lucky to be far into our 4* transistion.

Tatercat

BlackSheep101 wrote:

Tatercat wrote:

BlackSheep101 wrote:

You're also improving the character on your roster.

If you went back in time and offered people a deal where they could trade 10k, 20k or 40k ISO for some combination of HP, CP, covers and LT, wouldn't most people leap at the opportunity? (I say most because this forum is a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.)

I do remember way back when you COULD buy covers with ISO in this game (before they set the 13 cover structure). But your example still relies on needing ISO to make it work. And even if you got all 4 of those things without spending ISO, you're still going to need ISO eventually to make those rewards effective.

UPDATE: I do agree with you on the forum being a wretched hive of scum and villainy full of people who will get pissed off at anything.

The way I look at it is, I get ~5000 ISO daily from DDQ and a bunch more from lightning rounds with minimal time investment. I'm going to champion my small set of 2*s and the few 3*s desperately in need of a respec. (5 at long last!) I'll pop my 250-odd standard tokens and take my champions as high as they'll go, and I'll have way more stuff than I did the day before. As the opportunity arises, I'll add more and more champions and throw their DDQ covers at them for more stuff. I'll have a reason to shoot for the 3* rewards in PVP and PVE again. And I'll have a new way of obtaining 4* covers from championing. I don't care if I still have to sell Rags and IM40 covers for 500 ISO if I can do more stuff with my level-maxed characters.

Also, they mentioned at the very end of the video that they're going to take a look at PVE difficulty next, so I'm hopeful they'll make a positive change there in the near future.

Good points. At this time, it doesn't hurt us to hope for the best on all this, and that it will work in practice better than any of us can predict now. It's too early to be negative on any of this (we've got to save that for Anniversary events! )

Norrin Radd

After reading more people's views on this new feature, I've decided it won't be bad. It is just not what most were hoping for to progress into 4 star land. They moved the carrot farther away, but hid that fact under rewards and more levels. Too much of this games balance is based on token luck, and this new feature still doesn't fix that much. That said its something new to do on a game that needed new content, so I'm hoping it works out better than I think.

cuviper

It seems silly to exclude 1* champions. Sure, a lot of people don't bother keeping any, or only keep Jugg for DDQ. But for us collect-them-all sort of people, why not allow a little 1* championing too? Maybe just 25 levels or so?

simonsez

cuviper wrote:

It seems silly to exclude 1* champions.

I was quite entertained by their reasoning... terrified to upset the balance and progression that newbs experience. Now if only they were equally concerned about the balance and progression experienced by everyone else...

madok

simonsez wrote:

cuviper wrote:

It seems silly to exclude 1* champions.

I was quite entertained by their reasoning... terrified to upset the balance and progression that newbs experience. Now if only they were equally concerned about the balance and progression experienced by everyone else...

Just imagine the person that opens all the spidermans. They would RULE THE WORLD!

ErikPeter

Edit: Level 100 1* Spidey would be cool, but at the same time, Champing should be something you do to the characters you're not just going to sell later to make room.

Forum guys would complain so much if they gave us another reason to maybe keep collecting 1*, and do you really want to pay a bunch of HP to slot a guy who caps at just 75 or 100? All the newbs who make IM35 "the most played character" would continue to do so for a few more levels, then feel even more let down when they eventually had to send him to "the farm upstate."

GMadMan040

Raffoon wrote:

At max covers you should be able to apply the additional covers, increasing current level by 1 and max level by 1, and earning the reward.

Forcing max ISO level makes this useless for so many characters.

This. So many times over this. Makes SO much sense. I am about to create 100 forum accounts just to up vote this over and over.

SnowcaTT

simonsez wrote:

cuviper wrote:

It seems silly to exclude 1* champions.

I was quite entertained by their reasoning... terrified to upset the balance and progression that newbs experience. Now if only they were equally concerned about the balance and progression experienced by everyone else...

I still think it has to be the future plan...so few 1*'s, just turn them into 2*'s and then subtract a star from every level. Their eternal release of character plan:

1* (current 1* and 2*'s, will all be able to be championed after they hit level 94)
2* (The forty old 3*'s)
3* (Once it gets around 40 4*'s, which will be gotten like the 3*'s are now)
4* (the 5*'s, ~15 by end of 2016...when they announce "There will be LOTS more in 2017" like they did with 4*'s start of 2015)
5* (Howard the Duck)

Nellyson

So am I missing something, because I thought there was no ISO needed after championing a hero. It just went up a level with whatever cover you got. No ISO needed to level them up on these bonus levels.