Stop messing with other characters and nerf CMags already
Comments
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This is really the best argument for "adjusting" CMags as it relates to PvP, he just makes winning on offense way too easy. Hilariously easy if you use boosts. If you beat a CMags team and then climb, you better be prepared to either shield or suck a 50 point loss at some point because CMags fears no enemy and rarely ever loses. You can argue defense isn't a major part of the game, but it amounts to exactly nothing as long as CMags exists in his current state. And don't get me wrong, I like using him. Use him all the time. He's fantastic. But he isn't fair. Not even remotely.AJBCLF wrote:0 -
I like to think of it as CMags artificially balancing PvP. Without him, the power level difference between Sentry/LD/LT and everyone else will be that much more unconscionable. At least with CMags around, people at the top can't play with relative impunity.Thugpatrol wrote:
This is really the best argument for "adjusting" CMags as it relates to PvP, he just makes winning on offense way too easy. Hilariously easy if you use boosts. If you beat a CMags team and then climb, you better be prepared to either shield or suck a 50 point loss at some point because CMags fears no enemy and rarely ever loses. You can argue defense isn't a major part of the game, but it amounts to exactly nothing as long as CMags exists in his current state. And don't get me wrong, I like using him. Use him all the time. He's fantastic. But he isn't fair. Not even remotely.AJBCLF wrote:
I agree that CMags is gimmicky and it's annoying getting hit by the same loaner/CMags/Patch for -40 points repeatedly, but from the devs' perspective it's easier to ignore CMags for as long as possible so they can ignore balancing the other overpowered chars.0 -
That's certainly one way to look at it. But let's not pretend they didn't know how stupidly OP Sentry was when they introduced him. I prefer to think of them as greedy rather than that incredibly incompetent (why not both?gobstopper wrote:I like to think of it as CMags artificially balancing PvP. Without him, the power level difference between Sentry/LD/LT and everyone else will be that much more unconscionable. At least with CMags around, people at the top can't play with relative impunity.
I agree that CMags is gimmicky and it's annoying getting hit by the same loaner/CMags/Patch for -40 points repeatedly, but from the devs' perspective it's easier to ignore CMags for as long as possible so they can ignore balancing the other overpowered chars.
). And they've been threatening to nerf CMags for longer than Sentry and the Lazies have even been a thing, which is what this thread was initially about.
Will went off on his little lecture some time back about game theory, buffs and nerfs and such, but the bottom line is they have no interest in trying to elevate the really bad characters because they can't find the money in it. If they did this would all be less of an issue. Until then CMags probably needs to come back down to earth, and Sentry probably should to (like maybe, I don't know, say if strike tiles were only applied once to World Rupture
). 0 -
clean_cut_hippie wrote:I never understood this argument that he's balanced because he's easy to beat when he's played by the AI. Just because defense and offense are opposites, doesn't mean that being weak on defense and strong on offense "evens out" when it comes to the gaming experience. The issue isn't that he's overpowered when you're playing against him. The issue is that he's overpowered when you're NOT playing. It pisses me off to no end to come back from a break to see that a maxed mags and 2 underleveled tag-alongs beat a 166/166/249 team that I built through months of effort, strategizing, and iso-spend. It completely eliminates the defensive component of the game, so unless the argument is that defense shouldn't really be a thing, I don't see how any objective view wouldn't come to the conclusion that something isn't broken there.
Okay, first off, I do that with OBW+Ares+etc.
Secondly: free easy retaliation.
I'm so sorry that having been there earlier and spending money doesn't gain you the "win the game forever" perk.
I'm so sorry that you got attacked and beaten by someone not quite on your level, which, you know, at this point is literally everyone (what did you expect?!) despite having a top tier team. And it's not like Magneto is 100% surefire. Oh, and fun fact: he could probably do the same with quite a few maxed 3*s. Because the AI is dumb. Maxed sentry can do exactly the same thing, no problem!thugpatrol wrote:This is really the best argument for "adjusting" CMags as it relates to PvP, he just makes winning on offense way too easy. Hilariously easy if you use boosts. If you beat a CMags team and then climb, you better be prepared to either shield or suck a 50 point loss at some point because CMags fears no enemy and rarely ever loses. You can argue defense isn't a major part of the game, but it amounts to exactly nothing as long as CMags exists in his current state. And don't get me wrong, I like using him. Use him all the time. He's fantastic. But he isn't fair. Not even remotely.
Um... How is this different from, yanno, almost any other offensive team involving a high-level 3*? Maybe CMags has it a little easier, but Patch+Daken, DoomPanther, Sentry+Anyone... Hell, even a smattering of ballsy 2* teams would go for that.0 -
A character that can win 100% of the time is bad for balance and it's not good for the bottom line either. Why would you ever need to buy other stuff when you got a character that can always win? And if you want to talk about defense, defense in this game is shields and Patch + Magneto is no worse under a shield compared to Sentry + Daken. Whoever attacks you will probably win anyway when you're high enough and either way you either lose a ton of points if you're not shielded or you lose 0 if you're shielded. Sentry is used because he wins very quickly. His excellent defense is a side bonus but it's not enough to stop Magneto + anyone, so you're still reliant on shields as your primary defense. If World Rupture only gets once benefit from strike tile, you'll be seeing a lot less Sentry + Daken or Sentry + Hood teams on the high end even though his defensive ability hasn't changed much (it's very rare for the AI will have both Sacrifice and World Rupture up at the same time).
It's true that if a character always wins 100% then the game is also balanced because you will just lose to the said character as quickly as you're winning, but that's not really enjoyable gameplay and it doesn't entice you to spend more money in terms of roster building, and from the last time I saw the revenue chart, roster related costs (roster expansion, token packs, ability upgrade) is far bigger than the amount spent on shields and boosts. If D3 is greedy, they need to make characters that makes you think "I got to get him on my team", not "I need more shields", but why would you need any new character on the team when you got someone who can win by himself? We've seen the Sentry + Bagman high scores, and in terms of just winning, Magneto + Bagman could've done that easily as well (wouldn't be practical due to the time required, but you can certainly win with those 2).0 -
To the people who say to not nerf him etc etc. it's simply going to happen.
Devs have said over and over and over again it's happening. Go to IceIX's posts and search for the term Magneto and stuff will come up.
It's coming (after Mod Hawkeye), it's just taking its time and it's probably not going to be pretty.0 -
Budget Player Cadet wrote:clean_cut_hippie wrote:I never understood this argument that he's balanced because he's easy to beat when he's played by the AI. Just because defense and offense are opposites, doesn't mean that being weak on defense and strong on offense "evens out" when it comes to the gaming experience. The issue isn't that he's overpowered when you're playing against him. The issue is that he's overpowered when you're NOT playing. It pisses me off to no end to come back from a break to see that a maxed mags and 2 underleveled tag-alongs beat a 166/166/249 team that I built through months of effort, strategizing, and iso-spend. It completely eliminates the defensive component of the game, so unless the argument is that defense shouldn't really be a thing, I don't see how any objective view wouldn't come to the conclusion that something isn't broken there.
Okay, first off, I do that with OBW+Ares+etc.
Secondly: free easy retaliation.
I'm so sorry that having been there earlier and spending money doesn't gain you the "win the game forever" perk. I'm so sorry that you got attacked and beaten by someone not quite on your level, which, you know, at this point is literally everyone (what did you expect?!) despite having a top tier team. And it's not like Magneto is 100% surefire. Oh, and fun fact: he could probably do the same with quite a few maxed 3*s. Because the AI is dumb. Maxed sentry can do exactly the same thing, no problem!
1. You take damage with Ares/OBW and therefore would be more careful about who you fight. Spamming an ability while the other team sits idle is not the same as effectively working a 2* team and taking your lumps/chances while you do it.
2. The reason why CMags teams attack me is because I'm a juicy point target. I'm not getting into retaliation wars with a lower points player.
3. I've bought exactly 2 covers and, reinterpreting your snark, I DO expect that the time I've played the game and the effort I've put in would gain me an advantage. Why is that such a weird concept? Isn't that the way it should work?0 -
I got attacked 12 times in the last three hours of the last event. Everyone of them was a CMags team. There's less parity now than when Spidey was before that nerf.
People say how over powered Sentry is, but why is it that teams attack me with CMags 100% of the time.0 -
Because it's CMags.saints2death wrote:I got attacked 12 times in the last three hours of the last event. Everyone of them was a CMags team. There's less parity now than when Spidey was before that nerf.
People say how over powered Sentry is, but why is it that teams attack me with CMags 100% of the time.0 -
So I joined this forum because I've used Cmagneto since before the ragnarok nerf and have to say I left the game for a bit with the ragnarok nerf. If they nerf his blue, which is understandable, could they just make it so it costs five blue but makes 2 purple protect tiles or any other color. If it only makes protect tiles, than it goes from being a broken blue to a terrible blue. Like spiderman's free passive is better than that. You can stop the infinite cascade problem while still giving him the ability to creatively use his blue if you just make it create a tile of a different color.0
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CMag's is hillariously underlevelled in my Roster because I've been waiting for this nerf... for 3 months (I think). One way or another I wish they'd either nerf him or announce no changes. Then again, that would mean some kind of community engagement which they don't do now unless something goes horribly wrong.0
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Sentry, Cmags, and hood seems to be nasty defensive combo
If you're boosted, odds are you're feeding the team after first turn. Cmags is using colors that allow sentry to save up his strong colors.
1. Long animations draw out the game, making a quick game difficult
2. Cheap abilities that scatter board, and AI's tendency to make matches fuel team quickly
3. cmag red and blue effectively mitigates world rupture used against it
4. AI will always use CMAG blue, and is more likely to use CMAG red than Supernova. Is also more likely to use Sacrifice than twin pistols.
5. The focus on avoiding world rupture leaves one vulnerable to Magnetic Translocation0 -
4.5 Random placement of the defence tile means there's a pretty good chance it'll be in play if a World Rupture does go off, limiting the damage fairly substantially.Bugpop wrote:Sentry, Cmags, and hood seems to be nasty defensive combo
If you're boosted, odds are you're feeding the team after first turn. Cmags is using colors that allow sentry to save up his strong colors.
1. Long animations draw out the game, making a quick game difficult
2. Cheap abilities that scatter board, and AI's tendency to make matches fuel team quickly
3. cmag red and blue effectively mitigates world rupture used against it
4. AI will always use CMAG blue, and is more likely to use CMAG red than Supernova. Is also more likely to use Sacrifice than twin pistols.
5. The focus on avoiding world rupture leaves one vulnerable to Magnetic Translocation0 -
When I finally managed to max out my Sentry (and leveled him to 145, equal to my other characters) I was excited to set him on the defensive and see how he holds at moderate point totals (800-900ish). I thought for sure nobody would want to mess with a Sentry. Only four teams ended up attacking me, all four had C.Magneto. This is a reoccurring theme in every pvp I encounter. I just don't understand why Spidey got the nerf and not C.Mags.0
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spidey was on the wane anyway, since he was an even bigger "kick me" sign for anyone who had even a reasonably leveled team, since he had NO offensive capabilitiesDauthi wrote:When I finally managed to max out my Sentry (and leveled him to 145, equal to my other characters) I was excited to set him on the defensive and see how he holds at moderate point totals (800-900ish). I thought for sure nobody would want to mess with a Sentry. Only four teams ended up attacking me, all four had C.Magneto. This is a reoccurring theme in every pvp I encounter. I just don't understand why Spidey got the nerf and not C.Mags.0 -
For a long time Magneto covers were only available in lightning rounds which made it hard for most people to build him.0
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saints2death wrote:I got attacked 12 times in the last three hours of the last event. Everyone of them was a CMags team. There's less parity now than when Spidey was before that nerf.
People say how over powered Sentry is, but why is it that teams attack me with CMags 100% of the time.
One thing you have to realize is that Magneto was one of the first 3*s ever created in this game, and therefore, most players have a full Mags. On the other hand, characters like Sentry, 3* Daken, 3* Thor and other powerhouses are relatively new. Most players do not have them completed and fully leveled up. That is why Mags is seen so often compared to the others. Saying that, I've seen a lot of teams at higher levels use other characters like those above.
As for Magneto being a guarantee win, I use Magneto. He wins often, not always. Put him against a team with, let's say a Hood, and it is a much closer game. Also, I've never ran from a team because it has a Magneto, even when I'm not using him. I do agree that he is one of the most powerful characters in the game, and his blue and red can be very spammy (on the right board with lots of blues, it is game over). They do need to be changed. I don't mention the purple because of how hard it is to get a lot of blues and reds on the same board. It still probably should be 12 purples to use it (No one can tell me it is worse than Black Panthers black which does over 3000 to ALL players.) Having said that, people do not trust D3 to nerf. Spider-Man's blue was far too powerful. They didn't just nerf him, though. They kicked his butt, shot him 40 times, and then shoved a nightstick up his ****. A nerf needs to be done. Nobody needs to see an old man with a nightstick up his ****. Don't let them put a nightstick up his ****. Called 1-555-NoStick and tell them that we do not need to see this.0 -
Spoit wrote:
multiple times a week, which made him way easier to build than other 3*sPhantron wrote:For a long time Magneto covers were only available in lightning rounds which made it hard for most people to build him.
But Loki, Doom and Ragnarock are in the lightning rounds and those 3 characters only have two skills, a maximum of 10 covers. Oh, I see you were talking about all 3*'s and not just the villains.
From what I remember of the lighting round, to score high, you usually need a decent level for the featured character. It took me about 3 months of playing this game, starting last November, before I was able to finally score high in a lightning round and win a 3* cover. There's no way I'd be competitve in this game (without paying $$$) if I didn't score my Magneto (red and blue) and Doom covers before the lightning rounds got nerfed. I still only have 1 Magneto purple cover and I think that was a daily reward.0 -
Knyghtmare wrote:saints2death wrote:I got attacked 12 times in the last three hours of the last event. Everyone of them was a CMags team. There's less parity now than when Spidey was before that nerf.
People say how over powered Sentry is, but why is it that teams attack me with CMags 100% of the time.
One thing you have to realize is that Magneto was one of the first 3*s ever created in this game, and therefore, most players have a full Mags. On the other hand, characters like Sentry, 3* Daken, 3* Thor and other powerhouses are relatively new. Most players do not have them completed and fully leveled up. That is why Mags is seen so often compared to the others. Saying that, I've seen a lot of teams at higher levels use other characters like those above.
As for Magneto being a guarantee win, I use Magneto. He wins often, not always. Put him against a team with, let's say a Hood, and it is a much closer game. Also, I've never ran from a team because it has a Magneto, even when I'm not using him. I do agree that he is one of the most powerful characters in the game, and his blue and red can be very spammy (on the right board with lots of blues, it is game over). They do need to be changed. I don't mention the purple because of how hard it is to get a lot of blues and reds on the same board. It still probably should be 12 purples to use it (No one can tell me it is worse than Black Panthers black which does over 3000 to ALL players.) Having said that, people do not trust D3 to nerf. Spider-Man's blue was far too powerful. They didn't just nerf him, though. They kicked his butt, shot him 40 times, and then shoved a nightstick up his ****. A nerf needs to be done. Nobody needs to see an old man with a nightstick up his ****. Don't let them put a nightstick up his ****. Called 1-555-NoStick and tell them that we do not need to see this.
haha, yes, Spidey is crippled now and he's rarely seen in PvP anymore.
You have to wonder **** was going on in the minds of D3 when they decided to give Ragnarock and Spidey 2 AP skills (when maxed)0
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