2AP abilities should be nerfed

Unknown

Handsome3314 wrote:

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Well right now the 4 star characters are pretty weak IMO. Loki is a weak 3 star and the Hood has gotten better. Other than that Rag has a killer move with Thunderclap, all three of Spidey's moves are killer now that Spider - sense creates protect tiles, Magneto has an attack that potentially does over 10k in damage when he's maxed out for only 10 AP, Doom's Demons can repeatedly do over 1000 each turn if you can't remove them, and BW Grey can annihilate a team at 19 AP which is easy with her other move and the help of 1 or 2 Thunderclaps. It all seems pretty even to me. People just use Rag most often and it's annoying people who don't have him at that caliber. Well then use another strategy and beat him with those other characters. At what point will we need to stop nerf in players so everyone is happy? Everyone complains that Rag dominates, well be happy that his cap is 115 instead of 141. That itself can be a nerf since he only has 2 moves and is only strong with two colors.

They're 3 stars, they're all good, end of story.

No they are all not equally good. All other characters are pretty weak compared to characters with 2AP abilities. Why doesn't Invisible Woman have a 2AP ability ? Why are all the other 3/4 star characters kick **** abilities require so much AP? (e.g. why stun IM40 for 2 turns to use his recharge abilities? Even more laughable Wolverines X-force heal requires 10 AP + 7 turn countdown timer - he would never last that long)

So either nerf 2AP, or lower the AP requirement for other characters.

Unknown

Misguided wrote:

DumDumDugn wrote:

When will people realize Ragnarok is not significantly better than Magneto or Spider-man. He's just more braindead.

Everybody talks about Ragnarok because they've seen him. Everybody has the chance to fight him not only in the prologue but also in iso-8, Hunt, etc. When Magneto becomes more popular, you'll hear plenty of complaints about him too.

In this Rag lightning round i used mags powers the same if not more than rags. Once he starts chaining blues for crits that do 6k over and over...lol

Unknown

morphy wrote:

Handsome3314 wrote:

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Well right now the 4 star characters are pretty weak IMO. Loki is a weak 3 star and the Hood has gotten better. Other than that Rag has a killer move with Thunderclap, all three of Spidey's moves are killer now that Spider - sense creates protect tiles, Magneto has an attack that potentially does over 10k in damage when he's maxed out for only 10 AP, Doom's Demons can repeatedly do over 1000 each turn if you can't remove them, and BW Grey can annihilate a team at 19 AP which is easy with her other move and the help of 1 or 2 Thunderclaps. It all seems pretty even to me. People just use Rag most often and it's annoying people who don't have him at that caliber. Well then use another strategy and beat him with those other characters. At what point will we need to stop nerf in players so everyone is happy? Everyone complains that Rag dominates, well be happy that his cap is 115 instead of 141. That itself can be a nerf since he only has 2 moves and is only strong with two colors.

They're 3 stars, they're all good, end of story.

No they are all not equally good. All other characters are pretty weak compared to characters with 2AP abilities. Why doesn't Invisible Woman have a 2AP ability ? Why are all the other 3/4 star characters kick **** abilities require so much AP? (e.g. why stun IM40 for 2 turns to use his recharge abilities? Even more laughable Wolverines X-force heal requires 10 AP + 7 turn countdown timer - he would never last that long)

So either nerf 2AP, or lower the AP requirement for other characters.

Like I said the 4 star characters are weak. I agree with you there, but IM40 also has the highest health at max, and his attacks are strong even if they deplete some AP from the other colors.

Unknown

DumDumDugn wrote:

When will people realize Ragnarok is not significantly better than Magneto or Spider-man. He's just more braindead.

The braindead part is so true.

In this lightning round I decided to put what I have been claiming to the test and run with my 70 Ragnarok, 70 Magneto and 60 Classic Storm. It was basically Thunderclap spam until out of red, Lightning storm twice then Magneto's purple 1-2 times to kill someone, rinse repeat. I didn't even bother matching tiles unless I had to. So boring and yet I finished top 8 and only used 1-2 health packs due to random AI forest fires.

Used all the stockpile boosts I could and ended with 1k+ more iso than I started with. Ok, 5 red is hard to get on Ragnarok unless you pay but once you get there things are silly! If I stopped trying to level every character and just maxed Ragnarok I'd probably win every tournament easily.

Unknown

morphy wrote:

(e.g. why stun IM40 for 2 turns to use his recharge abilities?

Because it gives a **** ton of AP and can completely turn around a fight that is going poorly. Seems reasonable to me.

Unknown

DumDumDugn wrote:

When will people realize Ragnarok is not significantly better than Magneto or Spider-man. He's just more braindead.

Power-wise, not significantly better but still better. What really makes him good, is that he costs less ISO to max and only needs 5 covers, as opposed to the 10 or so Mags needs.

There's the argument that 3-stars should be more powerful, but they never really state that this is "balanced" because 3-stars should be harder to find or train. Rags is simultaneously the strongest and cheapest to train.

Unknown

ihearthawthats wrote:

DumDumDugn wrote:

When will people realize Ragnarok is not significantly better than Magneto or Spider-man. He's just more braindead.

Power-wise, not significantly better but still better. What really makes him good, is that he costs less ISO to max and only needs 5 covers, as opposed to the 10 or so Mags needs.

There's the argument that 3-stars should be more powerful, but they never really state that this is "balanced" because 3-stars should be harder to find or train. Rags is simultaneously the strongest and cheapest to train.

So you can max level Rags with only 5 covers? I understand you have a deep and abiding hatred of Rags, but you keep making comparisons that give optimal conditions to Ragnarok and worst possible conditions to other 3*s.

Mags does require 15 covers to max level, but that's the perpetual tradeoff between 2 and 3 covers. I will agree that Rags health is absurd for a 2 cover hero though. (And I also think that there should be a small change to his red, either increasing AP by 1 or decreasing tile generation).

You keep forgetting, however, is that Rags is completely hamstrung if you cannot get red. His only other strong color is green. Everything else is pitifully weak, and it does matter. A non-buffed Rags is not significantly better than an equally leveled Mags, Doom, or IM40. And while Spidey's stun is amazing, he simply doesn't have any offense. In a 1v1 he'd always win because of the stun/heal/defense, but against IM40 or Rags or Doom it'll take a long, long time.

Again, I do think Rags could use some small rebalancing, but I honestly do not think he's amazingly better than the other 3*.

Loki is, however, better than the 4*...

Spoit

Half the 1*s are better than the kitty 4* booby prizes

Unknown

Zathrus wrote:

You keep forgetting, however, is that Rags is completely hamstrung if you cannot get red.

This is true, but I'm not sure what the point is when Mags is hamstrung without blue+purple. So it doesn't refute the point that Rags is easier to acquire/train. Green only Rags vs Red only Mags, tough to call it. I would say Rags, because either you leave Mags at 3 red or take it to 5 red and have a non-standard 4/5/4 or 5/5/3 build.

So you can max level Rags with only 5 covers? I understand you have a deep and abiding hatred of Rags, but you keep making comparisons that give optimal conditions to Ragnarok and worst possible conditions to other 3*s.

These are not optimal conditions. I'm not trying to compare Rags at lvl 115 vs Mags at lvl 115. Rags at lvl 115 is stronger than Mags at lvl 141. Even if it's ever so slight, there's still something wrong there.

Unknown

I have a level 115 rags and a 95 mags right now and honestly I have a way more fun time with mags and its not close. That should count for something right?

Unknown

Came to visit this thread because I just got my first 2AP ability and don't want Spidey's 2AP stun nerfed! I used earned (not purchased) HP to get two covers and won the rest. It was not easy to do and it would really hurt to have it taken away just as I got it. I think using the stun lock strategy works well but it is slow as a counter - have not tried it with 2AP stun yet.

Regarding Rags 2AP attack - I don't enjoy facing it that is for sure. His red is the only other cover I have used HP for and that was to get it from 1 to 2 for 5HP red attack. That made a huge difference in the DA tournament so I can only imagine what it would be like to have it at 2HP. Right now I feel like I can't get to top 50 (or 100 for that matter) in lightning rounds anymore because I take too long to win my matches compared to the Rags teams. I used to be able to get top 50 if I worked it the whole 90mins. Also, my fingers are getting sore from all the skips

Spoit

greggray24 wrote:

Came to visit this thread because I just got my first 2AP ability and don't want Spidey's 2AP stun nerfed! I used earned (not purchased) HP to get two covers and won the rest. It was not easy to do and it would really hurt to have it taken away just as I got it. I think using the stun lock strategy works well but it is slow as a counter - have not tried it with 2AP stun yet.

Regarding Rags 2AP attack - I don't enjoy facing it that is for sure. His red is the only other cover I have used HP for and that was to get it from 1 to 2 for 5HP red attack. That made a huge difference in the DA tournament so I can only imagine what it would be like to have it at 2HP. Right now I feel like I can't get to top 50 (or 100 for that matter) in lightning rounds anymore because I take too long to win my matches compared to the Rags teams. I used to be able to get top 50 if I worked it the whole 90mins. Also, my fingers are getting sore from all the skips

That sounds like a too high matchmaking. You should probably be able to get the diabolic with just thor/c.storm, since it's usually not that far past the 250 mark

Unknown

If you tank enough beforehand its not hard finishing top 25 with a mediocre team.

Unknown

I've been my using 53 Mags - perhaps I should back to my Storm/Thor/Villan combo.

Regarding 250pts - I've passed that every time I've tried for top 50 and lately it has not been enough for top 100.

EDIT: Doom tourney was funny since I think a lot of people have the Doom covers they need from avoiding first in the Thor tournament. The last half hour was trying to maintain top 50. Got it and then drew Hood...

Dauthi

Zathrus wrote:

You keep forgetting, however, is that Rags is completely hamstrung if you cannot get red. His only other strong color is green. Everything else is pitifully weak, and it does matter. A non-buffed Rags is not significantly better than an equally leveled Mags, Doom, or IM40. And while Spidey's stun is amazing, he simply doesn't have any offense. In a 1v1 he'd always win because of the stun/heal/defense, but against IM40 or Rags or Doom it'll take a long, long time.

It's funny you mention him getting hamstrung if he doesn't get red when his ability is only 2 ap. Any other 3 star character is much more likely to get starved, and that is the point. Even when you fight a Ragnarok and are intentionally denying him reds, he still ends up hitting you once or twice, because it only costs 2 ap which is likely to drop when you are trying to chunk down his massive hp.

Ragnarok initiates his death blow combos at a much faster rate than other 3 stars, and that is what counts when time is critical in tournaments.

Unknown

I'm starting to think Mags 5AP needs to be nerfed more than Rag 2AP. He's much a one-man combo machine. And don't kid yourself, it doesn't take "skill" - it's just a bit of pattern reading.

Three blues nearby each other on the board? Here have a free critical tile placed at the spot that most suits your fancy.
The critical dropped with some blues nearby on the board? Here have a super damage 5-match!
Only two blues nearby each other on the board? No problem! Have a free line clear and grab yourself whatever other AP you need. If you have more than 5AP, you can try again next round?
Nothing worthy of note on the board? Lets see whether we can do a blue 3-match and set ourselves up for a different color's 5 match.
Nothing interesting happening? Lets just put 2 defense tiles where the AI will never be able to get them and match to our heart's fancy.
Opponent has unleashed a devastating strike tile? Quick lets overwrite it with blue defense tiles or destroy it with the free line clear!

Unknown

Sooty wrote:

I'm starting to think Mags 5AP needs to be nerfed more than Rag 2AP. He's much a one-man combo machine. And don't kid yourself, it doesn't take "skill" - it's just a bit of pattern reading.

Three blues nearby each other on the board? Here have a free critical tile placed at the spot that most suits your fancy.
The critical dropped with some blues nearby on the board? Here have a super damage 5-match!
Only two blues nearby each other on the board? No problem! Have a free line clear and grab yourself whatever other AP you need. If you have more than 5AP, you can try again next round?
Nothing worthy of note on the board? Lets see whether we can do a blue 3-match and set ourselves up for a different color's 5 match.
Nothing interesting happening? Lets just put 2 defense tiles where the AI will never be able to get them and match to our heart's fancy.
Opponent has unleashed a devastating strike tile? Quick lets overwrite it with blue defense tiles or destroy it with the free line clear!

shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Unknown

DumDumDugn wrote:

Sooty wrote:

I'm starting to think Mags 5AP needs to be nerfed more than Rag 2AP. He's much a one-man combo machine. And don't kid yourself, it doesn't take "skill" - it's just a bit of pattern reading.

Three blues nearby each other on the board? Here have a free critical tile placed at the spot that most suits your fancy.
The critical dropped with some blues nearby on the board? Here have a super damage 5-match!
Only two blues nearby each other on the board? No problem! Have a free line clear and grab yourself whatever other AP you need. If you have more than 5AP, you can try again next round?
Nothing worthy of note on the board? Lets see whether we can do a blue 3-match and set ourselves up for a different color's 5 match.
Nothing interesting happening? Lets just put 2 defense tiles where the AI will never be able to get them and match to our heart's fancy.
Opponent has unleashed a devastating strike tile? Quick lets overwrite it with blue defense tiles or destroy it with the free line clear!

shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

dw dumdum we have both Mags and Rags... they won't nerf both at the same time I'm sure .... ... right...? ...

Unknown

I find it hilarious all the people with rags (dumdum) trying to desperately stop this nerf. It really is necessary. 2 ap is way too low for generating 5 greens and having infinite combos every turn. Everyone trying to say it would piss off too many paying people or hes 3 stars? What about when they nerfed storm? I'm sure people paid for her and leveled her yellow to 5 instead of green and are now SOL. The main point here is this is a BETA and you knew that while spending money / iso. Changes are inevitable and you just have to accept it. money spent or not.

Dauthi

Sooty wrote:

I'm starting to think Mags 5AP needs to be nerfed more than Rag 2AP. He's much a one-man combo machine. And don't kid yourself, it doesn't take "skill" - it's just a bit of pattern reading.

Three blues nearby each other on the board? Here have a free critical tile placed at the spot that most suits your fancy.
The critical dropped with some blues nearby on the board? Here have a super damage 5-match!
Only two blues nearby each other on the board? No problem! Have a free line clear and grab yourself whatever other AP you need. If you have more than 5AP, you can try again next round?
Nothing worthy of note on the board? Lets see whether we can do a blue 3-match and set ourselves up for a different color's 5 match.
Nothing interesting happening? Lets just put 2 defense tiles where the AI will never be able to get them and match to our heart's fancy.
Opponent has unleashed a devastating strike tile? Quick lets overwrite it with blue defense tiles or destroy it with the free line clear!

The main problem with Magneto compared to Ragnarok is that the computer is stupid when it comes to placing tiles. Therefor Ragnarok is also a huge deterrent when choosing targets to fight...