@S0kun said: @killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these? Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented.
@S0kun said:
@killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these?
Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented.
Why are you putting an additional burden on CS with this? Just send retro rewards out, you have the data.
Why is common sense getting flagged now? 🤣
@jp1 said: @DAZ0273 said: What a generous thing to do. I hope those of you whining now double down on buying MORE to say thank you. Don’t know if whining was appropriate terminology. But, I do typically purchase extra when things like this are done.
@jp1 said:
@DAZ0273 said: What a generous thing to do. I hope those of you whining now double down on buying MORE to say thank you.
Don’t know if whining was appropriate terminology. But, I do typically purchase extra when things like this are done.
Maybe, maybe not and sorry for anybody upset by my indelicate choice of words but seriously this really is a bit much. Got your 370 champ rewards? Check. Got your ascended character? Check. Got some character ascended rewards? Check. Pretty good goi...oh wait, Please Sir, I want some more!
The pandering has to stop at some point or maybe that is just cranky old me! In my world, every night is not Ice Cream night.
Why are you so upset? Nobody is taking stuff away from you.
@Bowgentle said: Why are you so upset? Nobody is taking stuff away from you.
I'm not upset and I don't begrudge. I just can't get my head around the U-turn or the fact toys came out the pram. Don't worry, I am not on some crusade to deprive you or anybody else of retro rewards I just think it sets an insane precedent that a games company sets a policy and then rolls over under the gentlest of grumbling. I guess it is their bed and they get to lie in it with all the extra work they just gave themselves.
Yeah I don't get the exception. Either give full retro rewards for everything in the future - or don't, including Nico. I can live with not getting retro covers.
@Bowgentle said: Yeah I don't get the exception. Either give full retro rewards for everything in the future - or don't, including Nico. I can live with not getting retro covers.
Exactly. All this does now is causes confusion but also means there is a potentially not unreasonable expectation that this happens every time. It just seems illogical and illogic bugs me!
@DAZ0273 said: @Bowgentle said: Yeah I don't get the exception. Either give full retro rewards for everything in the future - or don't, including Nico. I can live with not getting retro covers. Exactly. All this does now is causes confusion but also means there is a potentially not unreasonable expectation that this happens every time. It just seems illogical and illogic bugs me!
@DAZ0273 said:
Illogical to me is creating a negative consequence to a feature that was meant to reward a healthy roster, probably built through years of supporting the game financially and play. Not everything has to be a trade off. You act as if it is a privilege or something, which I find confusing. Throwing retro rewards on newer characters is one thing, but holding back ascension for those who could otherwise do it just to make them choose is pointless. If you wait to ascend you get both, you seem to think that is fair…what’s the difference?
In any case, I’m happy with the exception. Now that I know the consequences of ascending I will simply deal with it. However ridiculous it seems. Honestly, no maths even need be involved at a bare minimum an ascended character is worth six covers…if they said it was too complicated to figure who you merged them with and reward that, that would make sense to me.
This forum has an ironic negative undertone towards people who actually support the game financially and I find that very strange. It wouldn’t exist without people who spend. You think that shouldn’t be rewarded? Or a decade of dedication? It’s a bit silly to act like it’s some pandering to care about the customers who support your business long term.
@Bowgentle said: @S0kun said: @killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these? Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented. Why are you putting an additional burden on CS with this? Just send retro rewards out, you have the data.
@Bowgentle said:
They probably don't have any system in place to send out the covers. From what Sokun said, it sounds like their Retroactive reward system actually pulls the rewards chain from the character and "regifts" the covers based on the new chain. Since the 5* version doesn't have a rewards chain that includes those covers, it doesn't work.
Since it's a flat rewards, it seems like it would be a simple IF/THEN statement (or equivalent, I have no idea if this terminology is super old-school) to add on to the retro rewards system (IF 5* Nico exists, THEN reward 6 covers,) but they'd have to code it up, and who knows how simple it would be in execution.
I'm grateful they're giving us the rewards this time, but I will persist in my opinion - there shouldn't be an inherent disadvantage to Ascending a character, it's extremely counter-intuitive and in general against the the grain of virtually any game.
@jp1 said: @DAZ0273 said: @Bowgentle said: Yeah I don't get the exception. Either give full retro rewards for everything in the future - or don't, including Nico. I can live with not getting retro covers. Exactly. All this does now is causes confusion but also means there is a potentially not unreasonable expectation that this happens every time. It just seems illogical and illogic bugs me! Illogical to me is creating a negative consequence to a feature that was meant to reward a healthy roster, probably built through years of supporting the game financially and play. Not everything has to be a trade off. You act as if it is a privilege or something, which I find confusing. Throwing retro rewards on newer characters is one thing, but holding back ascension for those who could otherwise do it just to make them choose is pointless. If you wait to ascend you get both, you seem to think that is fair…what’s the difference? In any case, I’m happy with the exception. Now that I know the consequences of ascending I will simply deal with it. However ridiculous it seems. Honestly, no maths even need be involved at a bare minimum an ascended character is worth six covers…if they said it was too complicated to figure who you merged them with and reward that, that would make sense to me. This forum has an ironic negative undertone towards people who actually support the game financially and I find that very strange. It wouldn’t exist without people who spend. You think that shouldn’t be rewarded? Or a decade of dedication? It’s a bit silly to act like it’s some pandering to care about the customers who support your business long term.
Not sure I said any of that? The illogicality I am speaking of is creating a policy and then immediately doing a U-turn the very second that policy is challenged.
My other comments were just a general joke/sarcasm about anybody being a Karen about this in the first place.
End of the day players get their covers so nothing more to really debate. If the Devs are happy to have not only lumbered their CS department with a boatload of work and to undermine the policy they decided to put in place the minute it happens again and there are more hissy fits then they can go nuts. shrugs
@GrimSkald said: @Bowgentle said: @S0kun said: @killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these? Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented. Why are you putting an additional burden on CS with this? Just send retro rewards out, you have the data. They probably don't have any system in place to send out the covers. From what Sokun said, it sounds like their Retroactive reward system actually pulls the rewards chain from the character and "regifts" the covers based on the new chain. Since the 5* version doesn't have a rewards chain that includes those covers, it doesn't work. Since it's a flat rewards, it seems like it would be a simple IF/THEN statement (or equivalent, I have no idea if this terminology is super old-school) to add on to the retro rewards system (IF 5* Nico exists, THEN reward 6 covers,) but they'd have to code it up, and who knows how simple it would be in execution. I'm grateful they're giving us the rewards this time, but I will persist in my opinion - there shouldn't be an inherent disadvantage to Ascending a character, it's extremely counter-intuitive and in general against the the grain of virtually any game.
@GrimSkald said:
I agree with all of this. I have a 4* Rockett ready to ascend but feel like I shouldn’t ascend him now. It does feel counter-intuitive to hinder progress.
The problem with the If/Then system is that you could be missing out on anywhere from 6-12 covers depending on the second character’s level and there’s no way for the computer to account for that. But giving 6 is better than nothing at all.
@Daredevil217 said: @GrimSkald said: @Bowgentle said: @S0kun said: @killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these? Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented. Why are you putting an additional burden on CS with this? Just send retro rewards out, you have the data. They probably don't have any system in place to send out the covers. From what Sokun said, it sounds like their Retroactive reward system actually pulls the rewards chain from the character and "regifts" the covers based on the new chain. Since the 5* version doesn't have a rewards chain that includes those covers, it doesn't work. Since it's a flat rewards, it seems like it would be a simple IF/THEN statement (or equivalent, I have no idea if this terminology is super old-school) to add on to the retro rewards system (IF 5* Nico exists, THEN reward 6 covers,) but they'd have to code it up, and who knows how simple it would be in execution. I'm grateful they're giving us the rewards this time, but I will persist in my opinion - there shouldn't be an inherent disadvantage to Ascending a character, it's extremely counter-intuitive and in general against the the grain of virtually any game. I agree with all of this. I have a 4* Rockett ready to ascend but feel like I shouldn’t ascend him now. It does feel counter-intuitive to hinder progress. The problem with the If/Then system is that you could be missing out on anywhere from 6-12 covers depending on the second character’s level and there’s no way for the computer to account for that. But giving 6 is better than nothing at all.
@Daredevil217 said:
I dunno. Check for ascended Nico, that's 6 covers. Count the levels over 450, divide by 4, see if it hits a threshold for more covers from the second character. I don't think it would be a terribly complicated query, but of course I don't know their data structure.
@DAZ0273 said: @jp1 said: @DAZ0273 said: @Bowgentle said: Yeah I don't get the exception. Either give full retro rewards for everything in the future - or don't, including Nico. I can live with not getting retro covers. Exactly. All this does now is causes confusion but also means there is a potentially not unreasonable expectation that this happens every time. It just seems illogical and illogic bugs me! Illogical to me is creating a negative consequence to a feature that was meant to reward a healthy roster, probably built through years of supporting the game financially and play. Not everything has to be a trade off. You act as if it is a privilege or something, which I find confusing. Throwing retro rewards on newer characters is one thing, but holding back ascension for those who could otherwise do it just to make them choose is pointless. If you wait to ascend you get both, you seem to think that is fair…what’s the difference? In any case, I’m happy with the exception. Now that I know the consequences of ascending I will simply deal with it. However ridiculous it seems. Honestly, no maths even need be involved at a bare minimum an ascended character is worth six covers…if they said it was too complicated to figure who you merged them with and reward that, that would make sense to me. This forum has an ironic negative undertone towards people who actually support the game financially and I find that very strange. It wouldn’t exist without people who spend. You think that shouldn’t be rewarded? Or a decade of dedication? It’s a bit silly to act like it’s some pandering to care about the customers who support your business long term. Not sure I said any of that? The illogicality I am speaking of is creating a policy and then immediately doing a U-turn the very second that policy is challenged. My other comments were just a general joke/sarcasm about anybody being a Karen about this in the first place. End of the day players get their covers so nothing more to really debate. If the Devs are happy to have not only lumbered their CS department with a boatload of work and to undermine the policy they decided to put in place the minute it happens again and there are more hissy fits then they can go nuts. shrugs
I guess I should have been more clear that all of this wasn’t directed solely at you. My bad, lost in my thoughts there.
I do stand by the post but quoting you directly wasn’t the right avenue.
Do we know that they implemented this one time exception due to player outrage and it’s not something they just decided to do from a place of generosity? Especially with it being the holiday season I’m very appreciative of this. I just think it’s important not to write the narrative if we don’t really know.
As far as customer service being “flooded” I’m guessing they accounted for that. They probably know how many 5* Nico’s they are dealing with here and what the toll will be.
I do hope going forward they can find an automated way to award retros to non-feeders though.
@Daredevil217 said: Do we know that they implemented this one time exception due to player outrage and it’s not something they just decided to do from a place of generosity? Especially with it being the holiday season I’m very appreciative of this. I just think it’s important not to write the narrative if we don’t really know. As far as customer service being “flooded” I’m guessing they accounted for that. They probably know how many 5* Nico’s they are dealing with here and what the toll will be.
@Daredevil217 said: Do we know that they implemented this one time exception due to player outrage and it’s not something they just decided to do from a place of generosity? Especially with it being the holiday season I’m very appreciative of this. I just think it’s important not to write the narrative if we don’t really know.
In reality I expect that quite a few players are going to miss out on this. Players who come here or Reddit or are in chat rooms with alliance mates etc will certainly know. But players who don't will have no idea they can submit a CS request for 6 covers (ie there is no general announcement in the game) and what's worse is there is a time limit (6 days) to do so after which they get nothing. In essence it's very similar to what EB talks about all the time with regards to cover swaps in latest and that in general it's not a known thing for all players.
So this policy is geared towards players who frequent the forums etc.
KGB
@Bowgentle said: I dunno. Check for ascended Nico, that's 6 covers. Count the levels over 450, divide by 4, see if it hits a threshold for more covers from the second character. I don't think it would be a terribly complicated query, but of course I don't know their data structure.
Probably a bit more complicated than that.
How do they know those extra covers past came from a 2nd Nico at ascension time vs added later via covers/shards/bonus etc. I get you likely can't add hundreds of covers (well some whales might) but it could be enough to get an extra free cover or two (we know with retro feeders announced players loaded up in the interim to get extra stuff).
As a business they may have to account for everything given out (we know they track a LOT of stuff in this game) in every case to every player for legal / business reasons. So a blind query like that might break some way of tracking those digital goods handed out.
The easiest thing for them is just 6 covers for an ascended character because you most definitely had to have 1 370 to ascend.
@Bowgentle said: @Daredevil217 said: @GrimSkald said: @Bowgentle said: @S0kun said: @killahKlown said: So are covers going to rain down on us in two days from our ascended Nico's or should we create CS tickets to ask for these? Please submit a CS ticket. The clock is counting down from the 7 days of when the feeder gets updated and not when the feeder gets implemented. Why are you putting an additional burden on CS with this? Just send retro rewards out, you have the data. They probably don't have any system in place to send out the covers. From what Sokun said, it sounds like their Retroactive reward system actually pulls the rewards chain from the character and "regifts" the covers based on the new chain. Since the 5* version doesn't have a rewards chain that includes those covers, it doesn't work. Since it's a flat rewards, it seems like it would be a simple IF/THEN statement (or equivalent, I have no idea if this terminology is super old-school) to add on to the retro rewards system (IF 5* Nico exists, THEN reward 6 covers,) but they'd have to code it up, and who knows how simple it would be in execution. I'm grateful they're giving us the rewards this time, but I will persist in my opinion - there shouldn't be an inherent disadvantage to Ascending a character, it's extremely counter-intuitive and in general against the the grain of virtually any game. I agree with all of this. I have a 4* Rockett ready to ascend but feel like I shouldn’t ascend him now. It does feel counter-intuitive to hinder progress. The problem with the If/Then system is that you could be missing out on anywhere from 6-12 covers depending on the second character’s level and there’s no way for the computer to account for that. But giving 6 is better than nothing at all. I dunno. Check for ascended Nico, that's 6 covers. Count the levels over 450, divide by 4, see if it hits a threshold for more covers from the second character. I don't think it would be a terribly complicated query, but of course I don't know their data structure.
Sure, this is definitely possible and even reasonable, but I tend to think that getting 6 covers are still "fair" compared to 0, since you theoretically burned that other Nico in creating the 5.
I can't imagine this is a one-time exception. The pressure had probably already started to build for it, and if they deny it for the next character they'll get just as many complaints/threats/review bombs/etc.
Also the fact that they're using CS for this (and only announcing it here, or on discord I guess?) is COMPLETELY INSANE. If they can't do it automatically there should at least be an in game pop-up for it -- how would anybody know it's even an option?
@entrailbucket said: I can't imagine this is a one-time exception. The pressure had probably already started to build for it, and if they deny it for the next character they'll get just as many complaints/threats/review bombs/etc. Also the fact that they're using CS for this (and only announcing it here, or on discord I guess?) is COMPLETELY INSANE. If they can't do it automatically there should at least be an in game pop-up for it -- how would anybody know it's even an option?
@entrailbucket said: I can't imagine this is a one-time exception. The pressure had probably already started to build for it, and if they deny it for the next character they'll get just as many complaints/threats/review bombs/etc.
Thank you. Involving CS is the absolute worst idea.
@S0kun
I assume I can also use the ingame CS and not only the website CS, right?
Also, you guys think it would be possible to release a list for chars you planning on making feeders (not when they become feeders or for who, but just that they are likely to become one)?