Champions 2.0 Post-launch FAQ and Discussion

entrailbucket

@bbigler said:

@entrailbucket said:
That entire list will be murderers, and will likely punch very very far above their level.

Listen, Invisible Woman does 100,000 damage on her green ability, and I don't have her anywhere close to maxed out. She has 5* health and match damage in the modern range.

Absolutely nobody thinks Invisible Woman is any good as a 4*, and she's definitely not on that list you've got, but I am telling you that ascended, at 470 + the boost, she's a viable PvP option for me -- a player with 22 550s who's fighting 550 Thor/etc.

If one of the mediocre 4* turns into a viable 550-killer at lvl470, what will everyone else look like?

Yes, you’re proving my point. Ascending 4-stars now may be better than waiting years to do it later for the extra rewards.

Oh right, sorry! I was agreeing with you/expanding on what you were saying!

Phumade

@bbigler said:
Here’s a hypothetical:
Let’s say Karnak is boosted next week and you have a max champed Karnak plus a dupe at level 283. Let’s say Karnak is ascendable too. Wouldn’t you like to ascend him now and play him?..,just to see if he’s the wrecking ball you think he would be?

Now repeat this hypothetical with:
Polaris
Medusa
Carnage
Juggernaut
Grocket
etc…

Great question.

If I'm a small 5* roster with most 5* at 460 or below, then I immediately ascend Karnak to 450 and play him as part of my 5* toolkit.

If I'm a mid 5* roster with most 5* at 500 or below, with at least 5-10 5* over 475. I personal wait to grow that 283 to 370 and do the max max merge and play him with other 480 chars. but for sure, plenty of awesome chars that might be worth ascending early.

If I'm a big 5* roster with most 5* at 520-480, with at least 5-10 5* over 475, just let the dupe grow naturally. you've probably got better tools at this point and Karnak is purely for the rewards and random event.

None of these outcomes are wrong. There's nothing wrong with an early ascension of a max and min, you just need to really like that playstyle or justify some rationale to give up on the rest of the 4* reward tree.

Zooming out to the 100,000 foot level.

I could believe a case exists, where a player has purposely softcapped and has a full 4* farm. i.e. No 5*, 1 copy of all 4* at 370, 1 copy of 4* at 266-300. Full 3/2/1* farms etc.

Assuming this profile: Sure, you can absolutely make a game play case where you just immediately ascend Max-Min and just play as a 450 roster. But even here, I would say, early ascend your 10 best 4*. and then let the rest grow naturally to harvest the reward tree.

ThaRoadWarrior

I’ve been champ+1 my dupes at 3* and above for the LT, and just doing them as they become available. Yolo

I just haven’t decided how committed I am to rostering a backfill to make sure I can access any hypothetical targeted tier nodes in the future. So far I have maybe one or two of those.

entrailbucket

@Phumade said:

@bbigler said:
Here’s a hypothetical:
Let’s say Karnak is boosted next week and you have a max champed Karnak plus a dupe at level 283. Let’s say Karnak is ascendable too. Wouldn’t you like to ascend him now and play him?..,just to see if he’s the wrecking ball you think he would be?

Now repeat this hypothetical with:
Polaris
Medusa
Carnage
Juggernaut
Grocket
etc…

Great question.

If I'm a small 5* roster with most 5* at 460 or below, then I immediately ascend Karnak to 450 and play him as part of my 5* toolkit.

If I'm a mid 5* roster with most 5* at 500 or below, with at least 5-10 5* over 475. I personal wait to grow that 283 to 370 and do the max max merge and play him with other 480 chars. but for sure, plenty of awesome chars that might be worth ascending early.

If I'm a big 5* roster with most 5* at 520-480, with at least 5-10 5* over 475, just let the dupe grow naturally. you've probably got better tools at this point and Karnak is purely for the rewards and random event.

None of these outcomes are wrong. There's nothing wrong with an early ascension of a max and min, you just need to really like that playstyle or justify some rationale to give up on the rest of the 4* reward tree.

Zooming out to the 100,000 foot level.

I could believe a case exists, where a player has purposely softcapped and has a full 4* farm. i.e. No 5*, 1 copy of all 4* at 370, 1 copy of 4* at 266-300. Full 3/2/1* farms etc.

Assuming this profile: Sure, you can absolutely make a game play case where you just immediately ascend Max-Min and just play as a 450 roster. But even here, I would say, early ascend your 10 best 4*. and then let the rest grow naturally to harvest the reward tree.

I think you're making some big assumptions here, but I'll say this: during the week when Karnak is boosted, you literally cannot have a "better option" than a boosted, 550+ ascended Karnak.

The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

Borstock

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

You're just describing the experience of every non-550 player in PvP up until now, anyway. I really don't see it changing much outside of possibly bringing back some of the diversity we lost when Chasm destroyed PvP. So, the whale will hit me with a ridiculous Karnak and Juggernaut instead of their maxed and boosted 5's. Nothing I can do about it either way.

entrailbucket

@Borstock said:

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

You're just describing the experience of every non-550 player in PvP up until now, anyway. I really don't see it changing much outside of possibly bringing back some of the diversity we lost when Chasm destroyed PvP. So, the whale will hit me with a ridiculous Karnak and Juggernaut instead of their maxed and boosted 5's. Nothing I can do about it either way.

Probably! I was more taking issue with @Phumade (who I think is a 550 player) not recognizing the value of these characters for 550 players.

Like...all these folks are running unboosted 550 Thor in everything. Well, with a few more levels, a boosted IW will one-shot 550 Thor pretty easily.

Borstock

@entrailbucket said:

@Borstock said:

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

Probably! I was more taking issue with @Phumade (who I think is a 550 player) not recognizing the value of these characters for 550 players.

Like...all these folks are running unboosted 550 Thor in everything. Well, with a few more levels, a boosted IW will one-shot 550 Thor pretty easily.

Fair enough. Though there already are 550's who do that.

WhiteBomber

I remember when Invis Woman was the best character in the game (he says in really old man shaky voice). Hopefully those turds continue to shine in champions 2.0. Moooore variety, yes! I'll see you all there in 3 years.

Phumade

@entrailbucket said:

@Borstock said:

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

You're just describing the experience of every non-550 player in PvP up until now, anyway. I really don't see it changing much outside of possibly bringing back some of the diversity we lost when Chasm destroyed PvP. So, the whale will hit me with a ridiculous Karnak and Juggernaut instead of their maxed and boosted 5's. Nothing I can do about it either way.

Probably! I was more taking issue with @Phumade (who I think is a 550 player) not recognizing the value of these characters for 550 players.

Like...all these folks are running unboosted 550 Thor in everything. Well, with a few more levels, a boosted IW will one-shot 550 Thor pretty easily.

Oh I'm a 500 player. 12 between 530-500, and about 30 between 500 - 480. I pretty much have to play the 600 boosted each week.

The only issues for me is that I personally don't play more than 20 chars very well. I feel like you need to be using chars on a semi regular basis to be fast efficient etc. For me that s really about 20-30 chars or 5-10 different meta themes. After 50 chars, I just stick to the biggest combs that I know how to play effectively.

entrailbucket

@Phumade said:

@entrailbucket said:

@Borstock said:

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

You're just describing the experience of every non-550 player in PvP up until now, anyway. I really don't see it changing much outside of possibly bringing back some of the diversity we lost when Chasm destroyed PvP. So, the whale will hit me with a ridiculous Karnak and Juggernaut instead of their maxed and boosted 5's. Nothing I can do about it either way.

Probably! I was more taking issue with @Phumade (who I think is a 550 player) not recognizing the value of these characters for 550 players.

Like...all these folks are running unboosted 550 Thor in everything. Well, with a few more levels, a boosted IW will one-shot 550 Thor pretty easily.

Oh I'm a 500 player. 12 between 530-500, and about 30 between 500 - 480. I pretty much have to play the 600 boosted each week.

The only issues for me is that I personally don't play more than 20 chars very well. I feel like you need to be using chars on a semi regular basis to be fast efficient etc. For me that s really about 20-30 chars or 5-10 different meta themes. After 50 chars, I just stick to the biggest combs that I know how to play effectively.

You're missing out!

Seriously! Most characters really don't require any sort of special skill or play patterns to use. I throw random pairings out there all the time and do just fine. Sometimes I forget what somebody does, but using them is a good refresher course.

Daredevil217

@bbigler said:
Here’s a hypothetical:
Let’s say Karnak is boosted next week and you have a max champed Karnak plus a dupe at level 283. Let’s say Karnak is ascendable too. Wouldn’t you like to ascend him now and play him?..,just to see if he’s the wrecking ball you think he would be?

Now repeat this hypothetical with:
Polaris
Medusa
Carnage
Juggernaut
Grocket
etc…

I went hard in the LL store (and am now a 550 player… sigh). But this was a big big reason. I opened like 3 or 4 thousand mighty tokens to max my dupe Medusa (Medupsa?) and ascend her. But aside from this being the best possible trio of latests for me to chase and max champ, I really wanted targeted pulls on a small pool of meta 4s like Polaris, Grocket, Juggs, Chavez, Deathlok, and Karnak (who was my sole bonus 4* on the road to 550s). I’m trying to have my cake and eat it too with the max-max. Polaris and Grocket are ready. Juggs is 2 covers away. Chavez needs 12. Karnak needs 30 still. Deathlok needs over 100. If Karnak gets his day tomorrow I’m going to use all my stockpiled milestone rewards (lord knows how many I have since you can’t see past the current).

Altair22

Basically its now an arms race with Champions 2.0 hey I say bring it on

Altair22

@entrailbucket said:

@Phumade said:

@entrailbucket said:

@Borstock said:

@entrailbucket said:
The metagame is boosted characters now. Chasm is gone. If you don't have a 600+ character every single week, you're going to get stomped by somebody who does.

You're just describing the experience of every non-550 player in PvP up until now, anyway. I really don't see it changing much outside of possibly bringing back some of the diversity we lost when Chasm destroyed PvP. So, the whale will hit me with a ridiculous Karnak and Juggernaut instead of their maxed and boosted 5's. Nothing I can do about it either way.

Probably! I was more taking issue with @Phumade (who I think is a 550 player) not recognizing the value of these characters for 550 players.

Like...all these folks are running unboosted 550 Thor in everything. Well, with a few more levels, a boosted IW will one-shot 550 Thor pretty easily.

Oh I'm a 500 player. 12 between 530-500, and about 30 between 500 - 480. I pretty much have to play the 600 boosted each week.

The only issues for me is that I personally don't play more than 20 chars very well. I feel like you need to be using chars on a semi regular basis to be fast efficient etc. For me that s really about 20-30 chars or 5-10 different meta themes. After 50 chars, I just stick to the biggest combs that I know how to play effectively.

You're missing out!

Seriously! Most characters really don't require any sort of special skill or play patterns to use. I throw random pairings out there all the time and do just fine. Sometimes I forget what somebody does, but using them is a good refresher course.

Yah in the latest doop PVP I fought with a newbie with a starter roster of mostly 1s 2s some threes a few 4s, using Ascended base 1 t0 5 level boosted spiderman and IM (at 450 lvl). yah vs. Boosted 5 stars Shang chi, Old man logan had a semi hard time besting the ascended boosted spiderman 1 base.

entrailbucket

I checked my Karnak for fun -- he's level 451. His black match damage is 1010 and he gets a 560% bonus after the first 4 turns. I think the boost basically doubles match damage, so a boosted baby champ 5* Karnak will do 30k on a black match-3.

bbigler

I believe Champions 2.0 is paving the way to SCL 11 and a 6th tier. After a year or two when most players have level 500+ heroes and are getting tons of Legendary tokens, they’ll change the release cadence to include 6-Star characters.

But I have no idea how they would change the release cadence.

EDIT: maybe
3 - 4 - 5 - 6?
4 - 3/5 - 6?
5 - 5 - 6?
3 - 5 - 6?

ThaRoadWarrior

Personally, I always thought the 4* tier needed to freeze, at which point you’d be at 5-5-6 or 5-6-Support

BriMan2222

@Daredevil217 said:

@bbigler said:
Here’s a hypothetical:
Let’s say Karnak is boosted next week and you have a max champed Karnak plus a dupe at level 283. Let’s say Karnak is ascendable too. Wouldn’t you like to ascend him now and play him?..,just to see if he’s the wrecking ball you think he would be?

Now repeat this hypothetical with:
Polaris
Medusa
Carnage
Juggernaut
Grocket
etc…

I went hard in the LL store (and am now a 550 player… sigh). But this was a big big reason. I opened like 3 or 4 thousand mighty tokens to max my dupe Medusa (Medupsa?) and ascend her. But aside from this being the best possible trio of latests for me to chase and max champ, I really wanted targeted pulls on a small pool of meta 4s like Polaris, Grocket, Juggs, Chavez, Deathlok, and Karnak (who was my sole bonus 4* on the road to 550s). I’m trying to have my cake and eat it too with the max-max. Polaris and Grocket are ready. Juggs is 2 covers away. Chavez needs 12. Karnak needs 30 still. Deathlok needs over 100. If Karnak gets his day tomorrow I’m going to use all my stockpiled milestone rewards (lord knows how many I have since you can’t see past the current).

Welcome to the 550 club! One of us, One of us Gooble Gobble, Gooble Gobble.....

Colognoisseur

I didn’t read through the whole thread. Have they announced when the second batch of characters we will be able to ascend will arrive?

Bowgentle

Nope.
Also no ETA on when the ISO rewards will turn into the real ones.

BlixTheFrog

So this is strange : I have a dupe Hulkling, not championed yet. While pulling, I got an extra cover that I saved... and I was surprised to see I had another one available. Turns out, the game offers me to use that 2 stars ascended Iron Man we all got the other day as a Hulkling cover... Pretty weird.