Upcoming Bonus Character Release (8/5/22)

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Comments

  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited August 2022
    Yeah they said they were going to do something to help players with the increased roster slot pressure, adjust things.
    What they DO though, is start the extra releases a month early, with no adjustments.
    So there's a pretty big gap between what they said and what they are doing, and spinning this as something positive.

    Look, if this is the only way we're ever going to catch up on feeders for the old 5s because they're too stingy to make retroactive feeders, fine, just say so.
    But don't spin this into something positive.
  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,236 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited August 2022
    Bowgentle said:

    Look, if this is the only way we're ever going to catch up on feeders for the old 5s because they're too stingy to make retroactive feeders, fine, just say so.
    But don't spin this into something positive.
    Lets see who the character is and how many covers they are handing out.

    But clearly this is the way to catch up on feeders. Retro feeders was always a no-go after Shardmas. The players reaction then meant there was never ever going to be retro feeders again and after 4 years the message has been delivered loud and clear.

    On the other hand, how many characters are we talking about that need feeding. 10 or 12? If they do 1 extra a month we are caught up in a years time. 24K extra hero points over a years time (assuming you need 2K per slot) isn't crazy hard to do and not an unreasonable expectation.

    This is definitely a big positive for those of us who have wanted a feeder for every 5* character. It's a minor downside to have to roster a few extra characters.

    KGB
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited August 2022
    @Bowgentle They did mention in this forum that they wanted to avoid shardmas in one of the FAQ threads. So, they've made their stand known publicly but I think you missed out that message. 

    Feeders are something we're looking at. We're trying to figure out a more organic way of doing that without creating Shardmas 2.0 though.
    https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/comment/980994/#Comment_980994


    On the other hand, they also said recently that eventually all 5* will have feeders. 

    If you read in between the line, then, maybe, such is the tradeoff for having all 5* fed. 


  • Bowgentle
    Bowgentle Posts: 7,926 Chairperson of the Boards
    KGB said:
    Bowgentle said:

    Look, if this is the only way we're ever going to catch up on feeders for the old 5s because they're too stingy to make retroactive feeders, fine, just say so.
    But don't spin this into something positive.
    Lets see who the character is and how many covers they are handing out.

    But clearly this is the way to catch up on feeders. Retro feeders was always a no-go after Shardmas. The players reaction then meant there was never ever going to be retro feeders again and after 4 years the message has been delivered loud and clear.

    On the other hand, how many characters are we talking about that need feeding. 10 or 12? If they do 1 extra a month we are caught up in a years time. 24K extra hero points over a years time (assuming you need 2K per slot) isn't crazy hard to do and not an unreasonable expectation.

    This is definitely a big positive for those of us who have wanted a feeder for every 5* character. It's a minor downside to have to roster a few extra characters.

    KGB
    Yeah then just say that it's to catch up on feeders.
    Don't say it's a bonus.
    Also, those 12 are on top of the new 3s that start next month, with no changes in rewards so far.
  • Yepyep
    Yepyep Posts: 954 Critical Contributor
    edited August 2022
    BriMan2222 said:
    Yepyep said:
    KGB said:
    <snip>

    I imagine these extra characters are the way they are going to catch up on feeders. If that's the case, then for all those complaining, Shardmas is what's caused this to have to happen since they don't want another retro reward debacle.

    <snip>

    KGB

    How was it a debacle? I thought it was great...
    It was great only after they gave us full rewards. They didn't intend to.  They only gave like 1/3 of the rewards at first. 

    It was only after huge back lash of players bombarding them with negative comments on the forum and face book and review bombing the game in the app store and stopping any spending they did on the game that they gave us full retro rewards.

    They've never updated feeders since then.  So players have inferredfrom this that don't want to give us full rewards for retro feeders but also know the fans will riot if they update feeders and don't give 100 percent of the retro rewards.
    Wow, @KGB and @BriMan2222 I'm not at all trying to challenge you. But I have no memories of any of this controversy over Shard+(Christ)mas, i.e. the raining down of gifts of shards that one day. It was all 100% seamless for me and right on the day it dropped.

    I wonder if it (the debacle) might not have been just platform hiccups and players terrified of being left behind -- whether justified or not. And yo! I'm no apologist for the devs on this forum... But seriously, it was a good thing and things have been mostly good since then. It was a welcome recalibration of power (maybe less so for the 550 club, because there's nowhere to go north of GOD).

    Is there a concise history of this debacle memorialized anywhere, please?
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    You must be on a holiday trip and happened to come back at the right time.  :D I also remembered some dev said some wrong words in discird and kind of got witchhunted. I think it goes something like, " Why are players complaining about free stuffs?" 
  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    Anyway, those were other times, and even other devs. 
    I think it's objectively unfair to have negative reactions like these without at the very least see where are going the new devs, who in my opinion they seem to know a lot about everything.
    But I understand each one is entitled to their own opinion and usually the norm is to complain first and to see what happens later.
  • Tony_Foot
    Tony_Foot Posts: 1,812 Chairperson of the Boards
    I just don’t understand why they can’t make them all feeders right away and gift shards like before but only for the lowest version you have rostered. So if you have 6 champed carols and the dupe of level 300 reward shards for the lower one. 

    Surely we would all prefer that to what we are getting. I don’t expect a repeat of shardmas. 
  • Beast1970
    Beast1970 Posts: 421 Mover and Shaker
    KGB said:
    Lets see who the character is and how many covers they are handing out.


    KGB
    "8/18 - Release and free cover of 4-Star Bonus character"

    I take that to read one free cover.  Singular cover, not plural covers.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    Players are greedy. The moment the dev makes all 5* have feeders, the players will shift goalposts and request second feeders for all 5*. 
  • Timemachinego
    Timemachinego Posts: 492 Mover and Shaker
    edited August 2022
    Gymp28 said:
    I’m only in baby champ land for 5*s (And even then have only 4 chars champed). I have a relatively small ~13K HP in the bank and yet it still seems unreasonable to me to complain about a ‘bonus’ character release. 
    Everything is still in ‘turmoil’ following the new devs taking over. We havn’t even seen any of the changes they’ve repeatedly said will be coming in September. 
    Doubtless there’ll be myriad complaints about those too…

    At the end of the day the devs aren’t here to make our lives in the game an easier ride, they’re here to keep us hooked on playing but encourage us to splash the cash!
    I genuinely think the new devs have love for the health of the game too though, so any QoL improvements we see will be welcomed, at least by me.

    Naive but nice of you. Our new dev team were supposedly players first so they should realize that they're speeding up HP pressure with their fun "bonus" release here, also potentially upsetting normal cover-gain in PVE unless this character is some kind of "limited" situation and then it's an even bigger waste of time. Given the aggressive store offers lately they want to make some money and aren't, so now they're doing this without actually fixing anything in this game, just adding more. I like their character design so far but they're already giving me big reasons not to trust them at all, they can talk to us all they want but I'm not going to confuse glad-handing for actual positive change until I see it.

    As a pure idea, an increased release schedule means more fun for us but it WRECKS the economic structure of this game unless there is also a change to reward-structure that allows for it. In the long run that character tier bloat and hp and iso-deficit makes it even harder for a new player to ever even possibly think about 5* characters. The 4* tier is so wide at this point that I don't expect any newer players will EVER reach real 5* play, at best they'll have a couple good 5s and a couple good 4s and just become cannon fodder for anyone with a rounder roster as it stands.
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,454 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited August 2022
    Yepyep said:
    BriMan2222 said:
    Yepyep said:
    KGB said:
    <snip>

    I imagine these extra characters are the way they are going to catch up on feeders. If that's the case, then for all those complaining, Shardmas is what's caused this to have to happen since they don't want another retro reward debacle.

    <snip>

    KGB

    How was it a debacle? I thought it was great...
    It was great only after they gave us full rewards. They didn't intend to.  They only gave like 1/3 of the rewards at first. 

    It was only after huge back lash of players bombarding them with negative comments on the forum and face book and review bombing the game in the app store and stopping any spending they did on the game that they gave us full retro rewards.

    They've never updated feeders since then.  So players have inferredfrom this that don't want to give us full rewards for retro feeders but also know the fans will riot if they update feeders and don't give 100 percent of the retro rewards.
    Wow, @KGB and @BriMan2222 I'm not at all trying to challenge you. But I have no memories of any of this controversy over Shard+(Christ)mas, i.e. the raining down of gifts of shards that one day. It was all 100% seamless for me and right on the day it dropped.

    I wonder if it (the debacle) might not have been just platform hiccups and players terrified of being left behind -- whether justified or not. And yo! I'm no apologist for the devs on this forum... But seriously, it was a good thing and things have been mostly good since then. It was a welcome recalibration of power (maybe less so for the 550 club, because there's nowhere to go north of GOD).

    Is there a concise history of this debacle memorialized anywhere, please?
    The shardmas “debacle” came about when shards were worked into champ rewards all over, and rather than keep with the tradition that had long been in place of giving players all the updated rewards 1:1, for some reason it was decided that if your character who was already a feeder was past level 280 you would only get a flat 100 shards regardless of how many historical covers you would have earned under the old retroactive reward system. I believe newly minted feeders gave out 1:1.

    https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/80703/r192-champion-rewards-updates

    when people talk about “Shardmas 2.0” they are referring to the “fix” when all the shards people expected they would have gotten were paid out after the aforementioned review bombing, complaints everywhere, presumably actual spend stops, etc, and that was the last time a character was retroactively made into a feeder. Since then we have seen sporadic and arbitrary characters launching as feeders to older 5s which I think is fine and frankly should have been the way it was done always (minus the arbitrary part - it feels way better to be able to predict based on lore which character will feed another). 
  • jsmjsmjsm00
    jsmjsmjsm00 Posts: 268 Mover and Shaker
    HoundofShadow said:
    Players are greedy. The moment the dev makes all 5* have feeders, the players will shift goalposts and request second feeders for all 5*. 
    I've already seen some suggesting this. 
  • Godzillafan67
    Godzillafan67 Posts: 597 Critical Contributor
    jsmjsmjsm00 said:
    HoundofShadow said:
    Players are greedy. The moment the dev makes all 5* have feeders, the players will shift goalposts and request second feeders for all 5*. 
    I've already seen some suggesting this. 
    At least me, though the context was that I was offering a suggestion for IF the devs want to catch up the 5* feeder system. Another benefit is that it’s a way to address classic 5* cover scarcity without creating new content.
  • CharlieLima
    CharlieLima Posts: 112 Tile Toppler
    HoundofShadow said:
    Players are greedy.
    “Some very vocal players are greedy”. FTFY.
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,454 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited August 2022
    I would say that increasing the release pace to one character a week without boosting the economy would wipe out a ton of those goodwill moments, yes. I’m not asking for anyone to get fired, or burned at the stake, or anything else so over the top, just calling this gift what it is, which is a bit of a white elephant. (If you are unfamiliar with the idiom, a White Elephant is a gift that seems extravagant on its face but places a burden on the receiver to own. Imagine I literally gave you a white elephant, and now you need to figure out how to house it, feed it, etc)
  • Timemachinego
    Timemachinego Posts: 492 Mover and Shaker
    HoundofShadow said:
    BCS took over on June 6. I looked back at what they've done and these are what they have accomplished in two months:

    What the dev has achieved
    1) New boss events: Gargantos and Gorr
    2) Reintroduced monthly developer Q&A
    3) Kamala Community Challenge that gave 500HP, one 3* Kamala cover and 250 5* Kamala shards
    4) Reduced number of wins from 75 to 50 in pvps and in shield sim.
    5) Made character locked in Support playable as a character: Hulkling
    6) Increased Odin's Introducing... Shards from 15 to 75
    7) gave two covers + 75 latest 5* shards in boss events: gargantos and kk - 2 covers, Dr Thor 2 covers + 75 shards (number of pulls needed are reduced significantly) 
    8) better contents for special celebratory vaults (2 LTs in a single vault etc).
    9) give tokens for using special characters 
    10) brought back heroics
    11) quick response to feedbacks (first heroic boss event)
    12) solved errors quickly (wrong pve/pvp time slice, Chasm's ability etc)
    13) gave every players two costumes (X-23 and 4* Cyclops) for free just by logging in.
    14) exciting 4* and 5* characters; no DoA or bottom tier characters as of now.
    15) consistent feeders: every 4* will be a feeder.
    16) Great cash bundles (Commanding Presence)
    17) more communication from dev. They are replying to players in forums, reddits and discords.
    18) gave decent loaners to players in boss events, including essential nodes.
    19) consistent and predictable character rotation (align with season)
    20) first character update: 3* She-Hulk
    21) More consistent event updates in forum.

    And here are the negative events that have happened: 
    1) First Heroic restricted to DA
    2) planned 3*/5* and 4* release per month, beginning in September
    3) one additional release in August

    Note: all the above might not be complete and I might have forgotten other events.

    It just proves that it doesn't matter how many good things the dev has done for the players. As long as there's one negative events, all the goods they have done are erased and taken for granted. I feel like history is repeating again.

    So we all know you're the biggest dev fan (apparently whoever it is) on the forum, that's really well established and honestly good for you for being so diehard committed. The majority of your "good notes" are what any mature, earning game populace SHOULD expect from their dev team. Yes, it's an improvement, but being improved to the state to any other healthy game is not a triumph of achievement, it should be the regular state. I'll address what are actual differences as I see:

    1: They made boss events relevant to 5* players, I think this is fricking cool and love them for that.
    2: Again, Q&A is really cool. I do hope they take some feedback through that.
    4: Another solid move!
    12: Immense respect to that, they mucked some things up but they fixed them fast too.
    13: Yeah, that was nice.
    14: This is why I'm still trying to have some faith! great char design.
    15: We asked and we got, shame it was so hard fought.
    21: Not quite, but they're trying. Currently on par with late-stage Demiurge but also full of errors.

    This is a mostly good track record, but almost none of it worked from the start. I am applying my words (and eventually wallet) to draw attention to fundamental parts of the game that need to adjust if BC wants to change the release cycle. That's all. I like them so far and hope they're great for the game.

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