SCL10 Mission Changes

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  • BagPussBagPuss Posts: 46 Just Dropped In
    Well done D3....
    Alliance planning just became a **** shoot.

    cl10 players have a 20k+ lead over cl9 players.

    You can stumble along in cl10 and push out regular cl9 players from alliances for a 10 minutes saving .. from the open when it's not really that difficult anyway.
  • bluewolfbluewolf Posts: 4,910 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 3 August 2020, 13:20
    I played in SCL9 for FFW.  Went to 10 for SS.  FFW was so fast....my highest two toons are a (now) 482 Prof and 481 Okoye.  SS felt a lot faster than 10 did before, but it was still a much longer time playing vs my clears in 9.

    People saying it's 10 minutes in 10.... I dunno.  It felt like more than 10 minutes but generally I am very lazy with my opening clears because all the nodes feel like a drag with my still low-end roster.  For me it felt more like 20 minutes at least.

    It's true that the CN is the biggest drag/hardest thing, but I generally think I sort of enjoy it most out of the rest of the nodes.  It's engaging (frustrating sometimes? yes) whereas the rest of the nodes mostly feel like padding out health pools where mostly you get the exact same outcome (little chance of losing once you have a good set of 5s to run) but it takes more time and occasionally a health pack or two.  It's still mostly autopilot/play that takes longer.  I still feel like the other nodes could be bumped down a little in difficulty/health pool grind.

    10 is faster but I honestly can't see many people who are avoiding it moving up right now.  You still have the same end levels and whatever the time difference is, you are maybe moving from 2-3x more time over 9 to 1.75-2x more time (Your Mileage May Vary) so I can't imagine many players deciding the change is worth it.

    If we do get down to 2x grind then more people might make a different decision.  Even then I doubt that a huge number of people will routinely decide that playing PVE longer will be worth the difference in rewards, but I guess we will see.

    ---

    Oh, whatever happens with the grind (3x or 2x), PLEASE fix the darn points to make 9 and 10 approx equal.  This is  just plain ludicrous.
  • abennessabenness Posts: 190 Tile Toppler
    I’ve been mainly playing cl10 with my junior roster, just to get the shards to try to keep up with 5* releases. Sometimes I feel a sense of accomplishment when I get through my grind, sometimes I can’t even motivate myself for pvp afterwards, it’s so brutal, with cheap wipes causing me to despair. Dropping to cl9 is much easier, but I couldn’t believe when I saw how much score difference there was.

    I definitely support cl10 being pitched a bit quicker, but that needs to come in the grind more than in the clears (either a 2-grind, or 1 clear of CN).

    I also support there being marginally more points in cl10, just to compensate for the longer time spent there. But only in the order of eg 200 points per day. Seeing an 8,000 point gap between 9 and 10 is quite ridiculous and honestly unfair.

    I am confident that this is being worked on, so I hope it can be resolved quickly, and/or we can get some communication as to what will be done about it.
  • HoundofShadowHoundofShadow Posts: 3,272 Chairperson of the Boards
    Loss of thrill is something that's stopping me from going to SCL 10. There's a different kind of feeling between playing competitively (top 10 placement) and playing for full progression. Timing plays a part too. I'm done with PvEs in 20-25mins and SCL 10, I can't remember how long, took me many times. Again, I'm a 4* player. Once I jump into 5* land, I'll be able to gauge better whether the tradeoff is worth it. But I think I love the thrill/adrenaline too much to give them up.
  • DeNappaDeNappa Posts: 1,083 Chairperson of the Boards
    Vhailorx said:
    No one can say for sure why so many players are avoiding cl10.  The most common complaints here on the forum are (i) difficulty, and (ii) time.  I have no problem with demi experimenting to figure out which of those two (or if some dark horse third option) is really the major obstacle.  I just hate to see them fiddle with the rewards levels at the same time (demi, if you want really clean data, don't tweak multiple variables at the same time!).
    As for cl9 v cl10 rewards, I have been almost exclusively cl10 since it went live. Just about the only thing that interests me in the game anymore is new 5*s, since I have something like 80x 4* champs and new 4*s barely make a dent in my game experience for more than a week.  and I do not have a real life schedule that permits me to grind optimally every day; i just can't commit 60-120 minutes to gaming at the same time every day.
    So for someone like me, I can't see how cl9 would ever be worth my time (even if it takes much less of my time) for any event featuring latest 5*s.  I do sometimes miss out on top 50 HP rewards because of cl10, and that sucks.  But I get an extra 200 5* shards every event, and slightly more cp than I would from playing cl9.  Maybe if I could grind top 10 or better in cl9 regularly, the extra cp and LTs would help make up the difference, but as stated above, my real life schedule cannot support that kind of regular grinding. 

    I can understand that for less deep rosters difficulty could be a problem. For me, it's really the time part. And not because I can't always make the time required to play (if I wanted to, I probably could), but more because the intense time investment required burns you out having to burn through 400K enemy health for the umpteenth time will then make you go 'meh'.

    As I mentioned in this thread earlier, as a progression only player this does help a bit, so I'm not complaining. But it still could be better ;).

    And I totally agree with your assessment of scl9 vs scl10 rewards. To keep making any relevant progress that far into the game, scl9 doesn't cut it in the end, especially if you've grown used to scl10.
  • unlucky13unlucky13 Posts: 1 Just Dropped In
    Final update:

    sub 4:  35 min grind with all those yellows.   Ended in an terrible 15th place due to My miss on sub 3. Damn that C node. 

    Final assessment:
    As a person that has a larger roster and one that runs a T10 ally, I am speaking for myself and many of my ally mates or other friends in the game that do not come to the forums since they think their voice isn’t heard (which I told them they need to come here for this).  
    While I like the idea of 1 less clear, and if time and making SL10 more attractive is the goal, this is not the full picture I would propose. 
    If you want to get more people to play SL10, then the C node needs to be addressed.   This could be done in 1 simple way.   Make it a full 650 enemy node but make this as an untimed 1 clear unlocked node (thing of the Introducing...events).  That way there is only points on 1 clear, people do not have to hit this node 6 times to be optimal, would leave this node open for people to try different teams on it (cause I like the idea of the C node), but will get more people to move up since the C node IS BY FAR the biggest draw back to 10 from the players and ally mates I talk to.   This would better address 10 than anything else I can think of besides a 3/2 but that might have to rebuild the entire code to do that.   This would be an easier fix and don’t have to mess with the code as much.  

    I'm one of the 'other friends' mentioned.  I've been on a t10 team for nearly 5 years now and do most of the swapping/merc'ing for my alliance family.  I helped organize the THISTESTSUX alliances during the testing for the current play structure.  Of all the missteps about the game, this new play/point structure of CL10 finally drove me to the forums to voice my opinion.

    I went to CL10 due to the point changes in FFW.  My roster has a few level 47x 5* and nearly all 5* are champ.  I normally play cl9 and spend 40-60 minutes in most pve events and a little over an hour in pvp.  In the 2nd to last sub, I spent over 20 health packs spent over an hour on the grind.  I was unable to get the 3rd clear on the challenge node.  This is reminiscent of the days when the 7 rewards weren't guaranteed and we'd hit 1 point nodes to try to get rewards.  It was a horrible waste of time and killed my desire to play at all.  This is the first time I've felt this upset towards MPQ.

    I agree that the best ideas are to do a 3 clear/2 grind for full points in CL10 and have the challenge node have points for only the first hit and have a few other optional rewards for the crazy people that love the challenge.  Doing this would make CL10 bearable for the people transitioning up from CL9.
  • VhailorxVhailorx Posts: 5,060 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 3 August 2020, 17:51
    I think a two-clear challenge node is the way to go, if we are going to customize the node points.  Put the cp on the first clear, and set it around level 600. Clearing the node once is enough for max prog.  Then put a second clear at 650 that only matters for those seeking placement.  No points after the second clear, but leave the node unlocked so people can experiment.
  • MrPlowMrPlow Posts: 136 Tile Toppler
    The wave node is still 2 initial clears and then if nothing's changed 3 grind clears.  If wave nodes are 2/3 I don't see what makes it difficult to implement 3/2 for regular nodes if it's true that's what they're trying to do.
  • BadBad Posts: 382 Mover and Shaker
    edited 3 August 2020, 18:02
    Truth is I ranked among 50 and that was thanks to those difficult challenges. I dont have the luxury of stopping all and go grinding.
    I think on classification it could worth a bit more the player effort, tactical play and roster management, and not a race against the clock among okoye users.
    Still is hard to find a good solution given the sistem is at how it is.
    Maybe if scl9 and 10 return to the same total points but challenge node gaining more cps, that could satisfy all parties.

  • grunth13grunth13 Posts: 589 Critical Contributor
    Loss of thrill is something that's stopping me from going to SCL 10. There's a different kind of feeling between playing competitively (top 10 placement) and playing for full progression. Timing plays a part too. I'm done with PvEs in 20-25mins and SCL 10, I can't remember how long, took me many times. Again, I'm a 4* player. Once I jump into 5* land, I'll be able to gauge better whether the tradeoff is worth it. But I think I love the thrill/adrenaline too much to give them up.

    Can you tell me what your roster looks like?  You say you are a 4 star roster...how high is your highest 4 star?  How many?  What range? 
  • bluewolfbluewolf Posts: 4,910 Chairperson of the Boards
    MrPlow said:
    The wave node is still 2 initial clears and then if nothing's changed 3 grind clears.  If wave nodes are 2/3 I don't see what makes it difficult to implement 3/2 for regular nodes if it's true that's what they're trying to do.
    The game has always had the ability (apparently) to have different nodes require different numbers of clears and have the timer start to refresh points.

    Loaner/join forces?  1 clear
    Waves?  2 clears
    Normal nodes? 4 (now 3 in SCL10) clears

    The question is how hard it is to make the point deduction at clear different.  That also would require the point refresh rate to be different.

    With a 3x close, each clear drops available points 33% (first two times, 3rd time it's at 0), and over 24 hours a node regains 33% of its total points.  

    With a 2x close, each clear would need to drop the points available 50% and the node would need to regain 50% of it's total value over 24 hours.

    So that's the thing we from the outside don't know - how easy or hard it is to make the SCL you chose cause the node point drop/refresh rate to be different from every other node that exists in the game (that can be replayed and has points that drop and refresh).
  • Michael1957Michael1957 Posts: 309 Mover and Shaker
    After my first event I can see very few players are up here . If I can finish top 100 in possibly 1 of 7 or 8 slices , without major effort or roster , I estimate less than 750 players are grinding out in 10. I think the rewards in terms of covers are much better as my focus is 5* covers not HP
  • ChameleonChameleon Posts: 151 Tile Toppler
    Final update:

    sub 4:  35 min grind with all those yellows.   Ended in an terrible 15th place due to My miss on sub 3. Damn that C node. 

    Final assessment:
    As a person that has a larger roster and one that runs a T10 ally, I am speaking for myself and many of my ally mates or other friends in the game that do not come to the forums since they think their voice isn’t heard (which I told them they need to come here for this).  
    While I like the idea of 1 less clear, and if time and making SL10 more attractive is the goal, this is not the full picture I would propose. 
    If you want to get more people to play SL10, then the C node needs to be addressed.   This could be done in 1 simple way.   Make it a full 650 enemy node but make this as an untimed 1 clear unlocked node (thing of the Introducing...events).  That way there is only points on 1 clear, people do not have to hit this node 6 times to be optimal, would leave this node open for people to try different teams on it (cause I like the idea of the C node), but will get more people to move up since the C node IS BY FAR the biggest draw back to 10 from the players and ally mates I talk to.   This would better address 10 than anything else I can think of besides a 3/2 but that might have to rebuild the entire code to do that.   This would be an easier fix and don’t have to mess with the code as much.  
    Agreed
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