*** Spider-Man (Classic) ***

Unknown

My guess is regardless 3/5/5 will be the go to build. They have done away with ap dripping at higher levels (part of why I am scared for magneto) and so I expect yellow to be a constant @12-14. The only thing I can see higher levels.doing with a complete character rework is increasing healing with each level.

I suspect the benefit of blue and purple will outweigh some extra healing. Purple will likely be mildly nerfed or indirectly nerfed via blue being nerfed. For blue, I suspect to see a 6 ap stun that stuns all and builds more web tiles or placeable webtiles at higher levels. Maybe something like:

Lvl 1: 6 ap. Stuns team for 1 turn, makes 1 web tile.
Lvl 2: 6 ap. Stuns selected character for 2 turns, team for 1 turn.
Lvl 3: 6 ap. Stuns team for 2 turns.
Lvl 4: 6 ap. Stuns team for 2 turns. Creates 2 web tiles.
Lvl 5: 6 ap. Web tiles can overwrite enemy tiles.

That change gives him the same ap to stun ratio as he was before for the first 3 uses of his stun while increasing how long it takes him to drop it and also nerfs his yellow and purple by dropping far fewer web tiles overall. I expect a change similar to that.

I would suggest still going 5 into blue and either 4/4 for yellow/purple or 3/5 yellow/purple..basically the same as it is now.

hurcules

reckless442 wrote:

I don't understand the need to nerf Spidey at all. Yes, stunlock is effective, but it is not a guarantee to victory. On a bad board layout, he becomes useless. Moreover, the complaint seems to be that he skews PVP due to the easy stunlock. But he slows the game down significantly, which can be very costly in a PVP like NHB Elite. In the time it takes to play a couple of Spidey matches that depend on stunlock, you're likely to lose more points that you'll win.

++.

Unknown

Lyrian wrote:

-- Post change, if you want any meaningful healing from Spidey, be prepared to be required to 5 Yellow him.

I think most of your predictions probably save the need for a developer announcement. The healing in its current state is pretty silly, potentially healing more HP than any unbuffed character has, and not remotely worth leveling, so it'd certainly make sense for specialization to be required if what you really want is a healer more than a stunner. I wouldn't be surprised if the base amount also scales. The one reservation with that is that I also wouldn't be that surprised if whatever they do takes care to ensure 3/5/5 is still very good, if not straight-up preferred. It takes anything up to months to build a Spider-Man and we still have no idea when respec will go in, so gimping the build everyone already has would invite many a ragequit, more so than the 2* dynamic duo. If they implement respec before or alongside batting Spidey, that concern would evaporate.

Unknown

Tick tock, devs! Five hours left on my yellow spidey!

Rescue us from the agony of uncertainty!

IceIX

You're not going to be seeing a change in Spidey in the next couple hours. Likely not until R48, if not later. He's on the list, yes. But we're not whacking away at that list at the moment.

Unknown

Veracity wrote:

Lyrian wrote:

-- Post change, if you want any meaningful healing from Spidey, be prepared to be required to 5 Yellow him.

I think most of your predictions probably save the need for a developer announcement. The healing in its current state is pretty silly, potentially healing more HP than any unbuffed character has, and not remotely worth leveling, so it'd certainly make sense for specialization to be required if what you really want is a healer more than a stunner. I wouldn't be surprised if the base amount also scales. The one reservation with that is that I also wouldn't be that surprised if whatever they do takes care to ensure 3/5/5 is still very good, if not straight-up preferred. It takes anything up to months to build a Spider-Man and we still have no idea when respec will go in, so gimping the build everyone already has would invite many a ragequit, more so than the 2* dynamic duo. If they implement respec before or alongside batting Spidey, that concern would evaporate.

Great thoughts, Veracity.

I agree with you that the devs will have to introduce respec'ing, either before or at the same time as the Spidey change. Otherwise, the pressure cooker is going to explode, as everyone that has any mid/low-high tier (3*** transition phase) has some form of Spidey already built.

That being said, Spidey can't do everything as well as he does now. There is no upgrade potential to 4****, let alone his current overall dominance in the game, unless something changes with him. The dev's specialization system would seem to address this matter nicely, but in the end it is all up to the devs to tune.

Can Spidey Blue still be potent post-change? Sure, I think it will, but not at the level of power 5 Blue holds now. Further, I think there will be a reasonably steep cost to spec'ing in 5 blue.

The same can be said for yellow. His healing has to be drawn back to manageable levels, and if players want a shard of his pre-healing power to remain, 5 yellow will be mandatory.

Spidey is known for his versatility. That is part of his gimmick, which I believe the devs will leverage.

What do you want your Spidey to be post-patch?

Do you want him to be an upgrade to OBW's Anti-Gravity Device? Then go 5 yellow.
Do you want him to be an upgrade to MWidow's Widow's Sting (or at least equivalent - its quite powerful as it is on a 1*)? Then go 5 blue.
Do you want him to be an upgrade to Bullseye's Adamantium Bones? Then go 5 purple.

But, don't expect him to do any of them well at all without 5 in that skill. The rest is simply numbers for the devs to tune.

Unknown

Anyone think he might be reworked a little more than slight stat adjustments and AP costs? If they make ATU more expensive, they might change SS, which isn't that old of a skill, to something more like GSBW's purple. Maybe not that expensive and fewer tiles, but it would fit with the idea of SS. They could also have it be like Mag's blue, but instead of feeding back into itself, it would either feed ATU or be used to protect. Another possibility would be if it put down web tiles, so when you use ATU, you wouldn't necessarily need to build up the board with blue AP before getting a good stun. With how much Thor changed, I think it might be possible that spidey could have a more drastic change than we're thinking. Not necessarily a bad nerf, but a drastic change.

akboyce

IceIX wrote:

You're not going to be seeing a change in Spidey in the next couple hours. Likely not until R48, if not later. He's on the list, yes. But we're not whacking away at that list at the moment.

Is R48 within the next 3d 08h? That is when my The Best There Is covers will expire.

And if R48 will not make that mark will patch notes containing his changes (or even planned changes) make that mark so people who got covers from The Best There Is can theory craft optimal builds before the covers poof?

Thanks!

Unknown

Will re-spec be introduced in R48? That would be grand.

Unknown

IceIX wrote:

You're not going to be seeing a change in Spidey in the next couple hours. Likely not until R48, if not later. He's on the list, yes. But we're not whacking away at that list at the moment.

Thanks for at least a little indication, Ice!

As akboyce mentions above, it WOULD be nice to know what's going to happen before Friday at midnight, since you guys awarded SO MANY Spidey covers in the Best There Is tournament. If you are not, in fact, whacking away at that list just now (and I could understand why, given other pressing issues), it doesn't sound like that's very likely.

Thanks again, and we'll keep waiting...

IceIX

akboyce wrote:

IceIX wrote:

You're not going to be seeing a change in Spidey in the next couple hours. Likely not until R48, if not later. He's on the list, yes. But we're not whacking away at that list at the moment.

Is R48 within the next 3d 08h? That is when my The Best There Is covers will expire.

And if R48 will not make that mark will patch notes containing his changes (or even planned changes) make that mark so people who got covers from The Best There Is can theory craft optimal builds before the covers poof?

Thanks!

No, not within the next 3 days either. It's still sitting in the approval pipelines which aren't likely (but it's always possible) to clear by Friday. Even if R48 were to hit then, we still wouldn't be making any changes to Spider-Man at R48 start (assuming R48 doesn't break him). We'll be making a posting on any character changes once they're ready to go out and before they actually do so.

Unknown

IceIX wrote:

No, not within the next 3 days either. It's still sitting in the approval pipelines which aren't likely (but it's always possible) to clear by Friday. Even if R48 were to hit then, we still wouldn't be making any changes to Spider-Man at R48 start (assuming R48 doesn't break him). We'll be making a posting on any character changes once they're ready to go out and before they actually do so.

Thanks again for the transparency, though it makes me sad! I guess I should have skipped the Best There Is tourney...I suppose that was perhaps intended for people starting on fresh Spideys. I did get one blue cover I needed from it, at least.

Looking forward to seeing the changes when they come. Thanks again!

Dayv

Life is short, and Respec is Coming™. Don't let your Spidey covers expire because you're afraid of the coming changes. Eventually, you'll be able to fix a suboptimal build. Until then, a suboptimal 3* can be better than none at all.

Unknown

DayvBang wrote:

Life is short, and Respec is Coming™. Don't let your Spidey covers expire because you're afraid of the coming changes. Eventually, you'll be able to fix a suboptimal build. Until then, a suboptimal 3* can be better than none at all.

But IS respec coming? And if so, when? I have a 3/3/3 Spidey, who is not horribly. I would hate to use that purple cover I have sitting in the cache, only to have Spidey funbalanced a few days later to an optimal 5/5/3 build, with no respec in sight. Smarter, I think, to sell the covers, then try to get those last four once I know how I want to build my character. My roster is littered with too many heroes that just make me angry to look at because I accidentally used the wrong cover or changed my mind about which cover to use after it was too late (I'm looking at you, Punisher and Astonishing Wolvie).

IceIX

wathombe wrote:

But IS respec coming? And if so, when?

Dun dun dun...

Unknown

IceIX wrote:

wathombe wrote:

But IS respec coming? And if so, when?

Dun dun dun...

So you're saying it's done.

IceIX

Blue Shoes wrote:

So you're saying it's done.

I was thinking more along the lines of this.

Unknown

I like spidey the way he is. Yeah stunlock can be annoying but you can play around it and Spidey is squishy like OBW, who also doesn't necessarily need to be nerfed.

Unknown

Twysta wrote:

Use 'em or lose 'em.
Pretty sure you won't see a nerf in the next few days.

I agree. I wish we knew the schedule when covers are going to be offered ahead of time, so events plus prizes. I definitely will not put any more ISO on spidey until his fate is determined. Wish I had more covers for punisher...

Unknown

I guess this is directed at the devs - will you put up the revisions ahead of time like you did with Wolverine and Thor, and , if so, when?