*** Doctor Doom (Classic) ***

ayatorahxephon

omg there are too many DD in the game (doctor doom, dare devil, devil dinosaur) made my head spin when I am trying to think which DD

Marc_Spector

Alarron wrote:

I usually run Patch with CMags, and DD feels about that power level.

Alarron, if you're a fan of both of the latter, try running my new favorite trio of Patch (1st position / center), Doom (2nd/left) and CMags (3rd/right) -- at max levels, Patch&Doom will take all 6 colors, with CMags staying hidden in the back

Carnage_78

Although it was frustrating to see a number of good characters shelved for such an extensive period of time, I like how the older characters get featured once they get out of the mothballs!

My Doctor Doom was only 1 just last week...and was stagnating unused at the bottom of my roster since forever (that cover was my Day 44 Daily Reward...I am currently going towards Day 140)...now, I just got the PvE progression reward bringing it to 2 2 2

If all goes well, I will add to that 2 coming from the PvP currently running...so potentially 7 covers of the same character within a week which is awesome for my roster progression!

Now to do that with each character rotated back in...

Unknown

With a lucky pull and the revelations y'all've stumbled upon, I'm probably going to try out BerserkerPlotting/Dr. Patch/DiabolicalRage combo. Can get Doom to 114 now

atomzed

Phantron wrote:

It's almost certainly better to not have Technopathic Strike maxed from a math point of view but you can't put a value when that rare board comes up where you can channel your inner villian say, "Everything is going according to the plan MAWAHAHAHA".

Did THE phantron just cracked a joke? Oh man, that's a rare sight!

On a more serious note I really enjoy the discussion. I always like Doom even when he was at 2 ability, and his 3rd ability is really cool too. So much so that I had spend 900 hp shield hopping so that I can get my last purple for him.... hopefully I can get it.

Blue is a great ability, and as phantron said, you can timed it with a good board state. I think the optimal is 355 or 454.

ronin_san

Phantron wrote:

It's almost certainly better to not have Technopathic Strike maxed from a math point of view but you can't put a value when that rare board comes up where you can channel your inner villian say, "Everything is going according to the plan MAWAHAHAHA".

The thing is, it's best to do 5/4/4 or 5/3/5 for Math's sake. the --> isn't a WOW sort of ability.

But when Daken loses health when there's no blue on the board...
But when their Storm is one blue away from stunning you for 4 turns and possibly downing a key player...
But when their 4hor is wreaking havoc stunning you...
But when their damned Magneto can shut down your front guy with a tile manipulation...

Then I'll deny them a blue, even by chance from a cascade. When it comes to that, I spare nothing to chance. At that point, 5 in Technopathic Strike is a must.

atomzed wrote:

Did THE phantron just cracked a joke? Oh man, that's a rare sight!

On a more serious note I really enjoy the discussion. I always like Doom even when he was at 2 ability, and his 3rd ability is really cool too. So much so that I had spend 900 hp shield hopping so that I can get my last purple for him.... hopefully I can get it.

Blue is a great ability, and as phantron said, you can timed it with a good board state. I think the optimal is 355 or 454.

Doom's mah fave. I really want a Secret Wars/Marvel vs Capcom sort-of Doom that's all pew-pew lasers, bombs, and (why did my attack hurt me instead of Doom) sort of evil ...

Unknown

ronin-san wrote:

Marvel vs Capcom

HIDDEN MISSILE - FOOT-FOOT DIVE

Vhailorx

So what is the consensus on new doom? He doesn't seem fast or powerful enough for PvP, But his colors pair well with green/red users. Is he a solid mid-tier 3* worth leveling (especially for someone with patch)?

Unknown

Diabolical Plot is too powerful!

Only 10 purple AP are needed, and for every trap tile additional damage!

Delimit the trap tiles to 2 or 3, that's more than enough. And increase the needed AP to 15.

Fulgren

I am loving Diabolical Plot, from both a flavor-wise and mechanical perspective. I have waited months for 166 Doom, and he does not disappoint. I concede that he is still not a level to take on the 4 stars, but meh that's another topic for another time.

My build right now is 5/5/3, and so far I'm pretty impressed with how much of a punch DP is even at 3 covers. As many people have previously stated, he takes over Purple so running him with Patch can be really rewarding. I've used the same team in the last 2 PVP's, Patch/Doom/Hood, giving total rainbow access and three individual assassination bombs in & .

I'm with Phantron on the power of 5 blue, I would much rather hold on to that over Demons. I plan on keeping Doom this way, unless I open another Purple, in which case, he's going to 4/5/4.

On a side note, Patch is getting a lot of love lately, with Daredevil, Loki, and now Doom being buffed in ways to minimize the risk of Berserker Rage.

Phaserhawk

My Doom 5/5/1 has allowed me enough to see what he is now. Purple is very interesting, it's one of those, you rush to get purple or let it flow, but eventually you wait for the opportune time to use it and obliterate an opponent. At one point I was able to get 8 tiles out. I am also starting to see the benefits of blue maxed vs. Summon Demons, in determing top black AP users you have of course X-Force, but if you look at the top 15 3*'s

Thor, Daken, BP, Cap, Hood, Mags, Blade, Patch, Deadpool, Hulk, Capt Marvel, Human Torch, Sentry, Punisher, Falcon. That's according to the character sheet, although I would say Luke Cage, Mystique kick out Capt Marvel and Sentry and Falcon should be higher, either way. of those Cage, Mystique, BP, Hood, Blade, Marvel, Torch, Punisher all have active blacks.

Torch's black is stronger and cheaper but also easier to destroy. Blade and BP have the best over Doom, Hood's isn't really great unless paired with Cap or Pun, Punisher' s is not as strong as dooms, and Cage and Mystique while a little to early to tell, appear to have better ones as well, so to me it seems that there isn't a shortage of black powers that are cheaper and more instant than Doom's, which is why I'm more prone now to go 3/5/5

What is nice is Mystique/Doom. race blue, determine if you need 50/50 black purple or all black you then have Masterstroke or Summon Demons to choose from, and you can determine if you need the stun or the damage from purple

vudu3

I'm leaning towards 3/5/5 myself. The reason is that the strength of Summon Demons is linear from 3 > 4 > 5 covers but Diabolical Plot is not.

Summon Demons lays 4 attack tiles at 3 covers, 5 at 4 covers and 6 at 5 covers. That's a 25% power gain from 3 > 4, a 20% power gain from 4 > 5 and a 50% power gain from 3 > 5.

Diabolical Plot's power increases by 29% from 3 > 4 covers, 44% from 4 > 5 covers and a whopping 85% from 3 > 5 covers.

Simply looking at the math, I think Diabolical Plot wins every time. With 4 trap tiles on the board it hits for 5655 damage at 5 covers. Assuming no strike tiles it would take 5 turns for Summon Demons (also 5 covers) to do the same damage. If one attack tile gets destroyed every other turn it now takes 7 turns to do the same damage.

Note that I used 4 trap tiles above because I think that's a fairly reasonable number. If you want to use 6 trap tiles Diabolical Plot now does 7917 damage. It takes 7 turns of full-strength Summon Demons to do the same damage. If you assume that you lose one attack tile every other turn then Summon Demons caps out at 6840 damage so it can't even match the damage from Diabolical Plot in this scenario.

OH MY GOD THE NUMBERS I'VE TURNED INTO PHANTRON

ronin_san

vudu3 wrote:

I'm leaning towards 3/5/5 myself. The reason is that the strength of Summon Demons is linear from 3 > 4 > 5 covers but Diabolical Plot is not.

Summon Demons lays 4 attack tiles at 3 covers, 5 at 4 covers and 6 at 5 covers. That's a 25% power gain from 3 > 4, a 20% power gain from 4 > 5 and a 50% power gain from 3 > 5.

Diabolical Plot's power increases by 29% from 3 > 4 covers, 44% from 4 > 5 covers and a whopping 85% from 3 > 5 covers.

Simply looking at the math, I think Diabolical Plot wins every time. With 4 trap tiles on the board it hits for 5655 damage at 5 covers. Assuming no strike tiles it would take 5 turns for Summon Demons (also 5 covers) to do the same damage. If one attack tile gets destroyed every other turn it now takes 7 turns to do the same damage.

Note that I used 4 trap tiles above because I think that's a fairly reasonable number. If you want to use 6 trap tiles Diabolical Plot now does 7917 damage. It takes 7 turns of full-strength Summon Demons to do the same damage. If you assume that you lose one attack tile every other turn then Summon Demons caps out at 6840 damage so it can't even match the damage from Diabolical Plot in this scenario.

OH MY GOD THE NUMBERS I'VE TURNED INTO PHANTRON

The think I like about 3/5/5 is that it allows you to match purples (without worrying or doing a trap-count) and still drop significant dmg.

Unknown

vudu3 wrote:

I'm leaning towards 3/5/5 myself. The reason is that the strength of Summon Demons is linear from 3 > 4 > 5 covers but Diabolical Plot is not.

Summon Demons lays 4 attack tiles at 3 covers, 5 at 4 covers and 6 at 5 covers. That's a 25% power gain from 3 > 4, a 20% power gain from 4 > 5 and a 50% power gain from 3 > 5.

Diabolical Plot's power increases by 29% from 3 > 4 covers, 44% from 4 > 5 covers and a whopping 85% from 3 > 5 covers.

Simply looking at the math, I think Diabolical Plot wins every time. With 4 trap tiles on the board it hits for 5655 damage at 5 covers. Assuming no strike tiles it would take 5 turns for Summon Demons (also 5 covers) to do the same damage. If one attack tile gets destroyed every other turn it now takes 7 turns to do the same damage.

Note that I used 4 trap tiles above because I think that's a fairly reasonable number. If you want to use 6 trap tiles Diabolical Plot now does 7917 damage. It takes 7 turns of full-strength Summon Demons to do the same damage. If you assume that you lose one attack tile every other turn then Summon Demons caps out at 6840 damage so it can't even match the damage from Diabolical Plot in this scenario.

OH MY GOD THE NUMBERS I'VE TURNED INTO PHANTRON

5 also increases the individual damage of each strike tile, but only marginally. From like 150 to 190 each. 5 covers is slightly more than 50% damage increase over 3 covers, but not enough to merit 5 instead of 5 . Diabolical Planning is just too good. 10 AP, wait until the traps are set, and kill someone. It's a crazy power. Easily at least 500 damage per AP, if not much much more.

Dayv

vudu3 wrote:

I'm leaning towards 3/5/5 myself. The reason is that the strength of Summon Demons is linear from 3 > 4 > 5 covers but Diabolical Plot is not.

Summon Demons lays 4 attack tiles at 3 covers, 5 at 4 covers and 6 at 5 covers. That's a 25% power gain from 3 > 4, a 20% power gain from 4 > 5 and a 50% power gain from 3 > 5.

Extra wrinkle: damage per tile increases from 52 to 60 (at level 40). That's a ~38.5% power gain from 4 covers to 5 when you account for both increased damage and tile count.

Overall, the increase in damage from 3 covers to 5 is actually 73%.

On the other hand, the increase in damage for Diabolical Plan from 3 covers to 5 is 85.5%.

Personally, I lean towards Diabolical Plan, partially because I'm a serial Daken abuser and often have less than 6 free red tiles on the board.

vudu3

You're right! I failed to notice that there an increase in attack tile strength from levels 4 to 5.

So overall going from 3 to 5 covers increases Summon Demons by 73% and Diabolical Plot by 85%. Much closer than I initially thought.

Still, I think 3/5/5 is the best build for me. Those attack tiles never seem to stick around very long.

Unknown

Is it just me, or does Doom's technopathic strike also steal Blue AP now? I think I've seen this twice.

Pwuz_

Agh, too much too read.. This is what I get for slacking off on the forums here.

I find it interesting how Doom's new trap tiles interact with other purple specials.

When casting Berserker Rage, your Doom's traps prevent the opposing team's strike tiles from appearing. Not sure how it works when the AI is using it.
When going against another Doom, the Traps replace each other. After a few turns, it becomes a battle between the warring trap tiles.

I know I saw others mention that when the trap tiles change color, they don't get destroyed when using Diabolical Plot, has anyone checked to see if they still count towards the damage? I keep trying, but end up being too powerful for any remaining foes.

Unknown

Pwuz_ wrote:

Agh, too much too read.. This is what I get for slacking off on the forums here.

I find it interesting how Doom's new trap tiles interact with other purple specials.

When casting Berserker Rage, your Doom's traps prevent the opposing team's strike tiles from appearing. Not sure how it works when the AI is using it.
When going against another Doom, the Traps replace each other. After a few turns, it becomes a battle between the warring trap tiles.

I know I saw others mention that when the trap tiles change color, they don't get destroyed when using Diabolical Plot, has anyone checked to see if they still count towards the damage? I keep trying, but end up being too powerful for any remaining foes.

zerker rage will overrite an opponent's doom's purple traps, but not your own.

ronin_san

daibar wrote:

Is it just me, or does Doom's technopathic strike also steal Blue AP now? I think I've seen this twice.

No. But obviously it can generate cascades. Any chance their team had a Blade, OBW, or Hood? That'd account for your loss of AP.