2.8 Release Notes *Updated (7/30/18)

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  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
  • Elektrophorus
    Elektrophorus Posts: 150 Tile Toppler
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    Flavor-wise, there’s an error in the post. Sarkhan Fireblood is actually well after he breaks free from Bolas and begins acting as an independent hero. I know this doesn’t matter gameplay-wise, but it might be interesting to know for players who don’t have a background in MTG.
  • FindingHeart8
    FindingHeart8 Posts: 2,730 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    I dread the day they nerf cards like Deploy, Olivia, Pig...

    honestly it would be a significant deterrent for me playing the game if they did, as it would significantly lengthen legacy matches, and I spend enough time playing this game as is.
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    FindingHeart8 said:
    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    I dread the day they nerf cards like Deploy, Olivia, Pig...

    honestly it would be a significant deterrent for me playing the game if they did, as it would significantly lengthen legacy matches, and I spend enough time playing this game as is.
    Funny, most people are complaining that there isn't enough to do in game.  I would assume slightly longer matches would help that a bit.  Unless you just want a hundred 1 minute long matches instead of 25 5 minute long ones
  • Gunmix25
    Gunmix25 Posts: 1,434 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Mark_Tedin said:
    Ok, let's go ... First of all, I congratulate you for listening to the forum participants a lot. It have many good things like Land Support Changes (mainly Zhalfirin Void), General Changes (Naru, Traxos, Haphazardous Bombardment), Training Grounds - Standard PVP, Shield Number, bug fixes...BUT....

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    Not a super nerf. Cycling dominated legacy as much as it did standard. It was needed to balance out game play going forward, especially in legacy. You can still do the effects desired, but no more of this 3000 drakes because you can in turn one. (If you've got the time that is ;) ) besides the drakes, NP, Faith of devoted and cheap cycle cards all fit within the nerf hammer parameters set down by Oktagon. Dominate strategy and loop effect that allowed endless cycling for the win.
  • Gunmix25
    Gunmix25 Posts: 1,434 Chairperson of the Boards
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    FindingHeart8 said:
    Mburn7 said:
    FindingHeart8 said:
    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    I dread the day they nerf cards like Deploy, Olivia, Pig...

    honestly it would be a significant deterrent for me playing the game if they did, as it would significantly lengthen legacy matches, and I spend enough time playing this game as is.
    Funny, most people are complaining that there isn't enough to do in game.  I would assume slightly longer matches would help that a bit.  Unless you just want a hundred 1 minute long matches instead of 25 5 minute long ones
    If I play ToTP, RIV, and clearing all nodes in whatever the flavor of the day event is, that's usually 3 to 4 hours of gameplay per day.  That's a significant time commitment for anyone with a full-time job, social life, etc.
    It is ...  thank goodness I have no life! :D
  • TheExaminer
    TheExaminer Posts: 94 Match Maker
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    As the one of the biggest "do not nerf cycling" apologist on this forum, I kinda like how devs fixed it. Still going to be playable and pretty powerful. Besides that, faith of the devoted was the best wincon anyway.
    Also, LOL. If you havent been touching cycling for all this time (about a year?), why would you change it now? To make that Ominous Sphinx playable? xd
  • madwren
    madwren Posts: 2,229 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2018
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    The set looks great overall. I'm pleased.

    However, am I correct that there are only two cards in M19 that have Flash? Chromium and Murder?

    Huh. I understand wanting to slow roll a tricky new mechanic, but it really seems like we could have had a couple of others if you wanted to test the waters effectively.
  • babar3355
    babar3355 Posts: 1,128 Chairperson of the Boards
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    This will be the first time since BFZ where we don't have any truly strong green gem converters.  I guess we will be seeing a lot of blue in the future!
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    madwren said:
    The set looks great overall. I'm pleased.

    However, am I correct that there are only two cards in M19 that have Flash? Chromium and Murder?

    Huh. I understand wanting to slow roll a tricky new mechanic, but it really seems like we could have had a couple of others if you wanted to test the waters effectively.
    It's probably the same thing that they did with Leader.  You only put in on a few cards to get all the bugs ironed out, and then start using it as a normal mechanic going forward.  

    It also allows it to ease its way into our strategizing, so we aren't just flooded with a brand new mechanic immediately.
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
    edited July 2018
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    Hi Everyone,

    I've confirmed with the team that Origins will in fact remain in Standard, and Hour of Devastation will be rotating into Legacy, when Core Set 2019 arrives. I've added this information into the main post.
    James13 said:
    Hopefully the official gallery goes up soon, considering the facebook post shows them.

    Otherwise, I don't know why D3 seem to be trolling Octal ever since the feature about his resource!   ;)
    Don't worry! We're working with Octal9 on getting him the resources he needs to put the card gallery up on his site. :)
    Elektrophorus said:
    Flavor-wise, there’s an error in the post. Sarkhan Fireblood is actually well after he breaks free from Bolas and begins acting as an independent hero. I know this doesn’t matter gameplay-wise, but it might be interesting to know for players who don’t have a background in MTG.
    *looks at flavor-text* Oh! Looks like that was my fault. To keep the post as short as possible, I only included the first sentence of each of the Planeswalker's back-story. Looks like the story continues on to explain how Ajani's victory changed Sarkhan. You can check out the full story, once he arrives in game ;)
  • Theros
    Theros Posts: 490 Mover and Shaker
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    Lack of green gems changers when hod rotates out is worrying me too.
    Will m19 add illusion creatures? So far only 2 exist in the entire game and more are needed to make cute Jace more cute. 
  • Gunmix25
    Gunmix25 Posts: 1,434 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    They kind of did in the monthly questionnaire response... I think maybe March? or April? Stated that they are looking at balancing cards once they were caught up so as to reduce the problems of power hikes and improve lesser used cards.

    Mburn7 said:

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    Ha! I can see it coming...
  • Mburn7
    Mburn7 Posts: 3,427 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Theros said:
    Lack of green gems changers when hod rotates out is worrying me too.
    Will m19 add illusion creatures? So far only 2 exist in the entire game and more are needed to make cute Jace more cute. 
    I think there might just be 1 illusion in M19.  I may be wrong, though.  Don't blame Oktagon for the lack, though.  Blame WOTC
  • ArielSira
    ArielSira Posts: 491 Mover and Shaker
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    I never had the likes of Rishkar or HoP so I've had to do with Beneath the Sands and Thunderherd Migration and they're fine. The 5 for 5 from DOM isn't bad either. I'm glad there's no easymode mythic gem convertor. I'm gonna miss HuF though.
  • Tilwin90
    Tilwin90 Posts: 662 Critical Contributor
    edited July 2018
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    The problem is that with the lack of ramp, those expensive creatures are going to be a problem. I understand Oktagon wants us to play those gem changing supports they just balanced but c'mon... Ironic they themselves mentioned that green should retain mass gem changing capabilities.
    And no... Thunderherd Migration doesn't quite cut it... I used to think HoP was bad and to be frank it was probably the perfect balance when looking at absurdities like Rishksex, Renewal and Season's Past. But I really don't want to get back to poor conditional gem changers like Animist's Awakening.
    I thought people wanted fast options to not make matches last FOREVER... without ramp, good luck!
    (oh wait, we have StV so I guess people are fine with that now)
  • GrizzoMtGPQ
    GrizzoMtGPQ Posts: 776 Critical Contributor
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    @Brigby so is Core being treated like any other set? What are the long-term plans for Core and it's position in standard? Can you provide any additional clarification on these matters?
  • Kinesia
    Kinesia Posts: 1,621 Chairperson of the Boards
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    FindingHeart8 said:
    Mburn7 said:
    FindingHeart8 said:
    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    I dread the day they nerf cards like Deploy, Olivia, Pig...

    honestly it would be a significant deterrent for me playing the game if they did, as it would significantly lengthen legacy matches, and I spend enough time playing this game as is.
    Funny, most people are complaining that there isn't enough to do in game.  I would assume slightly longer matches would help that a bit.  Unless you just want a hundred 1 minute long matches instead of 25 5 minute long ones
    If I play ToTP, RIV, and clearing all nodes in whatever the flavor of the day event is, that's usually 3 to 4 hours of gameplay per day.  That's a significant time commitment for anyone with a full-time job, social life, etc.

    They just need to get it to 25 hours of content a day to flip the switch in your brain from "How do I do it all?" to "Which bits do I do?".

    Grin.

    (It actually happens much earlier than 25 hours, but it varies with individual.)
  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,064 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Mburn7 said:
    Mark_Tedin said:

    I sincerely disagree with the SUPER NERF's Cycling cards and other legacy cards (Shire of the Forsaken Gods). Please, do not nerf our legacy. This is one of the most fun parts of the game. Thanks! :) 
    I'm confused.  Why is it ok to nerf a standard card but not a legacy one?  All cards hit legacy eventually (usually about a year). Why does them being slightly older make them inherently immune to balancing?  Oktagon announced that they would be balancing older sets when they first started.  Its a little surprising we didn't get a heads up, but not that it happened.

    Cycling needed a nerf a year and a half ago.  But Oktagon wasn't around then, and when they started they had to focus on catching the sets up to paper.  The cycling nerf is fine.  You should not be able to win with nothing but cycling.

    I find it interesting that the legacy cards that got changed are mostly not the overpowered ones (Olivia, Pig, Ulrich..ect) but were definitely still probably needed.  And some cards were buffed, not nerfed!  Balance!

    I am waiting for someone to request a refund for their money buy of Shrine, though.  That would be hilarious.
    Don't forget about Mirrorpool getting the nerf. Wasn't that a paid card too?

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