Pvp cyber bullying

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  • BlackWidower
    BlackWidower Posts: 250 Mover and Shaker
    sh81 said:

    I should say though, similar to a post higher up, I could well be double or tripple tapping people and be completely oblivious to the fact.

    I take no notice of who Im playing at all, genuinely not even sure where to look, I just play through until I reach 575.  Sometimes I skip a match if its one I know Ill lose, but thats it.


    I even warned my alliance, look, if I attack you in PVP, I am sorry, not all that used to looking, either.  And a couple PVPVs back, it seems like there was about 15 "winfinite" teams, (that I can totally beat) and I lost count of what their names were after a while.  It's easy to do.
  • grunth13
    grunth13 Posts: 608 Critical Contributor
    So is it considered bullying if you have been hitting a certain group over and over for months,  but now they have had enough and have decided to do the same? 
  • Spudgutter
    Spudgutter Posts: 743 Critical Contributor
    purplemur said:
    If we showed a micron of care about this issue as we did for suspected cheaters and the ToS this thread could have been helpful and uplifting. I don't think the OP was even trying to insinuate anything, just starting a discussion. A discussion that went sourly reactionist like the whole idea is just whining.

    -What do you think cyber bullying would be? lets try and come up with a community standard and have some measure to gauge against. 
    -What should a player do if they think they are being bullied? =report that tinykitty! yea but how? is the forum the place, i dunno, maybe, lets have a mods opinion: How you gonna be all up in the biz about posts being in the wrong sub but let issues like this ghost? 
    This thread is in response to another thread.  The other thread got shut down and locked pretty quick by a mod.  Personally, i take that action as a mod response to the whole issue.  
    You also bring up a good point about how some on the forum keep flogging other threads that may not indirectly impact them, and yet are dismissive of this issue.  I don't have anything to add to the good points you made there, i just wanted to reiterate it lol

    And for those that only play to the CP level at 575, you probably aren't even on the radar of the type of people that take this stuff super seriously.  

    I'm glad this doesn't happen as often as it used to, but i believe it is still happening and should be addressed and curbed.  I'm all for the anonymous pvp.  Or at least be able to flag friendly names to keep them out of your queue.  They really should revamp it all together.
  • animaniactoo
    animaniactoo Posts: 486 Mover and Shaker
    I saw the original thread. It's the first I've heard of this - but one of the things I noted was that one of the accused alliance members was saying it was a misunderstanding and to pm them to work it out if they wanted. I honestly found that curious because hey - this person is feeling picked on by you/your alliance? Why don't you just say out there on the thread, "no harm meant, but np, we'll try not to hit you anymore, don't hit us and we'll call it square going forward"? Why do they have to pm people they're trying to get away from in order to resolve it?

    I guess what I'm most curious about is what they're supposed to do if they feel they're being targeted? How are they supposed to document it and who are they supposed to report it to? Because I can understand that an open call in the forum isn't the right thing (unless they've tried the official route and gotten nowhere and are looking to publicize an issue) - but I'd like to know if they're supposed to file a ticket with CS or what about it? And how would they know that is the route to go? Because I try not to go to CS unless it's a game mechanics issue where something's gone wrong and I need them to fix something for me. I don't know that CS would be an obvious route for most people on the same basis.
  • A_Wise_Man
    A_Wise_Man Posts: 153 Tile Toppler
    Yes ....I have been single out
    This is exactly the issue with this game.  See, the problem isn't pvp attacks.  The problem is there are alliances and groups of alliances that feel they should be immune to attacks in a pvp game.  If you happen to hit them (which is impossible to avoid in the 5* tier if you actually want to play pvp), they will retaliate in force by losing on purpose to dump points away and then hitting you over and over and over.  They will cry and whine all day if you hit them once, but think it's ok to brutalize you just for playing the game.  
        Is this effective?  Sure.  Lots of the leaderboard alliances at the top do this and end up placing very high.  But that doesn't mean its not intimidation or bullying.  Some of these guys even take on mob names (theres one guy named after enforcers that the mafia used to use.  There's a whole alliance named after the mafia, too).  You can't tell me it's not thug tactics.  I just try to play for some command points and some iso.  I play in the 4th slot a lot and those guys are real jerks.  They want to score 3,000 points ,which is way too high, bit they don't want you to get to 900.  It's just not fair.  I just recently championed starlord and banner because I thought that would be a good team.  They're good 5 stars  and I do ok, but I get hit too much. Something needs to be done about these groups, and fast!
  • animaniactoo
    animaniactoo Posts: 486 Mover and Shaker
    A_Wise_Man said:
    This is exactly the issue with this game.  See, the problem isn't pvp attacks.  The problem is there are alliances and groups of alliances that feel they should be immune to attacks in a pvp game.  If you happen to hit them (which is impossible to avoid in the 5* tier if you actually want to play pvp), they will retaliate in force by losing on purpose to dump points away and then hitting you over and over and over.  They will cry and whine all day if you hit them once, but think it's ok to brutalize you just for playing the game.  
        Is this effective?  Sure.  Lots of the leaderboard alliances at the top do this and end up placing very high.  But that doesn't mean its not intimidation or bullying.  Some of these guys even take on mob names (theres one guy named after enforcers that the mafia used to use.  There's a whole alliance named after the mafia, too).  You can't tell me it's not thug tactics.  I just try to play for some command points and some iso.  I play in the 4th slot a lot and those guys are real jerks.  They want to score 3,000 points ,which is way too high, bit they don't want you to get to 900.  It's just not fair.  I just recently championed starlord and banner because I thought that would be a good team.  They're good 5 stars  and I do ok, but I get hit too much. Something needs to be done about these groups, and fast!
    Interestingly, this is exactly how I saw playing PVP being discussed in another thread, about leaving out trapcakes, and alliances coordinating to do that and using that to gain themselves points. Which leaves me to wonder if it's a purposeful plan to target someone or someone falling for the trapcakes without being targeted but ending up feeling picked on.
  • lokiagentofhotness
    lokiagentofhotness Posts: 192 Tile Toppler
    It's called player vs player. If you don't want to get hit, I suggest you play dpd or PVE. 
  • revskip
    revskip Posts: 1,005 Chairperson of the Boards
    No
    animaniactoo said:
    I saw the original thread. It's the first I've heard of this - but one of the things I noted was that one of the accused alliance members was saying it was a misunderstanding and to pm them to work it out if they wanted. I honestly found that curious because hey - this person is feeling picked on by you/your alliance? Why don't you just say out there on the thread, "no harm meant, but np, we'll try not to hit you anymore, don't hit us and we'll call it square going forward"? Why do they have to pm people they're trying to get away from in order to resolve it?

    I guess what I'm most curious about is what they're supposed to do if they feel they're being targeted? How are they supposed to document it and who are they supposed to report it to? Because I can understand that an open call in the forum isn't the right thing (unless they've tried the official route and gotten nowhere and are looking to publicize an issue) - but I'd like to know if they're supposed to file a ticket with CS or what about it? And how would they know that is the route to go? Because I try not to go to CS unless it's a game mechanics issue where something's gone wrong and I need them to fix something for me. I don't know that CS would be an obvious route for most people on the same basis.
    The issue really is that there is a disconnect between what some people feel like is normal hitting and others feel like is bullying.  Truth is if your roster is at the 3* or  below level you aren't being bullied you simply don't have a roster that can compete in PVP.  Whether or not that means that PVP needs changing is a completely separate topic,  

    In any PVP arena there are going to be  bigger rosters chewing on smaller rosters.  It is inherent in the PVP model and no amount of teeth gnashing or indignance is going to make that go away.  It is the very nature of the mode.  

    If you are feeling bullied by PVP you probably need to check at least some of your privilege at the door.  

    I have a solid 4* roster.  I routinely get smacked down in slice 5 PVP if I don't time my shield hops well.  I do coordinate outside of the game using Line to do so, as do most of the top scorers in my slices/brackets.  If you don't do so you will be behind the 8 ball.  

    I don't think that is an indictment of the entire system, merely a cautionary tale.  If you want top level rewards you better be willing to put in the extra time and resources to make that happen.  If not you get the rewards that less time and commitment warrant.  

    During the offseason for instance I am a frequent lurker, I get to 900 and get out without any real commitment. I don't begrudge those hitting top rewards because I don't put in nearly the time and effort during those events that top scorers are putting in.  

    In order to reap the rewards at the top of the pyramid the people fighting for those rewards put in serious time and commitment.  If you want those same rewards you should be willing/able to put forth that same commitment or otherwise be okay with lesser rewards.  
  • Alsmir
    Alsmir Posts: 508 Critical Contributor
    Yes ....I have been single out
    Ofc it happens. Sure, you most likely need to visit certain LINE rooms to be aware of that or simply go beyond "just deal with it" attitude, but it happens.

    I'm not sure if bullying describes it that well, but it's a fact that there are players who take PvP very seriously, who might ruin your scores for entire season, because of slightest misunderstanding.
  • Beer40
    Beer40 Posts: 826 Critical Contributor
    TPF Alexis said:
    This is more about the design of the PvP system than anything else, but it does seem strange to me to have a system that requires other programs and out-of-game resources to do well.

    Or, to put it another way, a number of people in this thread have emphasized that it's supposed to be Player vs. Player. What we end up seeing at more than the lowest levels of competition seems not to be Player vs. Player, but Group of Alliances vs. Group of Alliances at best, and if anyone stumbles into that level without somehow learning about that system, Group of Alliances vs. Player.
    I don't use out-of-game resources and I feel I do fairly well. Actually, I think if out-of-game collusion wasn't allowed, then I would actually do better.

    That's got me thinking about all the people that claim PVP is broken. Maybe its broken because of all the out of game collusion? It wouldn't surprise me in the least bit.
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Yes ....I have been single out
    It totally sounds like it exists, but I haven't experienced it.  I generally don't play PvP all that seriously because it seems to be a mess of collusion and bullying from top players/alliances and it's something I wish would be addressed.  

    That being said I doubt it will be addressed because of the amount of negative backlash it could bring to some their bottom line if these players quit.  The systems is somewhat rigged and it's mutually beneficial for both D3 and the players at the top so the rich get richer.  But that's the way most things in life work it seems...
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Yes ....I have been single out
    lokiagentofhotness said:
    It's called player vs player. If you don't want to get hit, I suggest you play dpd or PVE. 
    The issue here is not about getting hit.  It's about being systematically targeted by a player (or alliance or several alliances) that are bigger than you.  No one here is arguing that in PvP you shouldn't be hit.

    I think there should be a lockout if you hit the same player so many times.  Maybe after hitting the same player 5 times in 1 event they are locked out.  An alliance can't collectively hit the same player for more than 20 times, or something like that.  
  • grunth13
    grunth13 Posts: 608 Critical Contributor
    broll said:
    lokiagentofhotness said:
    It's called player vs player. If you don't want to get hit, I suggest you play dpd or PVE. 
    The issue here is not about getting hit.  It's about being systematically targeted by a player (or alliance or several alliances) that are bigger than you.  No one here is arguing that in PvP you shouldn't be hit.

    I think there should be a lockout if you hit the same player so many times.  Maybe after hitting the same player 5 times in 1 event they are locked out.  An alliance can't collectively hit the same player for more than 20 times, or something like that.  
    Problem with this is that there aren't enough targets as it is.  We routinely only have 5 people that we circulate over and over to the tune of 10 iso every skip after the first 4.  That's expensive.
  • alaeth
    alaeth Posts: 446 Mover and Shaker
    No
    I think there's two different types of people posting "yes"...

    Those that are newer to the game, and haven't yet realized the built-in mechanics of PvP (the "800 wall").

    Those that are persecuted and called out - outside the game - and have been attacked by co-ordinated groups.

    To the first set, All I can say is - it gets easier once you understand how the game was designed... as soon as you pass 800, you are visible to "everyone"... so yes, you will get beat up.


    To the second set - maybe look at yourself and your actions.  Rarely does retaliation come without reason...
  • San Narciso
    San Narciso Posts: 124 Tile Toppler
    edited July 2017
    When do I not feel targeted?! When I'm at home, I feel like my wife is sniping me with chores and obligations, and my kids are sniping me by needing me to cook dinner for them and make sure they get baths and get to school. When I'm at work, my boss snipes me like crazy. Sometimes quadruple or even quintuple taps me with phone calls and text messages just before noon! Even the mailman is constantly singling me out by sniping me with bills, nearly every day! In MPQ the same is true. I don't know what I did wrong in this life, and why I deserve this, but MPQ is a great metaphor, and I'm grateful for that. Through this game we all grow at life together! But yes, would be nice if people stopped sniping me and singling me out in PVP. I am a friendly player and nice guy. Not sure why so many haters! If it wasn't for the shard #5 in PVP, I probably wouldn't even play MPQ anymore, because only there is it easy to get CP and like a serene, calm lagoon, I can relax away from all the malevolent snipers in this phone game. 
  • broll
    broll Posts: 4,732 Chairperson of the Boards
    Yes ....I have been single out
    grunth13 said:
    broll said:
    lokiagentofhotness said:
    It's called player vs player. If you don't want to get hit, I suggest you play dpd or PVE. 
    The issue here is not about getting hit.  It's about being systematically targeted by a player (or alliance or several alliances) that are bigger than you.  No one here is arguing that in PvP you shouldn't be hit.

    I think there should be a lockout if you hit the same player so many times.  Maybe after hitting the same player 5 times in 1 event they are locked out.  An alliance can't collectively hit the same player for more than 20 times, or something like that.  
    Problem with this is that there aren't enough targets as it is.  We routinely only have 5 people that we circulate over and over to the tune of 10 iso every skip after the first 4.  That's expensive.
    That sounds like the match making system is inefficient.  Again total overhaul needed.

    I don't know why they can't just have seed accounts at various different levels to help with that.  It's not like the 'player' is actually doing the same thing.  Only difference is a players points don't go down when a seed gets hit.

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