Please nerf Baral

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  • Szamsziel
    Szamsziel Posts: 463 Mover and Shaker
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    Please! Tezzereth + baral - infinite discard combo?
  • Steeme
    Steeme Posts: 784 Critical Contributor
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    Szamsziel wrote:
    Please! Tezzereth + baral - infinite discard combo?

    If this is what it takes to get players to stop stuffing their decks with 4+ kill cards then I welcome the meta-shock.
  • hawkyh1
    hawkyh1 Posts: 780 Critical Contributor
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    Steeme wrote:
    Szamsziel wrote:
    Please! Tezzereth + baral - infinite discard combo?

    If this is what it takes to get players to stop stuffing their decks with 4+ kill cards then I welcome the meta-shock.

    wouldn't players try to stuff their decks with more
    kill spells? if baral comes out and your only card is
    the one that you've just drawn, which card would
    you hope for it to be?

    HH
  • buscemi
    buscemi Posts: 673 Critical Contributor
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    hawkyh1 wrote:
    Steeme wrote:
    Szamsziel wrote:
    Please! Tezzereth + baral - infinite discard combo?

    If this is what it takes to get players to stop stuffing their decks with 4+ kill cards then I welcome the meta-shock.

    wouldn't players try to stuff their decks with more
    kill spells? if baral comes out and your only card is
    the one that you've just drawn, which card would
    you hope for it to be?

    HH

    When you can draw your deck in a turn with Baral, you only need one or two kill spells.
  • hawkyh1
    hawkyh1 Posts: 780 Critical Contributor
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    I was thinking of playing against him.

    wouldn't 3 copies of the same kill spell be
    similar in effect to having 3+ spells?

    HH
  • ertaii
    ertaii Posts: 210 Tile Toppler
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    A good way to nerf baral would be to reduce the cost of Kambal greatly icon_e_smile.gif
  • Szamsziel
    Szamsziel Posts: 463 Mover and Shaker
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    Easy way to still have powerfull baral would be that spell get 4 mana, and then 1 mana is deducted from that spell.
  • Brigby
    Brigby ADMINISTRATORS Posts: 7,757 Site Admin
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    Hey Everyone. Sorry for the delay, but I wanted to confirm the messaging with the developers first.

    The team has definitely heard the feedback about Baral, and they are currently evaluating the card to determine how they will adjust it. Having said that though, I don't currently have a time-frame for when players can expect a change, but I will let everyone know once I have definitive information I can share.
  • PastrySpider
    PastrySpider Posts: 127 Tile Toppler
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    Thanks for following up Brigby. If you can, please let them know they'll need to address the fact that it was recently for purchase when they make adjustments. Getting their decision and messaging straight on that will help prevent another forum meltdown.
  • Steeme
    Steeme Posts: 784 Critical Contributor
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    PastrySpider wrote:
    Thanks for following up Brigby. If you can, please let them know they'll need to address the fact that it was recently for purchase when they make adjustments. Getting their decision and messaging straight on that will help prevent another forum meltdown.

    Interestingly enough, the players are doing this to themselves. No-one told anyone to run Kiora with Baral, 8 spells, and Aetherflux reservoir, given the fact that they know it will utterly ruin everyone's day when piloted by the AI. They willingly constructed the most griefing decks and submitted them into events.

    If any nerf is to happen, it's the players' own fault for gaming the system, and there is no recompense in that regard.
  • wereotter
    wereotter Posts: 2,064 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Steeme wrote:
    PastrySpider wrote:
    Thanks for following up Brigby. If you can, please let them know they'll need to address the fact that it was recently for purchase when they make adjustments. Getting their decision and messaging straight on that will help prevent another forum meltdown.

    Interestingly enough, the players are doing this to themselves. No-one told anyone to run Kiora with Baral, 8 spells, and Aetherflux reservoir, given the fact that they know it will utterly ruin everyone's day when piloted by the AI. They willingly constructed the most griefing decks and submitted them into events.

    If any nerf is to happen, it's the players' own fault for gaming the system, and there is no recompense in that regard.

    No one ever told players to run Ob Nixilis without any creatures and a fist full of discard and kill spells, but we do. No one told us to pair up Starfield of Nyx with Silverstrike and Inscidious Will so your opponent is completely locked down, but we do.

    Blaming the players isn't helpful when the real problem is a card that seemed to have no R&D or QA team review before it was released into the game. It's not the players' fault they looked for the way to most effectively use the card, it's their fault for releasing a card that's plainly broken.
  • Steeme
    Steeme Posts: 784 Critical Contributor
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    wereotter wrote:
    Steeme wrote:
    PastrySpider wrote:
    Thanks for following up Brigby. If you can, please let them know they'll need to address the fact that it was recently for purchase when they make adjustments. Getting their decision and messaging straight on that will help prevent another forum meltdown.

    Interestingly enough, the players are doing this to themselves. No-one told anyone to run Kiora with Baral, 8 spells, and Aetherflux reservoir, given the fact that they know it will utterly ruin everyone's day when piloted by the AI. They willingly constructed the most griefing decks and submitted them into events.

    If any nerf is to happen, it's the players' own fault for gaming the system, and there is no recompense in that regard.

    No one ever told players to run Ob Nixilis without any creatures and a fist full of discard and kill spells, but we do. No one told us to pair up Starfield of Nyx with Silverstrike and Inscidious Will so your opponent is completely locked down, but we do.

    Blaming the players isn't helpful when the real problem is a card that seemed to have no R&D or QA team review before it was released into the game. It's not the players' fault they looked for the way to most effectively use the card, it's their fault for releasing a card that's plainly broken.

    Sorry we have to disagree here. Every human being is in full control of their actions. I have Baral, and run no cycle decks. You can to. You have to make that decision, whether or not to willingly construct a deck that you know will grief the rest of the community, or whether to instead construct a balanced deck that harnesses Baral's strengths in a balanced manner.

    You're basically saying that since an exploit is possible, it's not the fault of the person for exploiting the system. I don't buy it.

    Your comparisons are also apples vs. oranges. Neither Ob Nix nor Starfield decks cause the AI to cycle for minutes at a time.

    And just so we're clear, I've always advocated a change to Baral's abilities to stop the cycling. No more, no less, and no refunds.
  • losdamianos
    losdamianos Posts: 429 Mover and Shaker
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    Brigby wrote:
    Hey Everyone. Sorry for the delay, but I wanted to confirm the messaging with the developers first.

    The team has definitely heard the feedback about Baral, and they are currently evaluating the card to determine how they will adjust it. Having said that though, I don't currently have a time-frame for when players can expect a change, but I will let everyone know once I have definitive information I can share.
    I do undestand how difficult this situation is from D3 perspective but if this nerf will actually happen can we get an asterix in any future paid cards and disclaimer that actual abilities may change under the pressure of community.
    There will be dozens of refund request too, just saying... Lets see what compensation we can expect....
  • Volrak
    Volrak Posts: 732 Critical Contributor
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    losdamianos wrote:
    I do undestand how difficult this situation is from D3 perspective but if this nerf will actually happen can we get an asterix in any future paid cards and disclaimer that actual abilities may change under the pressure of community.
    There will be dozens of refund request too, just saying... Lets see what compensation we can expect....
    They don't need an asterix when you've already agreed to this as a condition of use:
    We can manage, regulate, control, modify or eliminate virtual currency and/or virtual goods, including the price thereof, at our discretion, and will have no liability to you or any third party for any of such actions.
    See what else you've agreed to here: https://d3publisherofamerica.zendesk.co ... rms-of-Use
  • buscemi
    buscemi Posts: 673 Critical Contributor
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    Brigby wrote:
    Hey Everyone. Sorry for the delay, but I wanted to confirm the messaging with the developers first.

    The team has definitely heard the feedback about Baral, and they are currently evaluating the card to determine how they will adjust it. Having said that though, I don't currently have a time-frame for when players can expect a change, but I will let everyone know once I have definitive information I can share.

    Running out the clock on refunds, eh? Smart.
  • losdamianos
    losdamianos Posts: 429 Mover and Shaker
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    Volrak wrote:
    losdamianos wrote:
    I do undestand how difficult this situation is from D3 perspective but if this nerf will actually happen can we get an asterix in any future paid cards and disclaimer that actual abilities may change under the pressure of community.
    There will be dozens of refund request too, just saying... Lets see what compensation we can expect....
    They don't need an asterix when you've already agreed to this as a condition of use:
    We can manage, regulate, control, modify or eliminate virtual currency and/or virtual goods, including the price thereof, at our discretion, and will have no liability to you or any third party for any of such actions.
    See what else you've agreed to here: https://d3publisherofamerica.zendesk.co ... rms-of-Use


    Oh Im sure they've got their backs covered, Community saw the need to nerf baral as soon as preview of this card was released but they've decided to charge for it anyway. This just show that baral was a cash grab which eventually will get nerfed anyway
  • Monkeynutts
    Monkeynutts Posts: 566 Critical Contributor
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    It just shows what D3 have become from a good fun game with some purchasing if you want to you must pay money to be competitive.
    They say they test, so they knew what Baral would do. Its all about the money money....
  • andrewvanmarle
    andrewvanmarle Posts: 971 Critical Contributor
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    @brigby

    The trick will be to adjust him with a light touch.

    an option would be to have him disable himself at etb so he'll be on the board for a turn before anything happens.

    another option is to think of cards affecting affected by baral. We could do with more cards like Kambal, scab clan etc. and Imprisoned in the moon is actauuly the worst offender of the 3 mana spells. It was always too cheap, baral just shows how. make it a 4 mana even and the worst taken care of.


    An adjustmeant is fine. A nerf will result in me and many others asking for a refund.
  • Irrbloss
    Irrbloss Posts: 2
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    Volrak wrote:
    losdamianos wrote:
    I do undestand how difficult this situation is from D3 perspective but if this nerf will actually happen can we get an asterix in any future paid cards and disclaimer that actual abilities may change under the pressure of community.
    There will be dozens of refund request too, just saying... Lets see what compensation we can expect....
    They don't need an asterix when you've already agreed to this as a condition of use:
    We can manage, regulate, control, modify or eliminate virtual currency and/or virtual goods, including the price thereof, at our discretion, and will have no liability to you or any third party for any of such actions.
    See what else you've agreed to here: https://d3publisherofamerica.zendesk.co ... rms-of-Use

    That might be so, but for large parts of the world that's not worth the electronic paper it's printed on. ToSs are not legally valid documents in several markets that the game is active in as well as being in direct conflict with consumer law in those same markets. They can print whatever they want in them, but it won't stop customers demanding and getting refunds.
  • kauppila
    kauppila Posts: 48 Just Dropped In
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    Being one of those people who did invest in Baral, I would be displeased if the card was crippled.

    It's a Mythic and a reasonably hard one to get, but it does affect the game play so much when it is in play.
    Agree with a previous poster that a light touch is needed to balance power/game play.

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