*** Magneto (Classic) ***

Raffoon

So, after some further playtesting, the upside is that his yellow kind of counters Sentry to some degree. The downside is that his red is pretty much only useful once per match and only situationally does anything approaching decent damage, his colors no longer fit where they used to, he no longer synergizes with strike tiles, he no longer generates any kind of AP, and despite his massive reduction in offensive power, he still sits at 6800 HP so he's a flimsy target.

Overall, it still feels like a completely different character and a giant middle finger from the devs.

NorthernPolarity

Just to confirm, level 5 yellow will NOT prioritize enemy countdown tiles over normal tiles correct? It's completely random whether or not it will target the ones on the board?

john1620b

It's completely random. It won't target any of your own special tiles, or TU tiles, but it won't prioritize any enemy special tiles (which is why I think 5 in yellow is rather useless).

NorthernPolarity

john1620b wrote:

It's completely random. It won't target any of your own special tiles, or TU tiles, but it won't prioritize any enemy special tiles (which is why I think 5 in yellow is rather useless).

Phaser brought up that it might be worth going if your primary pairing is Patchneto since 5 yellow does mitigate zerker rage a lot better than 3 yellow does, or against consistent strike tile users like Daken. 3/5/5 seems better otherwise though, which I think? will be the more common use case.

john1620b

NorthernPolarity wrote:

Phaser brought up that it might be worth going if your primary pairing is Patchneto since 5 yellow does mitigate zerker rage a lot better than 3 yellow does, or against consistent strike tile users like Daken. 3/5/5 seems better otherwise though, which I think? will be the more common use case.

Yeah, that's true. Phaser's analysis is pretty good, and I can see his logic. I just tend to prioritize damage skills over protection ones -- damage skills result in matches ending quicker, which seems to save more health than the protection in a match does.

To be fair, I also use a 3/5/5 Patch, so it's not as relevant for me. The 5/3/5 suicidal Patch lovers may still love the Patchneto combo, but I think all y'all are crazy.

Mawtful

Thanks Phantron and Phaserhawk, good analysis of the skills.

My Mags has alwasy been less than fully covered (5/2/3), so I never really abused Patchneto to the fullest extent. That said, I'm enjoying the new Patchneto now that Mags can use the yellow that Patch collects.

over_clocked

I respecced from 553 (max utility and asspulls for old Magneto) to 454 and will be moving to 355.
Defensive skills suck unless they also propel offense (like AP steal or damage stuns). Yellow is very nice for a protect tile ability, better than Bird Strike, Defense Grid or Adamantium Bones for sure, but it's random, and faster damage output is the best defense anyhoo.
Awesome analysis though, Phaser, much appreciated as usual.

Unknown

Raffoon wrote:

So, after some further playtesting, the upside is that his yellow kind of counters Sentry to some degree. The downside is that his red is pretty much only useful once per match and only situationally does anything approaching decent damage, his colors no longer fit where they used to, he no longer synergizes with strike tiles, he no longer generates any kind of AP, and despite his massive reduction in offensive power, he still sits at 6800 HP so he's a flimsy target.

Overall, it still feels like a completely different character and a giant middle finger from the devs.

So teamed with xforce he gives strongish attacks on 2 of xforces off colours and then the choice of save damage to all rather than heal to one. I would rather use Shieldbro to achieve this or hulk to supply the green but cmags is not useless. He is no longer god status but they havent made the choice of whether to sell him or not an easy one
Not only this but my forum chat on line has been about teams that people would not have previously considered so it is working to balance out character base (controversial statement???). I know some will say "but im only seing sentry hood x combo at the top end" but this is before new teams are play tested and people find a team they can use to do well without burning through the health packs like there is no tomorrow.
Its naive to say its a middle finger from the devs, just appreciate they cant please everyone.

Unknown

I disagree. He is still good. No way as good as he was, but still pretty good.

Unknown

dolfanpescao wrote:

NighteyesGrisu wrote:

Teno1 wrote:

Adapt and conquer people.

You guys sound like you can't win with out mags.

of course you can win without mags, in fact now it's even easier to....but the point is, instead of broadeing the roster of top-notch characters, they actually decrease it, leaving us with ever less options to get to the point...which makes the whole thing tedious and boring.

Exactly, instead of nerfing all the strong characters they should fix the ones that suck so they become competitive, but no they don't do that, they just keep releasing more useless characters ( beast being the last one) .

Also, how about from now on any new update get released in the week in between seasons instead of mid tourney

I'll i hear is people crying because now they actually have to use the characters in their roster to get to the top instead of just using two and spamming their way for the rewards.

Dayv

He's much stronger on defense now, since his success was based around a human using his powers in an unintended way. I got utterly trashed by an AI Magneto with some lucky cascade AP right after the update.

Phaserhawk

I'm still not sold on my own analysis, lol. There are 3 "best" builds 5/5/3, 3/5/5, 5/3/5 and C.Mags now more than ever is dependent upon his teammates to really determine what build is best. From my playing I have found red to be vastly better than I had ever thought, and is why I switched my original thought to go 5/3/5 to either 5/5/3 or 3/5/5. So that leaves you with my analysis, I in no way shape or form think 5/3/5 is not viable, if you have say Human Torch, the 5/3/5 build is probably stronger since HT's red hits harder.

Here are a few things I have learned about C.Mags so far

-I don't try to match blue, too much to give up
-I don't really cast yellow much, too much damage to give up

This is why red is pretty much a must. The damage, plus the board shakeup and ensuing cascade gets you lots of damage and a fair amount of AP from the cascades. However, to not go 5 in blue really monkey's your damage but to not go 5 yellow hurts Patch combo. However here is now what officially sold me on now thinking 3/5/5 is better. Yeah that's right I switched again.

1.) I was wrong about Fury, you don't want to ever cast Mags yellow because Fury's is far better. However, there will be times where you need a guy down right away and Fury can't do that, but C.Mags can. That was enough to switch me to 3/5/5. I think I was still trying to get a Patchneto combo which 5/5/3 is the best build, but a 3/5/5 would still do okay.

2.) 3/5/5 is actually more defensive against Sentry than 5/5/3. What? I can here you say. Well here's my logical and Phantron or N.Polarity can shred it but I think it's solid. Given this isn't going to really stop Sentry but it has the highest chance of surving short of X-Force.

3 yellow you get 8 tiles but can't overwrite CD tiles
4 yellow you get 9 tiles
5 yellow you get to overwrite CD and get stronger Def

Lets say Sentry gets all 16 CD tiles down. and that all tiles are equal in number the extra goes to say red. Well because Mags can't overwrite TU tiles you have only 55 tiles now to choose from. If Sentry casts World Rupture, if you went 3 you only have 39 tiles to choose from. Now what really kills you on World Rupture? It's the strike tiles, not the skill itself that's gonna kill you and a level 3 Coercive Field will stop all the damage anyway. Now here's what really got me. You now have an 8/39 chance out of removing a strike tile vs a 9/55. In other words Level 3 gives you a 1 out of 5 chance where level 5 gives you a 1 out of 6, not huge but if they have 5 or more strike tiles out you have a very good chance of removing 1. Both stop tile match damage which is the most important. And with X-Force becoming the new bad boy, having Mags available to use both red and blue is not bad.

In short, as long as you build C.Mags with no 4's you have one of the best builds.

Unknown

Teno1 wrote:

dolfanpescao wrote:

NighteyesGrisu wrote:

Teno1 wrote:

Adapt and conquer people.

You guys sound like you can't win with out mags.

of course you can win without mags, in fact now it's even easier to....but the point is, instead of broadeing the roster of top-notch characters, they actually decrease it, leaving us with ever less options to get to the point...which makes the whole thing tedious and boring.

Exactly, instead of nerfing all the strong characters they should fix the ones that suck so they become competitive, but no they don't do that, they just keep releasing more useless characters ( beast being the last one) .

Also, how about from now on any new update get released in the week in between seasons instead of mid tourney

I'll i hear is people crying because now they actually have to use the characters in their roster to get to the top instead of just using two and spamming their way for the rewards.

This wouldn't be a problem if most characters were playable, but they're not, most of them suck.

Phaserhawk

You can still use 5/3/5 Patch with a 5/5/3 Magneto to a similiar effect post nerf. 5 Yellow negates 3 of Patch's strike tiles, and with Patch able to tank red and yellow for C.Mags, he can sit back and create defense while exploding the board with Polarizing Force which is amazing. These two are still very lethal together. The most upsetting thing is switching purple to blue and really hurting the damage. You all but have to go 5 blue if you want to do any decent damage to someone.

wymtime

my vote went 5,5,3 as the best build for me. I still like CMags with Patch and I have Patch with 5 green. with 5 yellow I get 3 things. #1 9 tiles instead of 8 so it is more likely they will cover up some of the pink strike tiles. #2 max protection now that I have given the AI strike tiles CMags yellow can really limit the damage so I can throw down Berserker rage a little earlier. #3 I get the bonus of overwriting CD tiles as a possible counter to Sentry. Against goons becuase the board is not littered with CD so it does not matter.
Now I have to decide 5 in red or 5 in blue. If I am playing PVE and simulator I place Daken with I use Daken's blue instead so red is better. In PVP I also find it easier to match 9 reds than is 10 blue. I priorities green, yellow, red. If Cmags goes down I can continue to build red for TBTI, where blue is now waisted if the buffed character does not have an active blue. Red does a less damage than blue, but with 6 strike tiles out it does do significant damage. I think 5,3,5 might do more overall damage since red will still destroy all TU and cause extra match damage. With 6 strike tiles out 3 in red miggt be better by the numbers.

My playstyle has led me to want 5,5,3 and I will look at the numbers to see if 5,4,4 or 5,3,5 is actually better.

NorthernPolarity

dolfanpescao wrote:

NighteyesGrisu wrote:

Teno1 wrote:

Adapt and conquer people.

You guys sound like you can't win with out mags.

of course you can win without mags, in fact now it's even easier to....but the point is, instead of broadeing the roster of top-notch characters, they actually decrease it, leaving us with ever less options to get to the point...which makes the whole thing tedious and boring.

Exactly, instead of nerfing all the strong characters they should fix the ones that suck so they become competitive, but no they don't do that, they just keep releasing more useless characters ( beast being the last one) .

Also, how about from now on any new update get released in the week in between seasons instead of mid tourney

This line of thinking doesn't make sense. If all the characters were as good as Sentry or pre-nerf C. Mags, everyone would be so overpowered that games would end in 3 turns. Buffing isn't an option when they would need to buff everyone to the level of a character that can end the game so quickly. Recognize that theres a time and place for nerfing overpowered characters, since otherwise this game would devolve to 2 red AP rags days. Of course they should ALSO buff underpowered characters, but that doesn't mean that they can leave clearly OP characters like Sentry / C. Mags alone.

Unknown

Teno1 wrote:

dolfanpescao wrote:

NighteyesGrisu wrote:

Teno1 wrote:

Adapt and conquer people.

You guys sound like you can't win with out mags.

of course you can win without mags, in fact now it's even easier to....but the point is, instead of broadeing the roster of top-notch characters, they actually decrease it, leaving us with ever less options to get to the point...which makes the whole thing tedious and boring.

Exactly, instead of nerfing all the strong characters they should fix the ones that suck so they become competitive, but no they don't do that, they just keep releasing more useless characters ( beast being the last one) .

Also, how about from now on any new update get released in the week in between seasons instead of mid tourney

I'll i hear is people crying because now they actually have to use the characters in their roster to get to the top instead of just using two and spamming their way for the rewards.

Really? I'd love to see you provide a link to anyone really complaining ("crying"?) that Magneto's previously spamable blue ability was changed. I'm pretty confident people knew that was going away.

People are complaining that he's wasn't just nerfed, he's a totally different character. They're also complaining that he lost a purple ability in place of a yellow ability. People are also annoyed that, once again, they've vested time, energy and possibly $$$ into a character that has been nerfed/changed (see Ragnarok, 2* Storm, Spidey, OBW and now Magneto). Perhaps you missed all those posts.

GrimSkald

I have an 11 cover CMags (3/4/4) so he really wasn't OP in the first place (at 7, the blue didn't chain that well, and 3 AP for the red is a huge difference from 2 AP for the red - spammable, but not incredibly so.) I did not sell him back, nor will I - he was my first rare and got me through most of the prologue with 1 or 2 purple covers (fun times, fun times.) This was before I really knew what a 3* was. Seriously, I got him before MNMags...

I've been playing with him a lot lately. I'm in the 2* -> 3* transition, and have, at this point, no 3*s with over 12 covers. His change from purple to yellow didn't really change how well he synergizes with my existing 3* over 100 (HT, Hulk, Hood, and Psylocke,) so there's that as well - I'm sure I'll feel that more keenly in the future.

Anyway, he plays nearly at the same level to me - his blue nuke is easier to get to than his purple (matching purple tiles for very minimal damage kind of sucked,) though it does do less damage. I'm finding the red is very good for board shakeup and clearing TUs - I only used it occassionally before when I needed board-shakeup or some quick damage. The yellow is good for some incidental protection, and the fact that it sometimes overwrites enemy tiles is nice.

I've played a few rounds in the season Simulator with HT, Hood, Magneto and this is a lot of fun. The two red options are actually different enough that you may use one or the other - HT does more raw damage, but Magneto clears out the TUs so the Hood can do some nice stealing. Using Magneto's red also clears a beautifully clear spot for HTs black.

All in all, I'd say he went from a top-tier blaster and board controller to a mid-tier boad-shakeup and blaster. I think they could have done a better job with him (I'm annoyed at the change from purple to yellow as his third color as purple is a gaping hole of a color,) but all in all it could have been a lot worse. It was no Spider-Man nerf, for instance.

Unknown

NorthernPolarity wrote:

dolfanpescao wrote:

NighteyesGrisu wrote:

Teno1 wrote:

Adapt and conquer people.

You guys sound like you can't win with out mags.

of course you can win without mags, in fact now it's even easier to....but the point is, instead of broadeing the roster of top-notch characters, they actually decrease it, leaving us with ever less options to get to the point...which makes the whole thing tedious and boring.

Exactly, instead of nerfing all the strong characters they should fix the ones that suck so they become competitive, but no they don't do that, they just keep releasing more useless characters ( beast being the last one) .

Also, how about from now on any new update get released in the week in between seasons instead of mid tourney

This line of thinking doesn't make sense. If all the characters were as good as Sentry or pre-nerf C. Mags, everyone would be so overpowered that games would end in 3 turns. Buffing isn't an option when they would need to buff everyone to the level of a character that can end the game so quickly. Recognize that theres a time and place for nerfing overpowered characters, since otherwise this game would devolve to 2 red AP rags days. Of course they should ALSO buff underpowered characters, but that doesn't mean that they can leave clearly OP characters like Sentry / C. Mags alone.

I agree that not every character should be so op that they can end a fight in 3 turns , actually no one should do that, I agree that there shouldn't be any power that cost less than 6 tiles ,my cmags was 5/3/5 ............my problem is just nerfing and weakening characters in ways they don't need to, there was nothing wrong with cmags purple attack , there was no need to weaken ldaken tiles in half, I understand the change for him not tanking green anymore, but there was no need to make him weaker and to raise the tiles needed for heat

Wonko33

They should have increased the cost of red to 4 and blue to 7- done, no more spamming and he would still be the same character- Instead we get a totally different character, untested so it will need to be balanced because there is no playtesting/betatesting.