**** Peggy Carter (Captain America) ****

whitecat31

We_are_Venom wrote:

Colognoisseur wrote:

I've had Peggy champed for 48 hours now and have been using her exclusively for everything in MPQ for that time. I have been experimenting with 535 and 355 to try and determine whether it was better to have more red or yellow. In my mind five blue is an automatic five.
What I found was the increase in the enemy needed +3 versus +4 from three to five covers is huge.
I played the same hard nodes in DPvMPQ alternating between 535 and 355. I took way more damage from 535 and hardly any at all from 355. That single little AP means one more turn that poawer can't be fired and one more turn you have to remove a threat.
I am definitely convinced 355 is the best build.

Just curious, but how did you get her champed that fast? How do people do this?

I am not Colognoisseur, but it really does not look that hard. If you won first place in the Peggy Carter PVE (4 covers) and you were in a top 100 PVE alliance (1 cover). You would have gotten 5 covers for Peggy. If you checked the recent cover event "75 years of Cap", you could have spent from 1 to 20 chances at 125 HP each to get a Peggy cover. (For me it was red, and I got her after spending 9 times). So at that rate you can have 6 covers. I could be wrong, but if you won the last PVP event you would have gotten a Peggy cover, and that would be 7 covers. This current PVP has a Peggy Carter reward at 800 points AND 1000 points. This means a total of 9 covers. To get to 13 you would have to buy 4 more covers at 120 Command points each (total 480).
Now if you are like me, and did not win the last PVP or PVE, and just placed tenth in the PVE; you would be sitting at 7 covers (after breaking 1000 points this PVP)
At the beginning of next season, I will most likely turn in all my command points trying to get more Old man Logan covers, and I will hope I get Peggy Carter Covers as a secondary consolidation prize. There is also a good chance next seasons simulator reward for hitting 2000 points will be a Peggy Carter cover, so there is that to consider as well.

Vhailorx

^I don't know that "not that hard" and a series of events that involve finishing 1st in 1k pve bracket, and first in a 500 person PvP bracket belong in the same sentence.

DrLemniscate

This is not power creep. This is D3 pushing their own designed character very hard.

For tinykitty's sake, even her red does 750 damage per AP at lvl 270 and 5 covers, with an upside. IMHB only gets 630 damage per AP, and he is usually the highest since consuming all AP can be a downside.

Polares

Vhailorx wrote:

^I don't know that "not that hard" and a series of events that involve finishing 1st in 1k pve bracket, and first in a 500 person PvP bracket belong in the same sentence.

If you have champed 5s like some players, then it is not that hard... But he probably just bought a couple or three 40 packs. No rocket science there, just some money expenditure...

Vhailorx

Polares wrote:

Vhailorx wrote:

^I don't know that "not that hard" and a series of events that involve finishing 1st in 1k pve bracket, and first in a 500 person PvP bracket belong in the same sentence.

If you have champed 5s like some then it is not that hard... But he probably just bought a couple or three 40 packs. No rocket science there, just some money expenditure...

I don't have any usable 5*s and have never really ever played this game at the top level. So I am jus my speculating, but i think that finishing first in any bracket is hard no matter how strong your roster is.

Sure, champed 5*s are awesomely strong. But I have seen to top of vet bracket leaderboards, and there are usually several rosters with champed 5*s. And in pve, playing at optimal schedule still involves 3ish hours of play a day at specific times. That's not easy to do.

Finishing top 25, or even top 10, with a super-elite roster is probably just a matter of playing enough. But I think finishing first requires a lot of work or a lot of luck entering the right bracket at the right time.

I don't mean to suggest that maxing out new releases is impossible. I just think that players like colog work really hard in game to put themselves in a position to spend some cash to finish building new characters. And describing that as "not that hard" seems a bit dismissive.

simonsez

player name removed ain't the only guy with champed 5*s. From my PvP experience, there are a **** load of people who have them. How are they all supposed to be finish first?

PeterGibbons316

Even with a 5* roster I see potential value in Peggy and worked as hard as I am possibly able to to get her. I had something going on Monday night so I did my final grind about 2 hours earlier than usual and wasn't able to get everything to 1 - I got all green check marks plus 1 more clear on most nodes (everything was under 100, most under 50 IIRC). 2nd sub I played nearly optimally - missed about half a clear due to 48 hour timing and sleep requirements - ground everything to 1 right at sub end. Final sub was the same - ground everything to 1 at sub end. My finish? T50 - one blue cover. I merc'ed into a T100 alliance for a 2nd blue cover. So certainly not an effort that would be described as "not that hard" and didn't even get me that 2nd T20 cover.

But with that said - this IS one of the easiest characters to get covered early in a LONG time. I currently have Peggy at 0/0/4, but have a red and 2 yellow covers waiting. I emptied the DDQ vault - yes, it required being emptied., got the 2 progression rewards in her PvP, got the 75 years of cap token, and also pulled one from a PvP event token. So I'm halfway there already which is much better than most new releases.

OneLastGambit

Vhailorx wrote:

OneLastGambit:

Thanks for the commentary! I do, however, have one quibble with your position. You suggest that Peggy only seems OP to those who rely upon ap-acceleration. That's probably true. 5* match damage will burn down Peggy pretty fast, just like any other 4*. But I think your statement overlooks the reason that so many players are reliant upon ap-acceleration: it's the only reliable way to hit above one's own roster strength in this game. Mpq is built in such a way that speedy offense is always the best tactic, and players that don't get extraordinarily lucky or spend thousands of dollars will always be fighting stronger opponents in pve and PvP.

So while Peggy will *only* be a substantial shift in the meta for teams that need accelerators like if and im40, I would argue that that's a really significant change given the number of players it will affect. Peggy will eventually be a significant obstacle for 3* players and early 4* transitioners looking to build out their 4* bench. That's a much bigger portion of the player base than the 1% with full 5*s who can just burn her down.

Understand what you're saying but blade or laken Paired with fist in the 3* crowd (ignoring the required character in pvp) will get you through Peggy with little fuss. Remember to nullify her biggest threat she doesn't need to be dead just damaged to a max of 70% After that you can leave her alone and focus elsewhere (my climbing strategy for Peggy PvP focused around this tactic)
Luckily for me I have an oml that helped here but just As a test I also tried running 3 and 4* teams against her to see if she basically made them useless and I found the following teams and tactics worked pretty well...

Fist+laken or blade = you're relying on passive tiles here to cause all the damage.
Fist+ falcap or px= again boost that tile and it won't take too long you even have the option of throwing some decent protect tiles in for cover
Punisher max+ laken or blade = permanent boost to your strikes ? Yep that works
3* hulk+ px or mhawkeye= get hulk mad and watch him generate match 5s

You can also say switch and px too but I always find that to be very unreliable for me.

Of the above combos I found that ..
Falcap+fist -- or --- px+fist were the most effective swiftly followed by hulk+px or hulk + mhawkeye.

I beat many many Maxed 3* teams with these teams and quite few 4* teams though we have to remember it was easier beating the 4* teams because my own Peggy slowed them down too. Without Peggy beating 4* teams would be much tougher with a 3* team but I think that can be applied to all 4* not just Peggy.

As such I don't think she is OP hope this helped people.

Orangecrush

OneLastGambit wrote:

Vhailorx wrote:

OneLastGambit:

Thanks for the commentary! I do, however, have one quibble with your position. You suggest that Peggy only seems OP to those who rely upon ap-acceleration. That's probably true. 5* match damage will burn down Peggy pretty fast, just like any other 4*. But I think your statement overlooks the reason that so many players are reliant upon ap-acceleration: it's the only reliable way to hit above one's own roster strength in this game. Mpq is built in such a way that speedy offense is always the best tactic, and players that don't get extraordinarily lucky or spend thousands of dollars will always be fighting stronger opponents in pve and PvP.

So while Peggy will *only* be a substantial shift in the meta for teams that need accelerators like if and im40, I would argue that that's a really significant change given the number of players it will affect. Peggy will eventually be a significant obstacle for 3* players and early 4* transitioners looking to build out their 4* bench. That's a much bigger portion of the player base than the 1% with full 5*s who can just burn her down.

Understand what you're saying but blade or laken Paired with fist in the 3* crowd (ignoring the required character in pvp) will get you through Peggy with little fuss. Remember to nullify her biggest threat she doesn't need to be dead just damaged to a max of 70% After that you can leave her alone and focus elsewhere (my climbing strategy for Peggy PvP focused around this tactic)
Luckily for me I have an oml that helped here but just As a test I also tried running 3 and 4* teams against her to see if she basically made them useless and I found the following teams and tactics worked pretty well...

Fist+laken or blade = you're relying on passive tiles here to cause all the damage.
Fist+ falcap or px= again boost that tile and it won't take too long you even have the option of throwing some decent protect tiles in for cover
Punisher max+ laken or blade = permanent boost to your strikes ? Yep that works
3* hulk+ px or mhawkeye= get hulk mad and watch him generate match 5s

You can also say switch and px too but I always find that to be very unreliable for me.

Of the above combos I found that ..
Falcap+fist -- or --- px+fist were the most effective swiftly followed by hulk+px or hulk + mhawkeye.

I beat many many Maxed 3* teams with these teams and quite few 4* teams though we have to remember it was easier beating the 4* teams because my own Peggy slowed them down too. Without Peggy beating 4* teams would be much tougher with a 3* team but I think that can be applied to all 4* not just Peggy.

As such I don't think she is OP hope this helped people.

Were you playing against a maxed peggy with 5 yellow? Because in her PvP, that is over 20k in damage you have to do before all of your skills don't suck for the ap cost. I honestly can't fathom how anyone who has played this game as long as most of the people here can't see that she is OP as all get out and that her yellow skill is the best skill of any tier. She isn't going to replace your second champ 5* in most PvP events, but I'd consider her as a third in sim over at least 2 of the 5* toons.

Nabistay

When will Peggy be added to the legendary tokens? I plan on opening my (small) hoard then

Quebbster

Nabistay wrote:

When will Peggy be added to the legendary tokens? I plan on opening my (small) hoard then

Most likely at the start of season XXX, so in around 3 weeks.

PeterGibbons316

Orangecrush wrote:

Were you playing against a maxed peggy with 5 yellow? Because in her PvP, that is over 20k in damage you have to do before all of your skills don't suck for the ap cost. I honestly can't fathom how anyone who has played this game as long as most of the people here can't see that she is OP as all get out and that her yellow skill is the best skill of any tier. She isn't going to replace your second champ 5* in most PvP events, but I'd consider her as a third in sim over at least 2 of the 5* toons.

I agree with you in theory, but in practice she isn't quite as OP as you would think in the 5* world.

The most common team I face is a max champed 3* featured character, a 400+ Phoenix, and a 400+ OML. I typically have the same team myself. The standard method of defeating this team is to collect as much purple/red/black/yellow as possible while killing off the featured character with match damage/crits, then if I have enough AP to put some heavy strike tiles out I take out OML, then Phoenix, else I beat on Phoenix until I have enough strikes or can transform and effectively overcome OML's passive heal.

Peggy doesn't change this at all. I'm still spending the first minute of the battle beating on Peggy with match damage until I have enough AP to quickly eliminate OML to minimize how much health he heals over the course of the fight.

I actually fought a couple champed Peggys this event (the first by accident.....didn't realize until I got into battle and noticed she had what? 30k+ health?), and the first one was actually faster than usual. It forced me to make match damage until I had enough AP to pop OML's claws.....with tons of yellow/black/red behind them since I had been saving up for so long.

OneLastGambit

Orangecrush wrote:

OneLastGambit wrote:

Vhailorx wrote:

OneLastGambit:

Thanks for the commentary! I do, however, have one quibble with your position. You suggest that Peggy only seems OP to those who rely upon ap-acceleration. That's probably true. 5* match damage will burn down Peggy pretty fast, just like any other 4*. But I think your statement overlooks the reason that so many players are reliant upon ap-acceleration: it's the only reliable way to hit above one's own roster strength in this game. Mpq is built in such a way that speedy offense is always the best tactic, and players that don't get extraordinarily lucky or spend thousands of dollars will always be fighting stronger opponents in pve and PvP.

So while Peggy will *only* be a substantial shift in the meta for teams that need accelerators like if and im40, I would argue that that's a really significant change given the number of players it will affect. Peggy will eventually be a significant obstacle for 3* players and early 4* transitioners looking to build out their 4* bench. That's a much bigger portion of the player base than the 1% with full 5*s who can just burn her down.

Understand what you're saying but blade or laken Paired with fist in the 3* crowd (ignoring the required character in pvp) will get you through Peggy with little fuss. Remember to nullify her biggest threat she doesn't need to be dead just damaged to a max of 70% After that you can leave her alone and focus elsewhere (my climbing strategy for Peggy PvP focused around this tactic)
Luckily for me I have an oml that helped here but just As a test I also tried running 3 and 4* teams against her to see if she basically made them useless and I found the following teams and tactics worked pretty well...

Fist+laken or blade = you're relying on passive tiles here to cause all the damage.
Fist+ falcap or px= again boost that tile and it won't take too long you even have the option of throwing some decent protect tiles in for cover
Punisher max+ laken or blade = permanent boost to your strikes ? Yep that works
3* hulk+ px or mhawkeye= get hulk mad and watch him generate match 5s

You can also say switch and px too but I always find that to be very unreliable for me.

Of the above combos I found that ..
Falcap+fist -- or --- px+fist were the most effective swiftly followed by hulk+px or hulk + mhawkeye.

I beat many many Maxed 3* teams with these teams and quite few 4* teams though we have to remember it was easier beating the 4* teams because my own Peggy slowed them down too. Without Peggy beating 4* teams would be much tougher with a 3* team but I think that can be applied to all 4* not just Peggy.

As such I don't think she is OP hope this helped people.

Were you playing against a maxed peggy with 5 yellow? Because in her PvP, that is over 20k in damage you have to do before all of your skills don't suck for the ap cost. I honestly can't fathom how anyone who has played this game as long as most of the people here can't see that she is OP as all get out and that her yellow skill is the best skill of any tier. She isn't going to replace your second champ 5* in most PvP events, but I'd consider her as a third in sim over at least 2 of the 5* toons.

No I wasn't but my test is actually more representative and applicable to most players As most players will probably never see a maxed Peggy and those that do will be high end players who will use match damage to beat her anyway. Hence I stand by my original statement though I can understand if people disagree

Polares

OneLastGambit wrote:

No I wasn't but my test is actually more representative and applicable to most players As most players will probably never see a maxed Peggy and those that do will be high end players who will use match damage to beat her anyway. Hence I stand by my original statement though I can understand if people disagree

What do you mean with that? Any player in 3, 4 or 5 land will be able to see teams with maxed Peggy's in a couple of months. Some users even have maxed Peggy's today, so I really don't know what mean with that. Peggys has been the easiest 4 to get in a lot of time, so it might be even faster.

Are you assuming that everybody will have maxed 5s in a couple of months?

Pwuz_

OneLastGambit wrote:

No I wasn't but my test is actually more representative and applicable to most players As most players will probably never see a maxed Peggy and those that do will be high end players who will use match damage to beat her anyway. Hence I stand by my original statement though I can understand if people disagree

I disagree. I started seeing maxed Peggy's (or at least close to) just after 300 points paired with Jean Buster teams.

As someone on the early side of the 3-4* transition, I struggled to even get near 400 points in this event. The only reason I even got that far was from feeding on retaliations from my Bag-Bait team. After a single fight my teams were being shredded.

I was really tempted to push towards that 800 point cover, but I couldn't even manage half that.

Peggy is just another nail in the coffin of my PvP time. At least PvE I can count on reaching progression rewards.

Vhailorx

Pwuz_ wrote:

OneLastGambit wrote:

No I wasn't but my test is actually more representative and applicable to most players As most players will probably never see a maxed Peggy and those that do will be high end players who will use match damage to beat her anyway. Hence I stand by my original statement though I can understand if people disagree

I disagree. I started seeing maxed Peggy's (or at least close to) just after 300 points paired with Jean Buster teams.

As someone on the early side of the 3-4* transition, I struggled to even get near 400 points in this event. The only reason I even got that far was from feeding on retaliations from my Bag-Bait team. After a single fight my teams were being shredded.

I was really tempted to push towards that 800 point cover, but I couldn't even manage half that.

Peggy is just another nail in the coffin of my PvP time. At least PvE I can count on reaching progression rewards.

Damn Pwuz, that's some **** matchmaking!

I have a pretty similar roster to yours (5 4* champs, no leveled 5*s, deep 3* bench) and I don't think I saw more than 1 or 2 peggy's above 1/1/1 all the way up to 1k (in slice 4). Do you often see high level 5* teams (e.g. OML/Phoenix above 400?)?

Once I pass 800 or so, I generally see a lot of whatever 4*s are boosted for the week, or strong 4* + OML (in the 320-380 range). But I rarely see any teams of paired 5*s above level 400. I wonder why we see such different opponents with fairly similar rosters.

BlackSheep101

Same here, I saw nothing more than a 12k health Peggy throughout the event. Mostly just loaners with a handful of folks who accidentally left in their 1 or 2 cover Peg.

OneLastGambit

Polares wrote:

OneLastGambit wrote:

No I wasn't but my test is actually more representative and applicable to most players As most players will probably never see a maxed Peggy and those that do will be high end players who will use match damage to beat her anyway. Hence I stand by my original statement though I can understand if people disagree

What do you mean with that? Any player in 3, 4 or 5 land will be able to see teams with maxed Peggy's in a couple of months. Some users even have maxed Peggy's today, so I really don't know what mean with that. Peggys has been the easiest 4 to get in a lot of time, so it might be even faster.

Are you assuming that everybody will have maxed 5s in a couple of months?

What I mean is that the majority of players in this game are casual players. There is the temptation (from perusing this forum) to assume that the people in here are representative of the over all player base, however, we are not. I'd take an educated guess that 60% Or more of the player base are casual players who don't use this forum - so I'd say that my statement that most players would never see a maxed Peggy during their troubles.

We've had nova and quake for months now and I still never see maxed one's at all. Not even in SIM and those were two very good releases. I dont expect that trend to change much. The older characters (jg/hb/Bobby/cyke) will still be the only characters most people see at 4* level due to 2 reasons -

1. It takes quite a while to cover a new release.

2. People don't like straying away from the tried and trusted teams even when there are better one's.

Vhailorx

I would guess that most f2p players aren't close to covering nova or quake.

And I think that most people who do spend a bit of money on vaults/packs/LTs and already have nova/quake covered also already have at least 1 5* that they use in PvP instead. Some people may also be struggling to find the iso to champ all the newer releases.

But nova/quake/pun are all very good 4*s and they will starting showing up more often (when boosted) once they reach 9-12 months old.

(hear that demiurge? Think there might be a problem when all your shiny new toys are both i. Obsolete the moment that are released because of 5*s, and ii. Not usable for 6-9 months after their release without spending a ton of cash? Given the release rate, it should take no more than 1-2 months for competitive players to get new releases up to 10+ covers. There should be enough iso to level all 4*s up to 230 or so without much tepuble over that same amount of time).

Blahahah

aesthetocyst wrote:

The Hulk (Totally Awesome)

Mastermind Excello - 12 AP ... Level 5: 4114 damage / 180 bonus per Blue AP ... potential 792.8 dmg/AP ... That's up to 1.26 HBREUs!

.

^ This is even funnier than Pokemon Go memes