NorthernPolarity wrote: Yeah, shes not bad in that team comp but she still just seems like an inferior torch (flame jets being green is huge since you get daken tiles and a tile outlet all in green, red is comparable in power if not better, black is worse but still an option) in that position. She reminds me of punisher where shes fine if you transition into 3* land, but once you have a developed roster, she gets obsoleted pretty quickly.
Phantron wrote: I don't know why people keep on try to justify Psylocke being good. If you want to do anything cute with Daken you're better off running Falcon instead, and Daken and Psylocke can never show up on the same heroic since heroic roster do not include DAs. For builds the difference between 5/3/5 and anything else is pretty much pretty much sucks (5/3/5) or totally sucks. The extra damage done by red at level 5 is usually meaningless because Psychic Knife is extremely expensive to use on her own, and the extra attack tile damage on Psi-Katana level 5 usually doesn't matter much because Psi-Katana, ironically, is a pretty hard hitting move that does most of the damage through the initial damage. Of course Bewilderment probably sucks a bit more than the other two skills but the difference is small. In this recent heroic event you'd never use the red to begin with (Fireball is much better), and Inferno is generally better sustained damage than Psi-Katana and if you need an extra quick hit to take someone down you don't care about the sustained damage to begin with. Yes Psylocke/Falcon is probably borderline playable because Falcon is godlike in PvE, but a level 40 Daken with 5 in Phermone Rage and nothing else would still be way better than a 5/5/5 level 166 Psylocke if you want to bring Falcon. I guess you can hope for Falcon and Psylocke to both show up on a heroic roster, but so far the two appearances of Falcon on heroic roster had no usable 3* special tile user with him and I think this is done on purpose.
Lerysh wrote: Everyone is good when you throw that much AP at them. The key to Psylocke is she is fast. Her powers cost 8 and 6 which can come down to 5 and 6 eventually. Fast high DPS characters will tear glass cannons to shreds. Bullseye, see ya, Yelena, sit down, Moonstone, fuggedaboutit. Fast high DPS characters run into problems taking on high health characters, double problematic when said high health characters have AP feeders to their Onslaught of doom or are Sentry and his low cost powers. There I would much rather have the damage up front from Torch. 8 activation is a minimum of 3 turns to achieve, and 3 turns can murder you when Ares gets 6 free and Sentry has World Rupture out. Given the limited roster event you have both options anyway right now, but under normal circumstances I will take HT over Psylocke.
NorthernPolarity wrote: Phantron wrote: I don't know why people keep on try to justify Psylocke being good. If you want to do anything cute with Daken you're better off running Falcon instead, and Daken and Psylocke can never show up on the same heroic since heroic roster do not include DAs. For builds the difference between 5/3/5 and anything else is pretty much pretty much sucks (5/3/5) or totally sucks. The extra damage done by red at level 5 is usually meaningless because Psychic Knife is extremely expensive to use on her own, and the extra attack tile damage on Psi-Katana level 5 usually doesn't matter much because Psi-Katana, ironically, is a pretty hard hitting move that does most of the damage through the initial damage. Of course Bewilderment probably sucks a bit more than the other two skills but the difference is small. In this recent heroic event you'd never use the red to begin with (Fireball is much better), and Inferno is generally better sustained damage than Psi-Katana and if you need an extra quick hit to take someone down you don't care about the sustained damage to begin with. Yes Psylocke/Falcon is probably borderline playable because Falcon is godlike in PvE, but a level 40 Daken with 5 in Phermone Rage and nothing else would still be way better than a 5/5/5 level 166 Psylocke if you want to bring Falcon. I guess you can hope for Falcon and Psylocke to both show up on a heroic roster, but so far the two appearances of Falcon on heroic roster had no usable 3* special tile user with him and I think this is done on purpose. I found that major boosted Psylocke is better than Torch by a wide margin in the current heroic (given X/X/1 IM40). My 210 Psylocke does 1.5k damage and puts out a 289 strike tile, which means I need ~ 8 instances of damage with the strike tile on board before it starts to overtake my minor boosted 166 Torch's fireball (the numbers probably look better on a max level Psylocke, does anyone have that in the PvE?). 8 instances of damage is pretty easy to do considering black activation is 1, and the attack tile gives you an extra instance per turn. My go-to strategy for the hard nodes is Psy / Torch / 1/0/1 IM40: go in with ry/gb boosts, match a yellow, recharge, match a black, and proceed to get extremely quick knifes / katanas with some flame jet support. This just wouldn't be possible without Psylocke: Torch's black is a good amount worse as a replacement for Katana: the fact that it costs 3 match-3s even after you go in boosted compared to the ONE of Psylocke means that you're not firing off the ability until on average 5/6 turns later, at which point hey, looks like you got the extra 5-6 instances of damage needed to make Psylocke's red better than Torch red. I will admit that this strategy hinges on being able to get Psylocke's red out early so that you can start stacking damage instances, which is what IM40 is for. So given this extremely situational event and conditions (limited roster, IM40, major boosted), she can be good...?
Phantron wrote: NorthernPolarity wrote: Phantron wrote: I don't know why people keep on try to justify Psylocke being good. If you want to do anything cute with Daken you're better off running Falcon instead, and Daken and Psylocke can never show up on the same heroic since heroic roster do not include DAs. For builds the difference between 5/3/5 and anything else is pretty much pretty much sucks (5/3/5) or totally sucks. The extra damage done by red at level 5 is usually meaningless because Psychic Knife is extremely expensive to use on her own, and the extra attack tile damage on Psi-Katana level 5 usually doesn't matter much because Psi-Katana, ironically, is a pretty hard hitting move that does most of the damage through the initial damage. Of course Bewilderment probably sucks a bit more than the other two skills but the difference is small. In this recent heroic event you'd never use the red to begin with (Fireball is much better), and Inferno is generally better sustained damage than Psi-Katana and if you need an extra quick hit to take someone down you don't care about the sustained damage to begin with. Yes Psylocke/Falcon is probably borderline playable because Falcon is godlike in PvE, but a level 40 Daken with 5 in Phermone Rage and nothing else would still be way better than a 5/5/5 level 166 Psylocke if you want to bring Falcon. I guess you can hope for Falcon and Psylocke to both show up on a heroic roster, but so far the two appearances of Falcon on heroic roster had no usable 3* special tile user with him and I think this is done on purpose. I found that major boosted Psylocke is better than Torch by a wide margin in the current heroic (given X/X/1 IM40). My 210 Psylocke does 1.5k damage and puts out a 289 strike tile, which means I need ~ 8 instances of damage with the strike tile on board before it starts to overtake my minor boosted 166 Torch's fireball (the numbers probably look better on a max level Psylocke, does anyone have that in the PvE?). 8 instances of damage is pretty easy to do considering black activation is 1, and the attack tile gives you an extra instance per turn. My go-to strategy for the hard nodes is Psy / Torch / 1/0/1 IM40: go in with ry/gb boosts, match a yellow, recharge, match a black, and proceed to get extremely quick knifes / katanas with some flame jet support. This just wouldn't be possible without Psylocke: Torch's black is a good amount worse as a replacement for Katana: the fact that it costs 3 match-3s even after you go in boosted compared to the ONE of Psylocke means that you're not firing off the ability until on average 5/6 turns later, at which point hey, looks like you got the extra 5-6 instances of damage needed to make Psylocke's red better than Torch red. I will admit that this strategy hinges on being able to get Psylocke's red out early so that you can start stacking damage instances, which is what IM40 is for. So given this extremely situational event and conditions (limited roster, IM40, major boosted), she can be good...? I forgot my Psylocke isn't maxed but she's still higher level than HT with the major boost and I was evaluating the character as if they're equal in level. But Fireball is effectively 6 AP while Psychic Knife is 8/7/6. There's also the problem that in this event you usually need to kill Daken from 100% to 0% so piling up extra strike tile damage doesn't help you much against Daken's regen. If you can do 2 Psychic Knives you also do 2 Fireballs and that'll do about 8000 damage straight up, which should always be enough to kill Daken, while Daken can last a while with his regen against 2 strike tiles from Psychic Knife and of course if he somehow destroyed them then you've wasted your AP for nothing. Psi-Katana is decent and probably better than Inferno because it's easy to forget what tiles cannot be converted by Inferno, but if you get 8 of them out it'll always easily beat Psi-Katana.
LoreNYC wrote: I've messed around with torch and psylock maxed in this heroic and quite frankly psylock is infinitely better because of speed. The sustained damage burst damage and obw purple make her much much faster. This character should probably be Thor or storm if you don't have im40 with 1 yellow however. I might add she's also better on the required nodes because, well, she's required
scottee wrote: If you're comparing two Psychic Knives, you're doing it wrong. One Psychic Knives and one Psi Katana are far better and easier to collect the AP for, both from being slightly cheaper and from being two different colors. People still don't understand how to play her, but that's ok, I'll just keep to myself and keep murdering the Heroic.
Phantron wrote: IM40's Recharge benefits Fireball as well so I don't see his presence changes anything. The expected damage of Psychic Knife is slightly higher than Fireball but 'on average' doesn't work well against The Hood or Daken who are likely the strongest opponents in the DA lineup. Against Daken the lower level version (low 100s, 4K range HP) can usually be killed by a Fireball plus a good match chain, or Fireball plus attack tile from Psi Katana. He will definitely always die to a Fireball + Psi-Katana. Psylocke, on the other hand, needs 2 Psychic Knives and maybe even something extra. The higher level Daken has around 8000 HP, which can be killed by 2 Fireballs but 2 Psychic Knives won't make much of a dent on his HP and yes you have some pretty good strike tiles on but you better hope they don't get destroyed because then Daken is just going to leisurely heal back up. On the other hand against The Hood you really need him dead ASAP and Fireball is much better at getting things dead now as opposed to later. If there's a dangerous color pump goon (usually Analyst in this event) again Fireball does the job at getting rid of the low HP Analysts as fast as possible. Psychic Knife is better if the goons are Maggia (they all have a ton of HP so bursting down with Fireball is rarely an option) and the villians do not contain Daken or The Hood, though I find nodes that qualify this tend to be easier. You'd have to have something like Juggernaut + Sentry + (not Daken not The Hood not Analyst not Soldier), and D3 seems to always remember to include one of those guys to with those 2.
Phantron wrote: I don't think a character should be balanced around always boosting and always have certain gimmick support character (X/X/1 IM40) because that clearly isn't something you commonly see used for a good reason. You need 15 red AP to do 2 Psychic Knives, and when you're in that range you can be just do double Fireballs or a Star Spangled Avenger, and you're not beating that in burst damage in the former or sustained damage in the latter and both characters bring more to the table than Psylocke. Yes in this particular event you can't use Captain America so you have to improvise but in general there are much stronger characters for sustained damage than Psylocke. I do find that in this event, if you don't boost, you often end up with a situation where someone like Hood or Bullseye is sitting at 2K HP when you finally got 8 red AP, so using a Fireball (4K damage) would be overkill but you don't really want to just Fireball another guy instead, so you might as well use Psychic Knife for the sustained damage even though it takes one turn longer to kill him this way. However with boosts you'd just leave guy you want to kill quickly at 4K HP and then immediately Fireball him when you have enough. It's only when you're not quite sure when you'll get your AP this scenario comes into play.
NorthernPolarity wrote: Also, does anyone have the stats for Psy's red/black in the PvE at max level? My analysis is all based off of a 135 Psylocke, I'd imagine a 166 Psylocke boosted has her abilities even more beefed up.
kalirion wrote: LoreNYC wrote: I've messed around with torch and psylock maxed in this heroic and quite frankly psylock is infinitely better because of speed. The sustained damage burst damage and obw purple make her much much faster. This character should probably be Thor or storm if you don't have im40 with 1 yellow however. I might add she's also better on the required nodes because, well, she's required Not really a fair comparison because Psylocke has the big boost in the current event, compared to torch's little one.