*** Daredevil (Man Without Fear) ***

OnesOwnGrief

Nellyson wrote:

So I was playing with The Devils today and I thought he's almost a useful character now. He just needs one more thing changed. What they really need to do is have his other two powers be able to be placed on two colors. That way you still know kinda were it is. For instance, the crotchkick could go on a random red or green tile. Then the billy club to the face could go on either a blue or black/purple. That would still make him a random placement person which is annoying, but in turn would actually make him a very playable person! And on defense he would be pretty damn cool! Could you imaging the fright of matching a red or green wondering if it'll bring you death??? Plus, you could probably nerf the damage cause of the possibilites for more tiles. Anywyas, just my thought because it's a shame that he isn't a more useful character right now.

Have you never used Hulk or Thor with Daredevil before?

Nellyson

OnesOwnGrief wrote:

Nellyson wrote:

So I was playing with The Devils today and I thought he's almost a useful character now. He just needs one more thing changed. What they really need to do is have his other two powers be able to be placed on two colors. That way you still know kinda were it is. For instance, the crotchkick could go on a random red or green tile. Then the billy club to the face could go on either a blue or black/purple. That would still make him a random placement person which is annoying, but in turn would actually make him a very playable person! And on defense he would be pretty damn cool! Could you imaging the fright of matching a red or green wondering if it'll bring you death??? Plus, you could probably nerf the damage cause of the possibilites for more tiles. Anywyas, just my thought because it's a shame that he isn't a more useful character right now.

Have you never used Hulk or Thor with Daredevil before?

No I have. Just with Hulk he always seems to smash my tiles and make them disarmed. And my Thor isn't quite power enough yet to make him a good teammate. But I was just saying Daredevil could be quite frightening if the ambush was placed on a random green or red tile. That way on defense he'd be much better and on offense he could be viable.

babinro

DD is a REALLY fun character to play as but needs a push to be somewhat competitive. I'd love to see the following changes made to how his strike tiles work.

1) When a tile explosion ability destroys a trap tile then that tile is now triggered rather than disabled. (Abilities like Punisher Green and Hulk Green now trigger traps)
2) When a trap tile would be targeted by a strike tile, protect tile, or countdown tile it now triggers rather than disables. (Abilities such as Daken Purple, Psylocke red, Sentry's Green now all trigger traps)

These changes would make DD a worthy 3 star character and allow him to act as a potential counter to some of the current powerhouses in the game.
This would also give him a use against goons in PvE and accomplish all this without making him or other trap tile generators game breaking.

Unknown

babinro wrote:

DD is a REALLY fun character to play as but needs a push to be somewhat competitive. I'd love to see the following changes made to how his strike tiles work.

1) When a tile explosion ability destroys a trap tile then that tile is now triggered rather than disabled. (Abilities like Punisher Green and Hulk Green now trigger traps)
2) When a trap tile would be targeted by a strike tile, protect tile, or countdown tile it now triggers rather than disables. (Abilities such as Daken Purple, Psylocke red, Sentry's Green now all trigger traps)

These changes would make DD a worthy 3 star character and allow him to act as a potential counter to some of the current powerhouses in the game.
This would also give him a use against goons in PvE and accomplish all this without making him or other trap tile generators game breaking.

That would make him both extremely useful and incredibly overpowered haha.

But it would be a nice change from "most worthless 3 star in the game."

Cabol

They definitely need to do something to make Daredevil relevant more than just a situational cover. If you're facing any 3 random enemies (Thug, Solider, etc), he's useless unless you get lucky with a countdown tile going off near the trap.

Phaserhawk

Cabol wrote:

They definitely need to do something to make Daredevil relevant more than just a situational cover. If you're facing any 3 random enemies (Thug, Solider, etc), he's useless unless you get lucky with a countdown tile going off near the trap.

If they made his red like Fury's blue but obviously a bit less damage, where he generates multiple tiles and if one is triggered they all go off would be nice. In addition if they made all the tiles random he then becomes very playable.

Unknown

Divide his current damage out over 5 tiles and throw out 5 traps, just like Fury, and it wouldn't be a horrid power. Nick Fury is considered one of the best characters, Daredevil one of the worst. Why? Because Daredevil isn't a scattershot (and he doesn't have anything BUT traps, Fury does).

I've just figured out that Daredevil and MNM/GSBW make a great team. Lay down the trap then queue up the trigger. Use Polarity to line up a 4 in a row that hits your trap, AI takes it because the AI ALWAYS takes the 4, and bam, 6000 damage to the face. Hell, because it's almost an insta kill, even a MNM Polarity Team Up is useful.

OnesOwnGrief

Lerysh wrote:

I've just figured out that Daredevil and MNM/GSBW make a great team. Lay down the trap then queue up the trigger. Use Polarity to line up a 4 in a row that hits your trap, AI takes it because the AI ALWAYS takes the 4, and bam, 6000 damage to the face. Hell, because it's almost an insta kill, even a MNM Polarity Team Up is useful.

That's general Daredevil strategy. Best to exploit AI behavior to cause your traps to go off when you want. Also, 5 Red at 166 is an instant kill on anything besides Hulk, Sentry, Thor, She-Hulk. Does more than enough to down them when boosted like this PvP as well.

Unknown

I was just so shocked to find an actual use for Daredevil traps.

Meto5000

So what exactly activates the tiles and what disarms them?

I know powers that generate AP on tile destruction like Lightning Strike and match 4/5 lines will activate the traps. And I know powers that destroy tiles but don't grant AP like Godlike Power and Unstoppable Crush will disarm the traps. I also know that a tile being overwritten with a strike tile will disarm the trap.

But what about powers that just change color? Will Thunderstriking a red trap tile to green which causes a green match activate the trap or disarm it? Will converting a black trap tile to a countdown tile with Anger trigger it or disarm it?

Someone mentioned the following:

OnesOwnGrief wrote:

Anger suicides are the best! Better yet, launch Thunder Strike after Ambush on Hulk and let him Anger. Dead Hulk.

Why does Anger kill Hulk? Is it from the cascades? Anger only turns black tiles into countdown tiles and the crotch kick trap tile is only on red tiles.

I have to imagine half the trouble with Daredevil is that he is so confusing to use properly.

Unknown

I currently have 1100 HP and a new slot is 450. I won 2 DD Covers and am wondering if it is worthwhile to keep him. I've sold at least 3 covers of him off before because I didn't have the roster space.
Will I need him for Essentials? Is he useful anywhere? I don't have a maxed 3* yet so I for sure am not even maxing him, even if I had the Covers. Other Characters have priority there.

The problem as I see with him is that all his abilities are passive in nature. Most of the time they get disarmed or just don't do anything. MPQ is a game that needs you to focus on certain characters and deny/match the right colors.
There are many reasons why all trap abilities are bad but the most important one is that the game FIRST fires off all abilities and THEN matches. What that means is that you could have a DD with all 3 abilities active but you can't kill the Black Panther on the other side that has 400 Health. So you plant some traps but it doesn't matter. Because before the AI will match your trap it will make you eat a Rage of the Panther. And even if it isn't firing off an ability you will take the match damage. Which can be a ton with a couple of Strike Tiles.

DD needs a proactive ability. Something that can help you finish somebody off before they Call the Storm.
In that regard I have a suggestion for the DD abilities. Instead of just placing a trap, he should also give you part of the effect immediately. For the first 2 you could make it 50/50. Steal 3 AP on activation and 3 more when enemy matches it. The second stuns 3 immediately and 3 more when he springs it. The third is a bit tricky because almost 4k damage for 7 Red seems insane. So you would probably have to make it 20% now and 80% on match. But since it's his signature move, maybe it should stay a clean trap.
Now having written that I realize just how much of a glass cannon they made him. They made useless abilities but made up for it by pinning an insane amount of damage on it. People will try to use him to get those 7,7k damage in but after a couple of times of their trap being disabled or not activated at all they will grow frustrated and abandon the character.
My suggestion would help the character tremendously. It would look as follows.

Radar Sense - Purple 11 AP
Daredevil's heightened senses let him strike first(wow thats funny since you need to be hit to activate it), terrifying the enemy. Steals 1 AP from all colors and creates an Environment Trap tile that, when matched by an enemy, steals 1 AP from all colors. If you match the tile, it steals 1 Purple AP and changes locations. Enemies cannot see the tile.
Level Upgrades

Level 2: Steals 1 AP now and 2 on enemy match. Level 3: Steals 2 AP now and 2 on enemy match. Level 4: Steals 2 AP now and 3 on enemy match. Level 5: Steals 3 AP now and 3 on enemy match.

Equalizer - Blue 7 AP
Billy Club in hand, Daredevil prowls the battlefield, waiting to even the odds. Stuns for 1 Turn, then creates a Blue trap tile that, when matched by an enemy, stuns for 1 turns. if you match the tile, it generates 1 Blue AP and changes locations. Enemies cannot see the tile.
Level Upgrades

Level 2: Stuns for 1 turn now and 2 turns on enemy match. Level 3: Stuns for 2 turns now and 2 turns on enemy match. Level 4: Stuns for 2 turns now and 3 turns on enemy match. Level 5: Stuns for 3 turns now and 3 turns on enemy match.

Ambush - Red 7 AP

This stays as is.



Does that seem reasonable? The first ability would give him a OBW type effect. I have no idea whats going on in the 166 vs 166 matches so you tell me if you think that's fair.

over_clocked

Meto5000 wrote:

So what exactly activates the tiles and what disarms them?

I know powers that generate AP on tile destruction like Lightning Strike and match 4/5 lines will activate the traps. And I know powers that destroy tiles but don't grant AP like Godlike Power and Unstoppable Crush will disarm the traps. I also know that a tile being overwritten with a strike tile will disarm the trap.

But what about powers that just change color? Will Thunderstriking a red trap tile to green which causes a green match activate the trap or disarm it? Will converting a black trap tile to a countdown tile with Anger trigger it or disarm it?

Traps are only activated when _matched_ (including any cascades, 4-, 5-matches). Colour conversion does not destroy traps but status change does (any special tile created over the trap, or the trap tile itself destroyed). That's why Thor and Hulk are often vulnerable against Daredevil, moreso Thor since Thor doesn't have any special tiles or tile-destroying abilities. Hulk can change the colour of the trap with Anger and then have green cascades with the now-green trap tile. It was even pointed out to me in my counter guide:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7122&p=200702&hilit=counters#p193103

Unknown

Meto5000 wrote:

So what exactly activates the tiles and what disarms them?

I know powers that generate AP on tile destruction like Lightning Strike and match 4/5 lines will activate the traps. And I know powers that destroy tiles but don't grant AP like Godlike Power and Unstoppable Crush will disarm the traps. I also know that a tile being overwritten with a strike tile will disarm the trap.

But what about powers that just change color? Will Thunderstriking a red trap tile to green which causes a green match activate the trap or disarm it? Will converting a black trap tile to a countdown tile with Anger trigger it or disarm it?

Someone mentioned the following:

OnesOwnGrief wrote:

Anger suicides are the best! Better yet, launch Thunder Strike after Ambush on Hulk and let him Anger. Dead Hulk.

Why does Anger kill Hulk? Is it from the cascades? Anger only turns black tiles into countdown tiles and the crotch kick trap tile is only on red tiles.

I have to imagine half the trouble with Daredevil is that he is so confusing to use properly.

Changing the color of a trap does not disarm it. Ambush->Thunderstrike->Anger typically means your Ambush went off because the board is totally green, and you did enough damage to 1 shot hulk and now the board is nice and green for you to mop up with Call The Storm.

Meto5000

So using thunder strike when there are enemy trap tiles out sounds pretty dangerous.

Unknown

Yep. It's a fast way to get crotch kicked.

gambl0r312

Meto5000 wrote:

So using thunder strike when there are enemy trap tiles out sounds pretty dangerous.

But it also sounds like a GOOD way to bait the AI into a trap that you've laid (and now changed color), especially if it now is a 4-match in waiting. Just leave it for the AI, since they always go for 4-of a kinds no matter what color, and let the crotch kick take care of the rest.

delita007

I could think of a minimal tweak that would make DD close to actually useful. When you match his trap tiles instead of doing something minuscule and relocating, it should do a portion of what the enemy match would trigger than relocate. Then you could use him against goons, and you don't have to hope an enemy stumbles into your trap to get any affect. It would bring some interesting strategy into play too. Say there's a red trap sitting ready to be matched and its your turn, do you match it for half damage and send it somewhere else where it can hopefully be matched again, or do you leave it for the opponent to match and do more damage but disarm it permanently. He could even become a useful stun character if say every time you matched the blue tile the opponent was stunned for 2 turns and moved, but if they matched it they were stunned for 6. Purple could be like a souped up Hood. If you match steal 2 from each color, If they match steal 6 from each color. I like this and I really think I could play DD with these powers. He's a little support and a little damage rolled into one character.

Unknown

The ALL traps mechanic just doesn't work well for Daredevil (see Nick Fury's blue for how they really should work!!!)

Ambush should be more like Fury's setting 2 or 3 traps on RANDOM colors with reasonable damage caused to the enemy if you trigger it, forget the 1 ap steal and trap resets

Radar Sense SOUNDS like it would have been an awesome version of Modern Hawkeye's Avoid skill, though I'd put it as a blue passive instead of purple: dodging if enough blue tiles are on the board or blue AP held. This would be a great pairing with true healers, Hulk or Captain Marvel.

Equalizer actually SOUNDS like a better name for his AP steal which should work instantly like black widow. He's not a super spy but as a lawyer he does have access to various channels of information so something like 9AP to steal 2 of each color would be fair, especially if TU AP is included and considering his health.

He'd be mid tier for sure, compatible with many and hard to target unless you deny blue

I really hope they buff him coz I enjoy playing with him to overwrite memories of Ben Affleck portraying him in film LOL

Unknown

Why. Can't. We. Target. Traps.

It's not like it's called "blind grenade". Not that a trap is something that Daredevil would use much anyway, but spending a color only to see the trap park itself in a corner and be forgotten for all time is straight up depressing. Just let us place it somewhere it'll probably actually be matched. Jesus.

hurcules

ark123 wrote:

Why. Can't. We. Target. Traps.

A blind lawyer who can't set his trap wherever he wishes actually sounds more logical than the best Avenger marksman who couldn't place his countdown tile wherever he wishes.