*** Cyclops (Uncanny X-Men) ***

Unknown

Jury's still out on the powers, but at least the animations are pretty nice. Sounds too. I like the sweep on Optic Blast, and Full Blast with the requisite red on board feels like something you wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of.

CrookedKnight

It's a shame MPQ doesn't use recorded lines for moves other than grunts and yells, because Full Blast is crying out for a "BEHOLD!!"

IceIX

Updated OP with full stats.

Der_Lex

At first glance, I'd say 5/3/5 would be the way to go. I don't think those two additional red tiles are worth the big drop-off in damage when red or black are less than 5. Plus, slightly lower chance of not getting too many matches so you can keep enough red on the board for the extra damage from black. That should combine nicely with Blade's passive too. Cyclops-Daken-Blade could be a pretty nice team.

CrookedKnight

Yeah, that's my first thought as well. If yellow got to 9 tiles, or just converted all of them, it'd be a tougher call, but gaining two extra doesn't seem like it would be worth the steep drop in effectiveness on red or black. Maybe there's a big jump in average cascades from the two extra converted tiles, but I'll leave that to the stat-heads to figure out (and if there is, I'll reevaluate; not like I'll be in a position to choose a build for quite a while anyway).

Unknown

Agree on 5/3/5. The only reason I wouldn't go that way is if you intend to use him in a way that means you rarely use red or black. If yellow converted all team-up tiles at level 5 it'd be a tougher decision.

turul

Cascade chances for mutant rev:

cover 3 / 4 / 5 : 53% / 60% / 64%
AP gained: 4.2 / 5 / 5.8

if all TU would be converted: 72 % (8 AP gained)

Mikaveus

With Cyclops debuting, does anyone have an idea how long before his covers are included in token draws and the like?

I know characters get pulled out of circulation to be worked on by D3P, but what of new characters that debut during a season?

CrookedKnight

New characters get added to tokens on the first day of the next season after they debut. So Cyclops will enter the pool when Season 12 starts in March.

Unknown

turul wrote:

Cascade chances for mutant rev:

cover 3 / 4 / 5 : 53% / 60% / 64%
AP gained: 4.2 / 5 / 5.8

if all TU would be converted: 72 % (8 AP gained)

That cements 5/3/5 to me. The increase from 3 to 5 just isn't high enough in yellow to justify limiting either of his other two powers that much.

Phaserhawk

turul wrote:

Cascade chances for mutant rev:

cover 3 / 4 / 5 : 53% / 60% / 64%
AP gained: 4.2 / 5 / 5.8

if all TU would be converted: 72 % (8 AP gained)

Those numbers seem low for a tile conversion skill. If it was destruction I think they are spot on

GrumpySmurf1002

So I underestimated his red and overestimated the black. Back to the drawing board. Base to max does increase by ~1.725% per level, so that math held at least.

I concur on 5/3/5. May as well take all the damage you can get. Worth noting the AI will at least use this one well. If both yellow/black are charged, it'll convert the red tiles before launching Full Blast, greatly increasing chances of getting whacked for 8k

Phaserhawk

What's intersting though is you probably wouldn't have wanted too good of a yellow, because it would have increased red matching cascades, which would have depleted the board of red (in theory) thus having less for black to use.

In the end it looks like a maxed yellow makes a red 10% better but black would be 50% worse.

Cyclops + Marvel = scary damage

CrookedKnight

Yeah, one of the reasons I'm perfectly fine with 5/3/5 is that yellow serves a purpose even if it doesn't start a big cascade. It's never going to be a throwaway skill that you put three covers into just so he can get to 166 and never use.

Unknown

5 Yellow is a must.

It fuels red and fuels the black to make sure enough red is on the board to take the visor off.

The question is 5 black or 5 red?

Also, why do all the good black abilities seem to cost so much? Why can't Colossus Fast Ball or Cyclops black be 12 ap?

turul

Phaserhawk wrote:

turul wrote:

Cascade chances for mutant rev:

cover 3 / 4 / 5 : 53% / 60% / 64%
AP gained: 4.2 / 5 / 5.8

if all TU would be converted: 72 % (8 AP gained)

Those numbers seem low for a tile conversion skill. If it was destruction I think they are spot on

Polarity's statistics has data for similar conversion here (Doom: black to blue), numbers are almost the same. (my numbers are less precise because of smaller sample usage)

CrookedKnight

Disagree. Five yellow means a bigger chance of cascade, which means potentially less red on the board when all is said and done. You get 2 more red tiles added to the board but also a 20% increase in the chance that three or more will be matched away. 5 yellow is better as a red generator but as an enabler for his black my knee-jerk assessment is that it's a wash.

Unknown

CrookedKnight wrote:

Disagree. Five yellow means a bigger chance of cascade, which means potentially less red on the board when all is said and done. You get 2 more red tiles added to the board but also a 20% increase in the chance that three or more will be matched away. 5 yellow is better as a red generator but as an enabler for his black my knee-jerk assessment is that it's a wash.

That's the problem. You have to save and/or have all that red on the board for black to be good and that's after you collect 13 ap. If there aren't enough red on the board, how many turns do you want to have to wait to use the black for it to be good?

I'm 5/5/3 all the way. That seems to be the best Heroic build which is where I'll probably rely on him the most.

Phaserhawk

turul wrote:

Phaserhawk wrote:

turul wrote:

Cascade chances for mutant rev:

cover 3 / 4 / 5 : 53% / 60% / 64%
AP gained: 4.2 / 5 / 5.8

if all TU would be converted: 72 % (8 AP gained)

Those numbers seem low for a tile conversion skill. If it was destruction I think they are spot on

Polarity's statistics has data for similar conversion here (Doom: black to blue), numbers are almost the same. (my numbers are less precise because of smaller sample usage)

I was looking at Thor when I made that statement, but realized it's not a good comparison because Thor converts any tile not 1 specific which is why he leads to higher cascades, so yeah your numbers are probably about right give or take a %, so 5/3/5 is pretty much the best build.

Unknown

People, yellow feeds red. Yellow makes red ap. Red is more affordable with his yellow ability feeding his red. They're the faster and more versatile abilities.

All that damage from black with red on the board is a mirage.

Odds are better I'll get Cyclops red off twice before you can get of his black with 10+ red on the board once.