**** Invisible Woman (Classic) **** [PRE 2015-04]

Unknown

I think invisibility is more useful as a deterrent on defense. The AI is infinitely patient and doesn't care if he can't hit you for the next 30 minutes somehow, but a human player will quickly get frustrated and give up. Now, it probably won't work well right now since your own AI isn't very smart about protecting the tile, though to be fair I've yet to see anyone use IW to predict what's going to happen. If the AI even tries to protect the yellow tile (not destroying it himself would be a good start), I can imagine the annoyance factor would be enough to discourage any team that doesn't have a direct tile destruction ability to skip you.

Unknown

I think 3/5/5 is the best build. At least she can fight now.

AdamMagus

Here's some feedback on using her at level 140.

I still don't have a roster spot for her on any of my teams, even with these changes.

She won't have a spot on my team until I know what changes they plan to make to the characters on the "Funbalanced" list. As of now I have no problems dealing with any opponent using my main three: Magneto Classic, Wolverine AX and Hulk. Two out of these three characters will get nerfed, I'll have to wait and see if Invisible Woman can fill the void left by Magneto/Wolverine, if at all

I've tried playing around with her on several teams, she just too darn slow and from what we've seen lately this is the path the game is heading towards with all characters

Invisible Woman:
If you want to do some damage with her (Force Field Crush) you need to get some bubbles up first, this requires you to get either 13 blues + 9 greens or 18 greens

Am not crazy about having one ability depending on another or itself in order to do damage, it's not very appealing to me.

Force Bubbles - Level 5
I find that the 8 bubbles from this ability don't stay around for long. I often find that there are 0-1 bubbles left by the time am ready to unleash a second Force Field Crush, there's no point using 9 green AP to blow up one bubble.

Perhaps someone can recommend a better placement for bubbles? I place them like so as I believe this would give me maximum board coverage and no tile destruction overlaps.

X-X-X-| X-X-X-| X-X
X-O-X | X-O-X | X-O
X-X-X | X-X-X-| X-X

X-X-X | X-X-X-| X-X
X-O-X | X-O-X | X-O
X-X-X | X-X-X-| X-X

X-X-X | X-X-X-| X-X
X-O-X | X-O-X | X-X

Force Bubbles places a blue defense tile in a random location after you've placed all 8 bubbles.

With the bubble placement shown above I destroy anywhere from 23.4% to 37.5% of the board. The only safe spot for the defense tile would be at the bottom right but unfortunately you have no control of the placement of the defense tile

– The RNG may decide to place your defense tile within the area of destruction of one of your bubbles, if this happens you have two options:
...o If you decide to use Force Field Crush, pray that the RNG Gods don't crush the bubble near the defense tile, or
...o Don't use Force Field Crush at all

– The RNG may decide to place your defense tile where it matches 3
...o Small chance of happening but when it does it's disappointing

Personally, I guess I can reduce the chances of getting my defense tile blown up by placing my bubbles closer to each other, but having so many bubbles overlapping can also reduce the amount of AP generated and the amount of damage done, seems fair I guess. I guess generating AP, doing decent damage and keeping your defensive tile would be too much, but then again she is a Legendary hero.

Well to continue with my feedback:

There was also mention of the 4*'s really shining once you level them up, but then there's the issue of the cost of leveling them up. The ISO leveling cost keeps escalating and at the rate it's going I think it would take me months to get her from 140 to 240, as of right now to go from 140 to 141 it costs 2348 ISO, am not sure I can justify spending that much ISO on her with her current mechanics.

I find her abilities interesting and I will continue to fiddle around with her to try and make her work well on one of my teams (Magneto NOW, Hulk?).

Am just not sure if either the blue or the green ability needs to be reworked, or perhaps scrapped altogether for a totally new one.

Unknown

Yeah, I don't like her green at all. I'd recommend using it like Punisher's Retribution, i.e. a finishing move, or as a last ditch effort in a sticky situation.

mischiefmaker

AdamMagus, thanks much for your insight -- it's super helpful to hear about actual in-game usage. I hadn't considered that Force Field Crush is very likely to destroy the protect tile, that's a really big drawback on a power that already carries a really nasty drawback (ending the turn).

As for bubble placement, looking over your alignment, your best case is 24 tiles destroyed, but your worst case is 15. Here's an alignment I think might be better:



Hopefully that's not impossible to decipher -- red, blue, yellow, and grey are the squares of destruction for each tile. Where they overlap is color-coded with a combination of the two colors. You can see there are plenty of 3-combinations that don't overlap at all (blue-blue-gray, 3 yellow, red-red-yellow), so the max is still 24, but I don't think you can pick a combination that breaks fewer than 20.

No idea how to remember that alignment when you're actually playing, though.

AdamMagus

mischiefmaker wrote:

AdamMagus, thanks much for your insight -- it's super helpful to hear about actual in-game usage. I hadn't considered that Force Field Crush is very likely to destroy the protect tile, that's a really big drawback on a power that already carries a really nasty drawback (ending the turn).

As for bubble placement, looking over your alignment, your best case is 24 tiles destroyed, but your worst case is 15. Here's an alignment I think might be better:



Hopefully that's not impossible to decipher -- red, blue, yellow, and grey are the squares of destruction for each tile. Where they overlap is color-coded with a combination of the two colors. You can see there are plenty of 3-combinations that don't overlap at all (blue-blue-gray, 3 yellow, red-red-yellow), so the max is still 24, but I don't think you can pick a combination that breaks fewer than 20.

No idea how to remember that alignment when you're actually playing, though.

Thanks for the bubble placement layout Mischiefmaker, it's much better than what I've been using. I need to print that image, it may take a few tries for me to memorize it lol

Unknown

Interesting layout. Could imagine a 2 knights (chess piece) moving, one starting from top-left and one top-right.

Unknown

If the protect tile is created in a new random tile that is not one of the bubbled tiles, what you should do is just put all 8 bubbles around blue tiles. That way it'd be awfully hard to destroy that protect tile no matter what your opponent did. Sure it won't win you any game fast, but it's not like you're using IW to win fast. I imagine this might be pretty overpowered for PvE.

Can the invisibility tile be created inside a tile that's already bubbled? Otherwise you'd have the same strategy if you plan on using invisiblity. Bubble all yellow tiles except for one and it'd be pretty hard for that tile to be destroyed. If not, you can still bubble yellow tiles except the invisibilty tile. There's basically a 1/8 chance any random match 4 will destroy it (8 rows/columns), and that can take a very long time to get, and I'm sure you can reduce the chance of a match 4 on the row/column of the invisibilty tile if you're careful.

Unknown

If you save for 26 Blue APs and place 16 force bubbles, will this mean that it is possible to get yourself without any moves if you place the tile "strategically"? Hopefully Will this trigger a board refresh

Unknown

Yes, the board will reshuffle and you lose some of the bubbles.

azmadu

So when did they change her Invisibility AP cost (Which was totally stupidly high at 23 for lvl 1) down to 18?

Who decided that 23 was a good lvl 1 AP cost in the first place? Before I'd reach 23 (1 more for two thunder strikes for Thor) she'd be toast in any game, even if she's been buffed in recent games.

At least it's a change in the right direction.

AdamMagus

azmadu wrote:

So when did they change her Invisibility AP cost (Which was totally stupidly high at 23 for lvl 1) down to 18?

Who decided that 23 was a good lvl 1 AP cost in the first place? Before I'd reach 23 (1 more for two thunder strikes for Thor) she'd be toast in any game, even if she's been buffed in recent games.

At least it's a change in the right direction.

January 13, see below

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2187

Unknown

They get hurt by the tiles, although it is invisible. The game makes no more fun. Keep it up and you can close your studio. That is the next point of the play makes it impossible

Unknown

Is anyone using Invisible Woman?

Unknown

Bugpop wrote:

Is anyone using Invisible Woman?

Doubtful, very few people have enough covers and levels to make her useful.

Unknown

Bugpop wrote:

Is anyone using Invisible Woman?

I'm using her in Heroic mode because I sold my Astonishing Wolv and I need a green tile matcher for the Gray Widow purple spam that is carrying me slowly though that mode. Ugh

Unknown

I'll certainly use her if someone supplies me with about 200K iso8s and the covers necessary to get her up to be comparable to a level 100 3*.

AdamMagus

Bugpop wrote:

Is anyone using Invisible Woman?

I posted my personal experience using this updated Invisible Woman on page 5 about two weeks ago, I don't find her all that useful

Unknown

I'm sure after Spiderman is nerfed, you can always count on IW to grind you out some painfully slow but safe victories (there are all kinds of tricks you can do with her yellow/blue that basically makes your side impossible to lose).

Unknown

AdamMagus wrote:

Bugpop wrote:

Is anyone using Invisible Woman?

I posted my personal experience using this updated Invisible Woman on page 5 about two weeks ago, I don't find her all that useful

I was specifically asking about now, rather than 5 weeks ago, considering she's in the Oscorp Heroic chapter.