True Healing Discussion (Live 6/25)

Nonce Equitaur 2

Malcoran wrote:

Locked without any explanation...another good job from this tinykitty company.

The company is blameless this time. Unfortunately, explaining a lock in the thread bumps the thread back up to the top, and I didn't want a block of 8 locked threads at the top of the queue. And it would have been extra work. Lazy moderator.

Unknown

Welp, I'm out. Was fun while it lasted. As a steam player, I can play on my terms or not at all. So... at this point, not at all. GGs.

_RiO_

Ben Grimm wrote:

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

Go to With "temporary healing", will you buy more HEALTH PACKS? instead. We don't need 8 similar threads, especially when there is a 230 to 3 voting result to pile on to.

At least the "3" gives us a sense of how many of the devs are voting on threads incognito.

Touchè.

Unknown

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

Breakking wrote:

I created a thread in general discussion called 'If we all agree as a whole..' to hopefully act as a petition for our group opinion on this

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10397#p173699

Go to With "temporary healing", will you buy more HEALTH PACKS? instead. We don't need 8 similar threads, especially when there is a 230 to 3 voting result to pile on to.

_RiO_ wrote:

Breakking wrote:

Nice. A fairly well thought out statement about a major change to most players and it's almost immediately locked.

Well done Nonce

Agreed. That thread should not have been locked.
I wonder if he was pressured into it by 'word from above'...

Nope. A unified thread with a single humongous "99.7% voting against" result is a much stronger message than 8 disparate threads. Also, the title was vague.

So you should merge those threads if theyre adding something new. Poll isnt exactly the same thing as people making statements they wont spend money on this game.

Edit:

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

Malcoran wrote:

Locked without any explanation...another good job from this tinykitty company.

The company is blameless this time. Unfortunately, explaining a lock in the thread bumps the thread back up to the top, and I didn't want a block of 8 locked threads at the top of the queue. And it would have been extra work. Lazy moderator.

Youre moderator on their forum, they gave you responsibility and as moderator youre representing them anyway.

Edit2: Wow, I know moderators arent employees and most of them probably doing this for other peoples only (like me). But you cant deny facts - when moderator is doing his job hes representing D3 here. They gave him rights, theyre taking responsibility for his actions, hes working on official forum.

Unknown

How much can I stress that this KILLS any salvation we players had from a few bad RNG cascades... if i give the game 3 hours of time in my day... and i get screwed in the first 30 minutes by bad random battle outcomes... i'm stuck... the next 2.5 hours of my time will be going to a game that allows me to continue to play it, with dedication and fervor, because they understand how to attract and keep players playing... not throwing up roadblocks on players enjoyment and free-time. 1st rule of business... the customer's always right. You're killing your consumer base DRASTICALLY, and thus your profits. Not hard to see how 1+1=2... not 1 + 'oops, you can't play anymore' = $ 0.00

Tharos

What is even more sad, is that we know what will be happening, it is all clearly stated:
http://almnop.tumblr.com/post/86306274206/handling-balance-changes

This too shall pass – While you need to expect and accept that there will be a backlash and the first couple of days will be painful, give it a few days before you judge the results. In the early days of MPQ, Ragnarok was massively overpowered and the day we changed it players were furious. A week later, it was no longer a topic of widespread conversation.

They will wait for the end of the storm a few days....

Unless this time, the storm goes on

daveomite

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

Breakking wrote:

I created a thread in general discussion called 'If we all agree as a whole..' to hopefully act as a petition for our group opinion on this

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10397#p173699

Go to With "temporary healing", will you buy more HEALTH PACKS? instead. We don't need 8 similar threads, especially when there is a 230 to 3 voting result to pile on to.

_RiO_ wrote:

Breakking wrote:

Nice. A fairly well thought out statement about a major change to most players and it's almost immediately locked.

Well done Nonce

Agreed. That thread should not have been locked.
I wonder if he was pressured into it by 'word from above'...

Nope. A unified thread with a single humongous "99.7% voting against" result is a much stronger message than 8 disparate threads. Also, the title was vague.

IMO... These are two totally different topics, not the same thought process. One is a poll about health packs, the other expanded about much more than that.

If there are 8 theads..who's job is that? Locking that thread, but leaving the more generic poll thread open only addressed one thread out of the apparent 8 that exist.

Unknown

These polls are about as useful as asking someone would they like to have less money on social security and say that people overwhelmingly voted in favor of entitlement programs should stay the way they are.

Unknown

mouser wrote:

Terribly disappointed we had less then 48 hours of "discussion" and this poorly received change was implemented without so much as a real acknowledgement from D3 that the majority of posters here thought it was a bad design decision.

This change was made already? Im at work and have no access to MPQ.

Was there an in-game pop up notification about it or was it a stealth "patch"?

Unknown

Tharos wrote:

What is even more sad, is that we know what will be happening, it is all clearly stated:
http://almnop.tumblr.com/post/86306274206/handling-balance-changes

This too shall pass – While you need to expect and accept that there will be a backlash and the first couple of days will be painful, give it a few days before you judge the results. In the early days of MPQ, Ragnarok was massively overpowered and the day we changed it players were furious. A week later, it was no longer a topic of widespread conversation.

They will wait for the end of the storm a few days....

Unless this time, the storm goes on

Spider-Man will remain our best player???

Unknown

Tharos wrote:

What is even more sad, is that we know what will be happening, it is all clearly stated:
http://almnop.tumblr.com/post/86306274206/handling-balance-changes

This too shall pass – While you need to expect and accept that there will be a backlash and the first couple of days will be painful, give it a few days before you judge the results. In the early days of MPQ, Ragnarok was massively overpowered and the day we changed it players were furious. A week later, it was no longer a topic of widespread conversation.

They will wait for the end of the storm a few days....

Unless this time, the storm goes on

Err, that's just saying your players have no idea what they're talking about (including when they say they'll quit) so you shouldn't listen to them, which is something every dev should know. It's sound advice, until it's wrong. And if you could know when this advice is wrong, you'd be some kind of oracle of gaming, so trying to judge whether any particular instance of this quote in action is futile at best.

Unknown

After playing today I realized that I simply can't do runs in PVP anymore. Without OBW I'll be chewing through my health packs like nothing.

To the guy complaining he can't play for 2 hours. It's a mobile game and you have 5 Health Packs So i assume you can play through 2-3 wipes.

However I won't be able to reach 800 quite that fast anymore. Instead of grinding for like 90 Minutes I will have to space the climb out to several days. Which is kind of a bummer.
The increased healing rates do nothing to alleviate this. It's still weird to me that HealthPacks refresh faster than characters so unless your roster is ridiculously big it makes more sense to use the health packs instead of waiting for them to heal.

I don't hate the change since I wasn't a fan of OBW playing such a huge part in the game but it seems weird that they would remove the healing instead of releasing more healers just so people don't have to rely on widow anymore.

It does change the way the game is played, but I don't know whether for better or worse yet.

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

Tharos wrote:

What is even more sad, is that we know what will be happening, it is all clearly stated:
http://almnop.tumblr.com/post/86306274206/handling-balance-changes

This too shall pass – While you need to expect and accept that there will be a backlash and the first couple of days will be painful, give it a few days before you judge the results. In the early days of MPQ, Ragnarok was massively overpowered and the day we changed it players were furious. A week later, it was no longer a topic of widespread conversation.

They will wait for the end of the storm a few days....

Unless this time, the storm goes on

Err, that's just saying your players have no idea what they're talking about (including when they say they'll quit) so you shouldn't listen to them, which is something every dev should know. It's sound advice, until it's wrong. And if you could know when this advice is wrong, you'd be some kind of oracle of gaming, so trying to judge whether any particular instance of this quote in action is futile at best.

What's funny isn't that he says negative reaction tapers off, it's that he absurdly wrongly claims Bagnarok isn't a frequent topic of conversation and sore feelings

SnowcaTT

Trying lightning rounds again, just to keep trying. 2* roster, with everything maxed (except terrible bagman and bullseye)

WOW, OBW sucks. Yep, that was part of the point.
Wait, now I can't use Sunder for Ares anymore...so that's one less character.

Wouldn't want to use Hawkeye, but can't use him, Thor, or Storm since I'm hoping they can recover enough that I can use them one more time today in PVE. Not that it will matter, since I can't heal it means I can't run instances multiple times, and since I can't run multiple times I can't possibly compete for top 100 rewards.

So that leaves me with...Daken/Wolvy I guess. But wait, I ran them a little bit in Hollowpoint - where this weak team was immediately picked on. Magneto/Cap/Moonstone it has to be I guess. That sounds like lots of fun! Glad I have so many new, exciting options!

killerkoala

PPPlaya wrote:

After playing today I realized that I simply can't do runs in PVP anymore. Without OBW I'll be chewing through my health packs like nothing.

To the guy complaining he can't play for 2 hours. It's a mobile game and you have 5 Health Packs So i assume you can play through 2-3 wipes.

However I won't be able to reach 800 quite that fast anymore. Instead of grinding for like 90 Minutes I will have to space the climb out to several days. Which is kind of a bummer.
The increased healing rates do nothing to alleviate this. It's still weird to me that HealthPacks refresh faster than characters so unless your roster is ridiculously big it makes more sense to use the health packs instead of waiting for them to heal.

I don't hate the change since I wasn't a fan of OBW playing such a huge part in the game but it seems weird that they would remove the healing instead of releasing more healers just so people don't have to rely on widow anymore.

It does change the way the game is played, but I don't know whether for better or worse yet.

They really didn't care about more healers, they cared more about how can we make more "idiots" buy more health packs. pay to win or in this case just compete.

Unknown

SnowcaTT wrote:

Trying lightning rounds again, just to keep trying. 2* roster, with everything maxed (except terrible bagman and bullseye)

WOW, OBW sucks. Yep, that was part of the point.
Wait, now I can't use Sunder for Ares anymore...so that's one less character.

Wouldn't want to use Hawkeye, but can't use him, Thor, or Storm since I'm hoping they can recover enough that I can use them one more time today in PVE. Not that it will matter, since I can't heal it means I can't run instances multiple times, and since I can't run multiple times I can't possibly compete for top 100 rewards.

So that leaves me with...Daken/Wolvy I guess. But wait, I ran them a little bit in Hollowpoint - where this weak team was immediately picked on. Magneto/Cap/Moonstone it has to be I guess. That sounds like lots of fun! Glad I have so many new, exciting options!

This makes me sad, because your roster is much much better than mine.

Unknown

Anyone want my spot? We're a top 50 alliance and now I can't compete. Of course, neither can anyone else who plays on steam, so maybe that'll balance out in the end.

GrumpySmurf1002

SnowcaTT wrote:

Wait, now I can't use Sunder for Ares anymore...so that's one less character.

Sunder's heal is supposed to carry over, according to the OP. Is that not the case?

SnowcaTT

Budget Player Cadet wrote:

Anyone want my spot? We're a top 50 alliance and now I can't compete. Of course, neither can anyone else who plays on steam, so maybe that'll balance out in the end.

I expect a lot of alliances will be looking for a lot of players to replace by the end of the day, and more by the end of the week.

"FreeToPlay" may have quite a few folks clammering to them. Not that they'll be able to out-compete any alliances that will cheat/buy healthpacks instead.

SnowcaTT

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

SnowcaTT wrote:

Wait, now I can't use Sunder for Ares anymore...so that's one less character.

Sunder's heal is supposed to carry over, according to the OP. Is that not the case?

The problem is when you kill them without the heal going off or being matched. Before I could offset that possibility with OBW heal, but so much for that!