True Healing Discussion (Live 6/25)

DD-The-Mighty

Kelbris wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Linkster79 wrote:

IceIX wrote:

Yes, and that was the case. The situation has been handled. There is zero call for post vandalism from anyone, much less someone with moderator privileges.

D3 lost control of their moderators long ago. Threads calling out cheaters being stickied and others threads being left unlocked despite them being in complete violation of the board rules. A message board left to rot by its creators is bound to decend into chaos.

Yea, well, that's what you get when you pick mods from the community based on a popularity contest.

LE EPIC MEME

i believe this is what bitter looks like:
not as bitter as

Snikrot wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GGMN-RoMo4&feature=youtu.be

Thanks for all the good times!

-Emeryt

and apparently so are you. Want to hug it out little buddy?

Unknown

I'm in favour of the change, but a few things need to be done:
1) obw needs an alternative. Not even necessarily a new character--Moonstone, mn.Mags, Bagman, Bullseye, etc. Are potentials.
2) Spidey needs the proper balance change he deserved 6 months ago.

And seriously, where are the Hawkeye and Xforce buffs? Are they even being worked on?

famousfoxking

IceIX wrote:

One of the intentions with this change is to cut down on things like Prologue Healing, which prolongs play time through something that is pretty obviously just a time intensive process that doesn't involve actual strong gameplay. It's something people do because it's there, much like tanking. It's not something that's fun. It's not something that's enjoyable. It's something that exists and is taken advantage of because of pure efficiency.

I would think the better, less destructive way to do that would be to give each character a separate health pool for prologue and the "rest" of the game.

IceIX wrote:

What we intend, and continue to drill in on is that we want players to have a broad mix of characters instead of a Top 3 that is their sole team to play with. In Versus this is a bit rougher of a prospect as players that battle have their last winning team placed on defense. So it's not always the best idea to fight with a less powerful defensive team in order to make up more points. That's something that we're always thinking about. We've discussed allowing players to set a defensive team, but with many other games out with similar versus situations this results in a very precise meta-game where an extremely large percentage of the user base chooses the same defenders. That's not a very fun time for most players.

Okay, does the team plan on answering that before rolling out "true healing"? Because without a solution, I fear that PVP would become fairly impossible for many people. People who are already frustrated by seeing 141/141/212 teams as soon as they've hit a few hundred points (just as an example) often don't have a very deep roster. Also, what you're basically saying above is that you want players with larger roster sizes to be more successful than players with smaller roster sizes. Then how do the less successful players get broader rosters?

Edit: Clearly the answer is "no".

IceIX wrote:

However, in Events, we continually buff different characters, and outside of Heroics, still allow for characters to be used that aren't buffed. What we want players to do is to play with the breadth of their roster instead of using Spider-Man or Black Widow as necessary crutches and only building 3 other characters. This change is intended to result in exactly this as players see that they can't just rely on in-battle healing and look for other ways besides spending Health Packs to continue playing. We want you to keep playing on your own schedule. We want you to play with multiple characters. Doing so keeps players on their toes and making them think of character combinations that they wouldn't otherwise go with if they weren't forced out of their single set of heroes.

And you've said before that people already do that in Events.

Ultimately, if you want to see a wider variety of characters in use during PVP, I'd suggest making some of the characters better. I never see Doctor Doom outside of Doctor's Orders, for example, I wonder why that might be? I'd love to use him as a blue/black/purple complement to Thor, but he's just not viable, partially for that lack of a purple power. I've *tried* to swap my team around in PVP as LThor & OBW get beaten up and I run out of Health Packs and I've regretted it EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. I suppose I could make my climb with MThor then swap him out for LThor when the 2* version is too beaten to be of any use. Is that how the dev team wants to see the characters used?

My Doctor Doom point brings up a corollary question I've often wondered about: Are the villains supposed to be weaker than the heroes? Outside of the one star ranks, the only characters with only two powers are villains. Are we not really supposed to be using the villains? It's pretty clear we aren't meant to use Ragnarok, for example. He's available, but not really meant for use outside of Krakkadoom. He's clearly designed to only have two powers, and his match damage ensures he doesn't play well with anyone else unless he's massively buffed (like in Krakkadoom).

DD-The-Mighty

ihearthawthats wrote:

I'm in favour of the change, but a few things need to be done:
1) obw needs an alternative. Not even necessarily a new character--Moonstone, mn.Mags, Bagman, Bullseye, etc. Are potentials.
2) Spidey needs the proper balance change he deserved 6 months ago.

And seriously, where are the Hawkeye and Xforce buffs? Are they even being worked on?

answered that in the Q&A thread. Those funbalances are coming after Classic Mags get the nerf and that's not happening anytime soon. basically: Dont hold your breath.

pmorcs

Unknown

Don't forget the 4th effect: Everyone's roster will now consist of at least 10 OBW's and 10 Ares/Thors.

Instead of increasing roster diversity this change is just going to cause a lot of people to level multiple versions of their preferred characters so that they can continue to play the same teams as before without having to worry about healing at all.

Unknown

I'll just get this out of the way I have 8 3* max level characters, I don't use OBW and I sold my Spidey after he got nerfed so this change doesn't really affect me much. That said I don't like this change because I have several friends who started the game later than I did and don't have an expanded 3* roster and this makes the transition to 3* characters much harder. In my opinion, which is worthless to the devs I understand, this change would be fine if the following changes were also implemented.

1) Increase the drop rate of 3* characters from Heroic tokens slightly or moderately.
2) Eliminate the single 2* cover rewards and replace them with 1X, 2X and 3X Heroic tokens.
3) SImilarly replace the progression reward 2* covers with Heroic tokens

I have pulled 1 3* that I didn't need out of my 2 10-pack Heroics so far. Small sample I know but I hear similar stories from others.

The devs want people to use multiple characters but most people (read: probably not you) have no more than 5 3* characters they can level past 100 let alone 141. While they may have 20-30 characters only a few are worth leveling up because if they're under 100 they're usually useless.

I look back at my roster and most of my 3* characters that are max covered were earned either in Lightning rounds back when they gave specific covers (Hood, Mags, Loki, Dr. Doom) or were covered when the reward for 1st was worthless and it came down to if you could play at the end of the tourney or not to try to slot into the 2-5 place to get 3 covers. (IM40,BWGS, Punisher?) A diverse roster of level 50-80 3* characters is worthless.

I personally love the release of new characters every week but I think more needs to be done to allow people with 2* rosters to start to build a 3* roster and I think increase drop rates of 3*s in Heroic tokens would be an easy enough fix.

EDIT: Also if you want to promote roster diversity nerf C Mags already. I have a 141 CMags and while he's fun I would prefer to use some one else and often do but when I need to win quickly Patch/CMags is the goto.

ZeiramMR

Apologies if this has already been suggested:

When these changes go live, could the City environment's Hot Dog Stand be made to use "True Healing" instead of the temporary healing? It's currently a very weak power, and doing this would give a slight bump while being way too impractical for players to abuse. It does sound like the healing changes would be coming before environment power re-balancing.

Either way, as a healing effect, it should have a test case or two on your development servers when you test the upcoming change.

Unknown

I don't want to end up saying more than I should or say anything that'll start some sort of big argument. So all I'm going to say is that I don't like this change. I can understand WHY it's being done, but I still am not a fan. Though that could be because I'm still stuck in that stage of trying to transition from 2* to 3*.

wade66

Couldn't they create a new tile type, maybe white, that could activate a healing ability. It could work like the environmental tiles where when you get 25 ap in it you could true heal 10% of your health, and 50 ap would allow you to heal 25% of your health.

Cancels the need for healers in general allowing players to utilize the desired diversity, and remains useless for downed characters, so health packs are still necessary.

Katai

Well, good to know that Spider-man has been nerfed down to Bag-man levels. At least things are consistent for old peter parker.

Leugenesmiff

I've had trouble getting a decent connection to even play the game the last two days. It's good to know they're "fixing" the game in constructive ways.

Unknown

Just realized. This was a discussion, not a patch.

Unknown

This is the all time dumbest thing you clowns have done to date. Do you want to run all your player base away. Keep making stupid decisions and it is going to happen. Pretty much making pve and pvp now pay to win only. Nice job!

trey9

This seems like a really poor idea. I keep hearing that the people on this forum represent such a small portion of the playerbase and the collective feedback from us doesn't represent what everyone wants. While I completely agree with that statement, I can't help but think that there are a ton of people not registered on this forum stuck in two star land (this probably represents the average MPQ player). Obviously OBW is a staple of two star teams and when they update and see that she no longer heals, people will just up and quit. Either that, or their playing will become so sporadic due to thor/ares 5 hour heal time that they might stick with it, but when seeing a lack of progress, they will then quit after that. This just seems like a really poor idea for the devs from an average player retention point of view.

Bottom line: You can't make any money if you have no one to buy things from you.

Pwuz_

I think that it's unlikely that anyone is going to bother leveling up multiple copies of OBW, Thor, or Ares.

I'm of the opinion that it will just prevent longer play sessions. It certainly will favor those who pay to win. I hope that they raise the cap of free recharging Health Packs along with it. Or at least starts handing out free health pack more often, and not at the expense of Iso either.

Unknown

trey9 wrote:

I can't help but think that there are a ton of people not registered on this forum stuck in two star land (this probably represents the average MPQ player). Obviously OBW is a staple of two star teams and when they update and see that she no longer heals, people will just up and quit. Either that, or their playing will become so sporadic due to thor/ares 5 hour heal time that they might stick with it, but when seeing a lack of progress, they will then quit after that. This just seems like a really poor idea for the devs from an average player retention point of view.

Exactly... I am one of these players stuck in the two star land, only reader of the forum (not registered) up to yesterday. In fact, about a 6 months play for me, and still waiting for a 3 stars character to train above lvl 100. Too hard to reach *** covers (obtained by 141/141/141 players where I am playing), too many new characters, so all my money spent in new places for new characters, and never able to have enough cover for one or more *** character.

So I fully agree with the argument, player have to play more characters of their team, I am also tired of playing Ares/OBW or Thor/OBW since a couple of months, [g]but I have no choice ![/g] I will be very happy to play with Hulk, Punisher, L.Thor, L.Cap, L.Daken, but no possibility there, my strongest *** character is L.Thor I think, lvl ~70. And to be honest, I won't play with Moonstone or Bag Man !
If OBW is no longer able to make true heal = I will play 10 minutes in the morning, 10 minutes in the evening, and that's it because no other choice at the end, instead of ~2h per day (maybe 3h/day during w.e.).

So ok for this nerf of OBW, but please be more generous with *** covers, or new ** characters, or something like that.

Sorry for my poor english.

Unknown

This change pretty much breaks the game beyond repair!

Seriously, what are you guys thinking? Without proper & permanent heal, the gameplay just lacks so many options. Especially with this "high-damage-combos" and "cascades of doom" nothing will be accomplished by this mega-nerf.

I have no words how unwise this is ... no, more like it is utterly moronic!

________________________________________________________________________

--> Why would you believe anyone would buy your overpriced health-packs?

A:: Players can get full games for the same amount at Steam or other plattforms(!). The addictive MPQ ill not work forever like this. Most Gamers will just quit or play less till they do it!

________________________________________________________________________
Other F2P-Games like League of Legends or Path of Exile give the playerbase way more goodies for their money. All you developers do to squeeze out money from your fellow custormers and destroy your own game. You got into the same low-level-category like the worst game released: "Dungeon Keeper App".

If this patch goes live, I promise you that MPQ will lose tons of players, because they lost interest in playing it. It got worse since march 2014. Now it is on the brink of total selfdestruction. Tedious, grindy, partly unfair .... in short: UNREWARDING(!).

________________________________________________________________________
--> Why should players level their roster, if you screw them over a few weeks/months later?

It is one thing to be greedy. As a company a certain degree of greediness is OK. But to blatantly lie to your own customers ... more like to impose their will on them is NOT AT ALL (!). Do you think we players are Idiots? I mean, this is so obvious that it is a scandal. You have no ideas left it - so it seems to me. The community is so great in giving feedback and great ideas. Why can't you get in contact with the community and think a little about what you do?

Again, I am speechless of how incompetent you must be to not recognize this. If it is on purpose you guys are the worst businessman ever. In a few months nobody will speak of MQP anymore and the game will decline to "just another F2P / F2W-Game".

TL:DR?
Developers of MPQ and their publishers are:
+ greedy incompentent liars, that are not one bit near their customer base?!

The game was already declining in popularity because of your doubtful decisions. Now it is in free falling!
Change it before it is too late!

Unknown

I will spend hero points (bought with real money) on "permanent" things like covers. I will not spend real money just to be able to play. (Health packs)

If this is instituted as described and becomes "pay for time", I'm out. Over the past 6 months, I have spent $80. I don't think that I am the type of customer that you want to lose.

I don't think that developers are taking into account the reality that my diverse roster of level 60-100 characters are going to be facing a bunch of level 141 defensive teams. You have to change matchmaking and defense to make this work.

Unknown

The people on this forum represent such a small portion of the playerbase and feedback from us doesn't represent what everyone wants.

I'm actually quite tired of people stating this!! (Not directed at any one person, just in general).

Just because we are 7,000 of 100,000 (actual number anyone?) doesn't discount our voices. We are a HUGE sample size. There are nation wide polls that don't have as much input. If anything, I guarantee you that the pay ratio of the forum members is much higher than the game as a whole, which should slightly weigh on our side when it comes to our feedback. We are the ones that play the game and love the game so much, that outside of the enormous time we put in the game itself, we are here on the forums. Making suggestions to make it better. Helping new members with their rosters and issues they have. We make the game what it is. We are here fighting the "invisible fight with the devs" (as I heard it referred to the other day). We are the ones reporting the issues. We as a community, are better than the game will ever be, considering the direction it is going.

WE ARE A BETTER CUSTOMER SERVICE DEPARTMENT THAN THE ACTUAL CS DEPT. I would be willing to bet that we as a community have done more for the game and the players of the game than CS has.

So please stop discounting our feedback because "we are such small numbers". Small numbers mean nothing when you are talking about THOUSANDS of players who are inputting feedback.