Flo98 GIPSY_DANGER Electro. and the X-Men are Cheaters

Unknown

atomzed wrote:

Regardless of whether some Xman uses cheat, or they found a way to exploit the system, the fact of the matter is that D3 ought to take a serious look at the system.

It is a mockery that the highest progression reward is at 1300 to 1400, and we have players getting 2000 points. It is an indication that the dev never expected the scores to reach that high.

So D3 (hopefully icex) can give us a response. At least give us the reassurance that cheating is not tolerated and that investigations and actions will be taken.

Let's go back in time prior to seasons. 1 of the biggest complaints was that progression rewards were unreachable. Top scorers usually couldn't even get them. Emery even carried D3 - will quote around in his sig forever, "progression rewards are unreachable and that's not cool". So tell me, would you rather have progression rewards where np one can get them?

There's less than 10 people on the game breaking 1500 points per pvp. I would assume less than 100 reaching the 1300 progression. How are you seeing that as a big deal? Progression stops at 1300, doesn't matter if u go 1300 or 2300, you get the same progressions. I'm pretty sure the # (which is what is important, the amount of people) reaching 1300+, most likely falls into a very good range of how many people shoukd reach 1300.

atomzed

@psyko

The progression reward was ok when everyone was aiming for only 1300. Now that the "peak" is 2000 freaking points, 1300 seems puny.

Maybe it's my expectations of progression rewards, but I see the top progression reward as the level which the dev expect for the 100th percentile. It's an indication which everyone strive for, but only very very few will reach.

(Note: this is under the assumption that the scores are reached by using an exploit within the system)

Unknown

People didn't seem to find similar scores in elite events that are achieved by guys actively trying to bring each other's score down, but have a right hard time understanding that spending a similar amount of HP, spread over many players who are trying to bring each other's score up, can also achieve similar results.

Let's say you got Alice, Bob, and Charlie who are all big spenders and part of a mega alliance. What they should do is make sure everyone in the alliance queued them up before they shield, and if not immediately try to queue them up whenever they unshield. This will likely be a free 150 points for anyone who has all 3 of those guys queued up, and since you're all in the same alliance you obviously know when it's safe to attack those 3 big spenders. Note that Bob and Charlie should also queue up Alice the moment Alice unshields, and if all 3 does this they will always have 2 targets that are worth about 25 points, which is actually a lot when you get into the insanely high range. This cycle can be repeated almost indefinitely as long as people have HP to spend. This is actually essentially what happened in the elite events, only that in the elite events those 3 guys are adversarial and will obviously not tell each other to queue them up whenever they remain exposed. This scheme gets exponentially more powerful the more big spenders you have. With 4 of those guys they can simply queue the other 3 big spenders up, and remember they're working together so they'll never attack each other at the wrong time.

atomzed

Currently it's clear that this is the only way for it to work without cheats.

I personally think this is gaming the system and make a mockery of the "expected" scores the dev predicted.

Of course, if D3 thinks that the system is working as intended, then so be it. Just let us know that there is no cheating.

Unknown

atomzed wrote:

@psyko

The progression reward was ok when everyone was aiming for only 1300. Now that the "peak" is 2000 freaking points, 1300 seems puny.

Maybe it's my expectations of progression rewards, but I see the top progression reward as the level which the dev expect for the 100th percentile. It's an indication which everyone strive for, but only very very few will reach.

(Note: this is under the assumption that the scores are reached by using an exploit within the system)

At my estimate of 100 people reaching the final progression, we are well within the 100th percentile you speak of. 100/100,000 =?

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

People didn't seem to find similar scores in elite events that are achieved by guys actively trying to bring each other's score down, but have a right hard time understanding that spending a similar amount of HP, spread over many players who are trying to bring each other's score up, can also achieve similar results.

Let's say you got Alice, Bob, and Charlie who are all big spenders and part of a mega alliance. What they should do is make sure everyone in the alliance queued them up before they shield, and if not immediately try to queue them up whenever they unshield. This will likely be a free 150 points for anyone who has all 3 of those guys queued up, and since you're all in the same alliance you obviously know when it's safe to attack those 3 big spenders. Note that Bob and Charlie should also queue up Alice the moment Alice unshields, and if all 3 does this they will always have 2 targets that are worth about 25 points, which is actually a lot when you get into the insanely high range. This cycle can be repeated almost indefinitely as long as people have HP to spend. This is actually essentially what happened in the elite events, only that in the elite events those 3 guys are adversarial and will obviously not tell each other to queue them up whenever they remain exposed. This scheme gets exponentially more powerful the more big spenders you have. With 4 of those guys they can simply queue the other 3 big spenders up, and remember they're working together so they'll never attack each other at the wrong time.

Yes, we already got that. But what buggers most people is those a_bit_too_fast wins.

Like I said before - the magic trio are probably big spenders. Big spenders and abusers of some kind of a easy-win hack. Instead of 1hitKO maybe they tweak their dmg values, so that this magic combo of Daken/Sentry deals enormous dmg?

Unknown

enough is enough. this talk is no longer progressing anything. just have a bunch of people submit tickets everyday till the problem is addressed. all points have been made redundantly, and I'm actually now bored with what was a captivating discussion.

fyi....when Shields, sentry, alliances, boosts, etc. get nerfed, I'm pretty sure I know what threads the developers are going to.point to. not saying if good or bad, just saying.

p.s.s. if they make it tougher for us average players to reach progression rewards, I'll be less than amused.

now come on, we got broken mmr to.have fun with:)

Unknown

Emeryt wrote:

Yes, we already got that. But what buggers most people is those a_bit_too_fast wins.

Like I said before - the magic trio are probably big spenders. Big spenders and abusers of some kind of a easy-win hack. Instead of 1hitKO maybe they tweak their dmg values, so that this magic combo of Daken/Sentry deals enormous dmg?

But you don't need super fast wins if you keep all your retaliations within people you know. If you never attack anyone outside of your own inner circle, then you don't have any outstanding retaliations, so the only window of opportunity is whether someone else not part of your plan queued you up while you're unshielded. If your potential attackers aren't in the same PvP bracket as you, they wouldn't even know when you unshielded and even if they did catch that, they'd still have to cycle through their own list quickly enough to find the unshielded guy on time. While this also applies to the circle themselves, they obviously know when each other is unshielded and should have a much easier time finding each other.

The Daken/Sentry combo goes like this:

AP all + 3, 3 red/yellow, 3 green/black
Turn 1 - Match green
Turn 2 - World Rupture, match yellow
Turn 3 - Sacrifice
Turn 4 - Game over

While this is a somewhat idealized opening, you only need 1 green and 1 yellow match to almost certainly end the game unless the Sacrifice strike tile gets popped.

over_clocked

Reckless, enemy strike tiles don't influence friendly self-damage.

I'm still not sure how you can do Sentry/Daken matches in under a minute. What if there are no yellow matches for as long as the first 3-4 turns, despite boosting 6 yellow? The player obviously needs Sacrifice. What if there are no green/yellow matches? They just play as fast as they can anyway and suffer incurred losses? Did that ever happen?

Unknown

locked wrote:

Reckless, enemy strike tiles don't influence friendly self-damage.

I'm still not sure how you can do Sentry/Daken matches in under a minute. What if there are no yellow matches for as long as the first 3-4 turns, despite boosting 6 yellow? The player obviously needs Sacrifice. What if there are no green/yellow matches? They just play as fast as they can anyway and suffer incurred losses? Did that ever happen?

Sentry + Daken is a strong team overall and even if the initial blitz fails you still have a lot of options.

Let's say make a green match and just fire off a World Rupture without a Sacrifice (or worse yet, Sacrifice got popped the turn before World Rupture is complete). That'll still do about 3-4K damage on the enemy team even with just one Phermone Rage. With 2 Phermone Rage you'll have a good chance of wiping out any 5800 or lower characters, which at least prevents any immediate counters via AP steal (not counting Nick Fury, the highest HP character with an AP steal ability is Psylocke at 5800). At this point you could try to get 2 more red matches for a Supernova, or 2 more green matches for another World Rupture, or a yellow match for a Sacrifice and just match 3 your way to finish the last guy. This also doesn't factor in whatever offensive skills the featured character may have that can make things easier. It won't be a pretty win but it's not like you care about that when you're shield hopping. Also the opponent will see Daken and Sentry, who are very resilient characters. Even if you got a team that matches them in offense like Patch/Mag, both of these characters are 5800 HP which is within killable range with a single World Rupture + 2 Phermone Rages (and remember you don't even have to make both of the green matches).

over_clocked

I would like to see a video of such a match, just to know if it's real and possible without any actual cheats/exploits, and actually doable in 90% of matches against Hulks and LTs. Colog or some of the SHIELD maybe?

Unknown

Why would you need a video? The math works out that if Sacrifice is on the board when World Rupture fires off, the other team is dead. You'd obviously drop your Sacrifice tile 1 turn away from World Rupture, and assuming max boosted all you need is 1 green and 1 yellow match. Even if the enemy has The Hood, you just have to make the yellow match first followed by the green and he still can't stop it even if he stole a green+yellow AP every turn. Note that if Sacrifice isn't on the board then you'd need at least 2 Phermone Rage (and I think even then it's not enough) to trigger Anger on World Rupture so it's safe to use it on Hulk. Try using Sentry+Falcon+Daken on some PvE event to see how a slower version of this tactic works (you basically use Inspiration to make up for not having a maxed Sentry at the cost of more time), and I've plenty of 8K AE hits with World Rupture at level 3 (missing 4 possible CDs) and Sacrifice at level 2.

I looked up the numbers and here's what you get:

Phermone Rage - 57X2 = 114 strike
World Rupture = 148 damage to team X up to 16 times
Sacrifice = 575 strike

Note that you must have at least one Phermone Rage on the board because you need to make the green match to fire off World Rupture, so you have (114 + 148 + 575) X up to 16. Even if only 10 of the CDs fire, you did 8370 damage to their entire team. Keep in mind you also have 689 damage worth of strike tiles on the board so even if someone survived that you can just finish them with match 3s.

Even without Sacrifice you have 262 damage X up to 16, so again assuming 10 CDs fire you did 2600 damage to their team in some kind of worst case scenario. If you have 2 Phermone Rages that'd be 376 damage X # of CDs, and note that this amount isn't enough to trigger Anger. It'd still be an impressive opening Salvo to drop about 3K damage on the enemy team immediately even if you see no yellow.

over_clocked

I understand, but without having my own maxed Sentry/Daken, I wish I had first-hand experience... Is it really that simple, then? I wonder what if World Rupture gets fixed and we still see enormous scores?

Unknown

In the S.H.I.E.L.D alliance headquarters we are investigating the quick winning phenomenon using Sentry and various other team members. To their credit, the lineup is very strong however it's very expensive to maintain. Due to the damage dealt to the team it is necessary to heal using health packs. To enable quick victories it is necessary to invest in boosts.

We have found that quick wins with Sentry is achievable most of the time. No numbers are provided here however it is known to be in the nature of the game to be such, that difficult boards are often in play. A single color necessary for quick win is denied to the board, such that neither team can match the color. The AI generates massive cascades from time-to-time and manages to down a key team member. Fat fingered mistakes and accidentally using abilities out of order prove players to be human.

Quick victories were already plausible. The next issue is that the playets in question did not appear to the other players. It is well within the realm of personal experience among the top alliances that after reaching a suffuciently high rank, you are placed as a target for everyone to attack. 1100 is beyond that rank. During the course of play between 1000 and 1200, players with scores as low as 300 scored points off me.

What enabled these players to achieve high scores while avoiding the zombie horde? This is a mystery.

If this was achieved by taking advantage of a previously unknown exploit, they did a remarkable job of exposing it. Should this be the case, what should we have expected of Naz, as the leader of a collection of alliances? A better question would be asked, whether his alliance supports his actions.

Unknown

locked wrote:

I understand, but without having my own maxed Sentry/Daken, I wish I had first-hand experience... Is it really that simple, then? I wonder what if World Rupture gets fixed and we still see enormous scores?

I invested quite a chunk of money looking into it. I dont know that i would have been able to avoid the zombies. With a couple partners i might have been able to, but we would have seen other players riding on the coattails of our success, Waiting for us to unshield to queue us up to attack.

Unknown

locked wrote:

I understand, but without having my own maxed Sentry/Daken, I wish I had first-hand experience... Is it really that simple, then? I wonder what if World Rupture gets fixed and we still see enormous scores?

If all the nodes for World Rupture explode at the same time you'd see this method curtailed by a lot. Even with 1000 damage worth of strike tile, you would do (148X16)+1000 = 3368 damge to the enemy team if all the nodes fired simultaneously, which is around a Rage of the Panther range but is hardly enough to take down a top end team in one hit.

over_clocked

Well seems X-Men behave more reasonably in Webslinger, no outrageous scores (yet), I have Flo98 in my node and can see them climbing steadily with Daken/LT/loaner Spidey in alliance ranking. Wish I had taken a hit at them, but meh.

Unknown

I love all this math which I don't understand anyway. Blah blah blah match green and yellow blah blah blah one shot whole team.

Possible? Yeah, totally.

Fast? Yeah.

That fast? No.

Take into consideration:
1. 2-3 boosts animations (+3All, +3green, +3yellow)
2. Daken's 1-2 animations (depending on his health / the amount of blue on the board)
3. 2 Sentry animations
4. Let's say 10 countdown tiles animations. + possible cascades. ANYONE who ever hit Hulk with all they got but failed to kill this green MF will know how long it takes.

over_clocked

That's why I want an actual video, preferably against maxed Hulk/LT(Sentry), too! If I see it with me own eyes and the whole things takes 30 seconds or less, WELL.

Edit: I just realized something, what if there is a cheat that turns off animations altogether? *gasp* Nefarious!

Unknown

locked wrote:

That's why I want an actual video, preferably against maxed Hulk/LT(Sentry), too! If I see it with me own eyes and the whole things takes 30 seconds or less, WELL.

Edit: I just realized something, what if there is a cheat that turns off animations altogether? *gasp* Nefarious!

Its doable with my team, they key is to target high hp opponent when using intimidate. However if you keep your damage below 5 percent of hulk max it wont kill him, but wont anger him