***** Odin (All-Father) *****

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Comments

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 1,863 Chairperson of the Boards
    That verbiage is the same as Hammercap's Yellow, so I anticipate it's behavior being the same. 

    American Hero: (passive) <flavor text> Whenever the enemy team makes a match-4 or greater, Captain America jumps to the front and reduces incoming damage by 100%. Then, he creates a 5-turn countdown tile that converts 4 basic Yellow tiles in to a red or blue charged tile.

    So how this behaves is that if you cycle WCap to the front and make a Match-N, he'll just eat the damage full in the face and not create the countdown. I expect Odin to behave the same as that.

    I'm also expecting that AoE damage won't trigger it, because it doesn't trigger any of the other damage based Jump-in-Fronts like Thing or pre-nerf Bishop.
    If it works like 4cap works then Odin is...pretty bad, I think?  He doesn't do any damage and he also doesn't seem to prevent any damage.  I guess if you need a mass tile fortifier?
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 7,581 Chairperson of the Boards
    I mean ideally he reduces the damage either way, but I’m not confident at this point.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 6,662 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2021
    He reduces damage by 20% for each colour of fortified tiles, up to 120%, to a minimum of 1. If there's zero fortified tile on the board, he simply tanks damage for his team. 

    AoE will bypass his jumping in front mechanic, which is a criteria for his damage reduction mechanic. Even if there's fortified tile, he should still receive full damage as long as he doesn't jump in front.

    The role of Odin is to tank big hit to buy time for his allies. Those fortified tiles which reduce damage help him to do this more often, thus dragging the match and forcing you to target him. That's probably where Ghostpool can be a good teammate because he wants the opponent to do as much damage as possible. However, if opponent deals 10k damage and there are 5 different colours of fortified tiles on the board, does Ghostpool record it as 10k damage or 1 damage?


    I wonder who's going to tank 5* Colossus yellow match if you put him with Rogue/Thing/3* Deadpool. I think it was pretty buggy last time but I can't remember the exact details. Was it determined by whoever has the highest hp?
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 1,863 Chairperson of the Boards
    I wonder who's going to tank 5* Colossus yellow match if you put him with Rogue/Thing/3* Deadpool. I think it was pretty buggy last time but I can't remember the exact details. Was it determined by whoever has the highest hp?
    It used to be random, but it's not random anymore, and I don't think it's bugged anymore either.  I also don't think they ever told us the rule, someone had to figure it out.  I think it's the highest remaining health before the hit would land -- whoever has the most HP remaining will have their jump-in-front power fire.

    We had a lot of fun testing all the permutations of this using that one Gauntlet node that was 3x 3* Deadpool.
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 7,581 Chairperson of the Boards
    It used to be whoever had the most health took priority, but it was also bugged such that nobody would move to the front of you had multiple jump-in-fronts so I don’t know that it ever worked right.
  • TheEyeDoctorsWife
    TheEyeDoctorsWife Posts: 810 Critical Contributor
    Based on today’s Introductory fight (Hydro Man is a nice change) I still have no idea about his jumping in front nor who he would heal 
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 6,313 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2021
    Ah, that classic tale of the Edda when Heimdall did cry out to the Allfather as he did espeye afar the onrushing fury of...Hydro-Man. No wait. How does Hydro-Man make it across the Rainbow Bridge to Asgard? Did he get evaporated and then rain showered out? And they needed Odin for that? Odin fights 100 ft tall Fire Demons and giant wolves, he has no time to be fighting guys who can turn into puddles. I would probably send the fat guy from the Warriors Three, he could probably just drink Hydro-Man to wash down his 4th lunch of the day.
    Man, Odin is getting no respect here, MPQ!
  • dianetics
    dianetics Posts: 546 Critical Contributor
    edited July 2021
    Yeah he seems to be pretty much trash.

    He doesn't even synergize with himself. His abilities seem to be at conflict with each other. His red destroys AP which would go against proc'ing his yellow.

    Ideally his red would be something like: Does 4 hits to random enemies of 2000 damage increased by 1000 per fortified tile up to a maximum of 8. Destroy up to 8 fortified tiles after this ability is used. This abilities cost is paid in the color with the most fortified tiles. If there are none it is red.

    His yellow would be so much better if it was: If an enemy would deal at least xxx damage, Odin jumps to the front, reducing that damage by 10% for each color of Fortified tile on the board up to 90%. If Odin jumps in front also fortify two random basic or friendly tiles.

    Right now Heimdall is just better and seemingly like i said before they won't work together.

    Unless some DPS character comes out that utilizes fortified tiles, Odin is probably not going to see any use and Heimdall would probably be the superior choice.
  • Borstock
    Borstock Posts: 1,828 Chairperson of the Boards
    Shuri's PvP is going to be something to behold.
  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 507 Critical Contributor
    DAZ0273 said:
    Ah, that classic tale of the Edda when Heimdall did cry out to the Allfather as he did espeye afar the onrushing fury of...Hydro-Man. No wait. How does Hydro-Man make it across the Rainbow Bridge to Asgard? Did he get evaporated and then rain showered out? And they needed Odin for that? Odin fights 100 ft tall Fire Demons and giant wolves, he has no time to be fighting guys who can turn into puddles. I would probably send the fat guy from the Warriors Three, he could probably just drink Hydro-Man to wash down his 4th lunch of the day.
    Man, Odin is getting no respect here, MPQ!
    Based on the flavor text of the battle it seems that hydro man is meant to represent a frost giant in this fight.
  • Borstock
    Borstock Posts: 1,828 Chairperson of the Boards
    DAZ0273 said:
    Ah, that classic tale of the Edda when Heimdall did cry out to the Allfather as he did espeye afar the onrushing fury of...Hydro-Man. No wait. How does Hydro-Man make it across the Rainbow Bridge to Asgard? Did he get evaporated and then rain showered out? And they needed Odin for that? Odin fights 100 ft tall Fire Demons and giant wolves, he has no time to be fighting guys who can turn into puddles. I would probably send the fat guy from the Warriors Three, he could probably just drink Hydro-Man to wash down his 4th lunch of the day.
    Man, Odin is getting no respect here, MPQ!
    Based on the flavor text of the battle it seems that hydro man is meant to represent a frost giant in this fight.

    Rude of Odin to ambush him on his vacation to the Bahamas.
  • Thanos
    Thanos Posts: 722 Critical Contributor
    Ok, some quick observations.
    1. As already stated, If Odin's in back he jumps in front and eats the damage, but only the first instance. He takes full damage after. If he's already in front he eats full damage and creates fortified tiles.
    2. He doesn't prioritize special tiles when fortifying.
    3. Think his yellow is bugged against any damage boosted by Okoye's black and/or Apoc's yellow. The extra Okoye/Apoc damage doesn't trigger his yellow.
    4.His blue seems to heal any damaged ally randomly. Bugged?

    Videos to come later.

  • Tiger_Wong
    Tiger_Wong Posts: 734 Critical Contributor
    Interesting thing about his red. It’s not fortified by since you can place anywhere, you can place it on a basic tile that is fortified, thus making it fortified. And since there will be a bunch fortified tiles on the field, it’ll be easy to place. 
  • Polares
    Polares Posts: 2,641 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2021
    Mmm I am going to try it again, but I think he fortified a tile that was already fortified, so it seems it is completely random ( as in, any tile is possible including the ones already fortified :S )

    At least now we know he can heal himself I guess...

    All in all, he doesnt seem very good. Just target some other char, and when he jumps in front you will damage him and that's it, no fortified tiles, so no blue countdown tile and no damage reduction. He has a big hitpool so that might buy some time to some other char to do some damage (like Ghostpool or Apoc) but that is it. I also dont expect his yellow to do anything if the damage comes from an AoE.

    If he had some other power to create fortified tiles... 


    PS: Of course, they might release another 5 in the future that can easily generate fortified tiles and do some serious damage, but I dont think that char is Heimdall (just deny blue and that team is done).

    PS: My wait for a meta PvE char continues :(
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 1,863 Chairperson of the Boards
    I think Bishop and 4cap made them a little gunshy about jump-in-front powers, and rightfully so -- those guys were a nightmare. 

    It seems like in this case the goal was to make a jump-in-front guy who's better in the player's hands than in the AI's, and I think they did accomplish that.  The player can control who makes moves and shift it around so that Odin takes a few hits to fortify tiles, then jumps in front of vulnerable teammates later.

    The problem is that nobody wants that.  If a defensive character isn't annoying as hell *on defense*, nobody will use them.
  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 2,018 Chairperson of the Boards
    As always, the introducing to... never lets the character a chance to shine.
    He needs partners for to show his potential, there aren't.
    He needs a hit of 1900, hydro is to weak...
    Except his yellow power. Let hydro to get that . And you will realize:
    First: odin never reduces damage. It seems that only happens when saving a partner.
    And second, his blue passive in action, if AI doesn't mess the fun, each turn there are 2 or 3 healing burst, and strike tiles that when appear in a fortified tile, bring great joy.
    And there he is, a great father for all, personal bodyguard and totally supporting character. 
    Time will tell if he gets popularity. Not sure if the odds are high.
  • TheRiddler
    TheRiddler Posts: 266 Mover and Shaker
    I think Bishop and 4cap made them a little gunshy about jump-in-front powers, and rightfully so -- those guys were a nightmare. 

    It seems like in this case the goal was to make a jump-in-front guy who's better in the player's hands than in the AI's, and I think they did accomplish that.  The player can control who makes moves and shift it around so that Odin takes a few hits to fortify tiles, then jumps in front of vulnerable teammates later.

    The problem is that nobody wants that.  If a defensive character isn't annoying as hell *on defense*, nobody will use them.

    The PVP is gonna be interesting to see how big of an advantage it is to your team vs AI. And it seems like the player is gonna have a decent advantage.
  • 658_2
    658_2 Posts: 142 Tile Toppler
    I think his kit is interesting and maybe even fun, but not really seeing how you extract value out of him. You have to be able to reliably get him to the front *and* stash him in the back to get the damage negation going, so ideally Odin tanks 3-4 tiles. A 5-2 split is going to be unreliable and 7-0 will obviously not work at all. I don’t see how you play him with Heimdall in pick 2, outside of im40 pvps, if Odin tanks. 

    If your goal in the game is to hit floating boosted 5s, you leave him at 450, you don’t mind 20 minute matches, and you don’t care about getting obliterated on defense, he’ll be great for that. 
  • Thanos
    Thanos Posts: 722 Critical Contributor
    I was gonna make some videos but there's no point. Odin doesn't really do much of anything, he has almost no offense and barely any defense. If he's your last man standing, you might as well concede.