***** Odin (All-Father) *****

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  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    Remember that he just needs to jump in front once and fortifying 2 colors for to raise a 40% damage reduction, adding more pressure to miscalculations or more chances to board settings for to be in front more times and to mess up the battle a lot more.
    I don't think he needs any partner helping to fortify, he just needs one strong partner for to rely on.
  • DAZ0273
    DAZ0273 Posts: 11,315 Chairperson of the Boards
    Normally BRB's green will "miss" both invisible and airbourne characters, so Odin will get hit by the whole lot (assuming he isn't invisible too) and either jump to front or stay there. Apocalypse black however can hit invisible characters but it is random.
    I guess you could target him with Switch blue and try and reduce how much he can resist damage.
    We also want somebody who can flood the board with one colour reducing his opportunity to make fortified tiles on different colours, hit him when moved to the back but not triggering his damage threshold and if he does get to the front removing him from the board if he spends too long at the front to try and get rid of fortifications. So basically, Riri, although I am unsure how much her non target damage does to somebody not in front and whether that would trigger him. You could still punch him into space though. She is probably too squishy for 5* play but could be viable against lower level Odin's making a nuisance of themselves.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    Rereading his powers, does he only reduce damage when he *jumps* in front, or at all times when he's in front? 

    If he only reduces damage after jumping, then I guess you could just leave him in front and let him fortify tiles.  He'd produce his healing countdowns, but they don't heal very much, we're not sure how they target, and you can match them away at least.

    If his damage reduction isn't tied to the jumping then he's much more problematic to deal with.
  • wymtime
    wymtime Posts: 3,767 Chairperson of the Boards
    entrailbucket said:
    Rereading his powers, does he only reduce damage when he *jumps* in front, or at all times when he's in front? 

    If he only reduces damage after jumping, then I guess you could just leave him in front and let him fortify tiles.  He'd produce his healing countdowns, but they don't heal very much, we're not sure how they target, and you can match them away at least.

    If his damage reduction isn't tied to the jumping then he's much more problematic to deal with.
    He reduces damage if you take the required amount of damage roughly 6k.  It is then reduced by the number of fortified tiles on the board.  Example if he is in back and 6k damage is done and no fortified tiles are out Odin jumps in front and takes full damage.  If he is in front he will take the damage and put out fortified tiles.

    Basically if you can keep him in back he will jump in front take full damage and not produce any fortified tiles.
  • Kwahder
    Kwahder Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
    That’s not how I’m reading it - the word ‘then’ could imply that he still reduces damage if he’s already in front. I guess we’ll have to wait and see what happens in game. 

    (Unless some passing dev takes pity on us. Oh, @IceIX?)
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    If the damage reduction only happens when he *jumps* in front he's actually quite bad on defense. 

    An attacking player just has to choose one or the other -- target Odin first and let him fortify tiles/make his healing countdowns, or target someone else first and let Odin jump in front but take full damage.

    I guess we'll have to see how it works in game.
  • Bad
    Bad Posts: 3,146 Chairperson of the Boards
    The way I read that text, it should be at the start of the turn without any doubt when he creates the fortified. 
    Then, having same words as colossus black, making a extra move or firing a power would put him in front too and fortifying. 
    That would make him meta defensive without any doubt, if it works like that.

  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    If the damage reduction is active at all times when he's in front, that means he's basically unkillable if you save him for last, or if he's by himself.
  • Kwahder
    Kwahder Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
    Unless he doesn’t have fortified tiles in the right amount of different colours, which he definitely won’t at the start of battle.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    Kwahder said:
    Unless he doesn’t have fortified tiles in the right amount of different colours, which he definitely won’t at the start of battle.
    Except every time you hit him he makes fortified tiles (since if he's alone, he's always "in front").
  • Kwahder
    Kwahder Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
    Yes, that’s right. They won’t necessarily be in the right colours, though, and you can match them away. It just means you’ll have to beat him first or stun him, just like Wanda.
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    I hope the damage reduction only applies when he's jumping.  It's really not clear from how that power is worded.

    If that's the case, he's not very good or very annoying, and can mostly be ignored.
  • dianetics
    dianetics Posts: 1,627 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2021
    If an enemy would deal at least 1441 damage, Odin jumps to the front, reducing that damage by 10% for each color of Fortified tile on the board. 

    If Odin was already in front, he then Fortifies 2 random basic or friendly special tile(s)


    It’s pretty clear he only reduces damage when he jumps. So if he’s the last he’s just going to fortify the field until he gets downed.

    The best way to go would be with chip damage. Gunna be more long fights
  • Kwahder
    Kwahder Posts: 180 Tile Toppler
    edited July 2021
    “ If Odin was already in front, he then Fortifies 2 random basic or friendly special tile(s)“

    The ‘then’ implies he does something before this point - and the only other thing he does is reduce damage. Yes, it could be using the word ‘then’ in the sense of ‘instead’; we don’t know, hence the discussion. It certainly isn’t clear.
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,549 Chairperson of the Boards
    That verbiage is the same as Hammercap's Yellow, so I anticipate it's behavior being the same. 

    American Hero: (passive) <flavor text> Whenever the enemy team makes a match-4 or greater, Captain America jumps to the front and reduces incoming damage by 100%. Then, he creates a 5-turn countdown tile that converts 4 basic Yellow tiles in to a red or blue charged tile.

    So how this behaves is that if you cycle WCap to the front and make a Match-N, he'll just eat the damage full in the face and not create the countdown. I expect Odin to behave the same as that.

    I'm also expecting that AoE damage won't trigger it, because it doesn't trigger any of the other damage based Jump-in-Fronts like Thing or pre-nerf Bishop.
  • MoosePrime
    MoosePrime Posts: 969 Critical Contributor
    edited July 2021
    Kwahder said:
    “ If Odin was already in front, he then Fortifies 2 random basic or friendly special tile(s)“

    The ‘then’ implies he does something before this point - and the only other thing he does is reduce damage. Yes, it could be using the word ‘then’ in the sense of ‘instead’; we don’t know, hence the discussion. It certainly isn’t clear.
    It's part of an if-then statement.  IF he's already in front (that is, he did not jump to the front), THEN he fortifies tiles (with no mention of reducing damage, he won't do so in this case).
  • entrailbucket
    entrailbucket Posts: 6,841 Chairperson of the Boards
    ThaRoadWarrior said:
    That verbiage is the same as Hammercap's Yellow, so I anticipate it's behavior being the same. 

    American Hero: (passive) <flavor text> Whenever the enemy team makes a match-4 or greater, Captain America jumps to the front and reduces incoming damage by 100%. Then, he creates a 5-turn countdown tile that converts 4 basic Yellow tiles in to a red or blue charged tile.

    So how this behaves is that if you cycle WCap to the front and make a Match-N, he'll just eat the damage full in the face and not create the countdown. I expect Odin to behave the same as that.

    I'm also expecting that AoE damage won't trigger it, because it doesn't trigger any of the other damage based Jump-in-Fronts like Thing or pre-nerf Bishop.
    If it works like 4cap works then Odin is...pretty bad, I think?  He doesn't do any damage and he also doesn't seem to prevent any damage.  I guess if you need a mass tile fortifier?
  • ThaRoadWarrior
    ThaRoadWarrior Posts: 9,549 Chairperson of the Boards
    I mean ideally he reduces the damage either way, but I’m not confident at this point.
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2021
    He reduces damage by 20% for each colour of fortified tiles, up to 120%, to a minimum of 1. If there's zero fortified tile on the board, he simply tanks damage for his team. 

    AoE will bypass his jumping in front mechanic, which is a criteria for his damage reduction mechanic. Even if there's fortified tile, he should still receive full damage as long as he doesn't jump in front.

    The role of Odin is to tank big hit to buy time for his allies. Those fortified tiles which reduce damage help him to do this more often, thus dragging the match and forcing you to target him. That's probably where Ghostpool can be a good teammate because he wants the opponent to do as much damage as possible. However, if opponent deals 10k damage and there are 5 different colours of fortified tiles on the board, does Ghostpool record it as 10k damage or 1 damage?


    I wonder who's going to tank 5* Colossus yellow match if you put him with Rogue/Thing/3* Deadpool. I think it was pretty buggy last time but I can't remember the exact details. Was it determined by whoever has the highest hp?

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