@MgoBlue51 said: excuse my ignorance here... But what teams win on turn 0?
To give an example of what is required to put this sort of thing together, 5*Riri plus Iron Man with the Arc reactor support plus a villain with Proxima Midnight support can generally fire Riri's Repulor Charge AoE as soon as battle commences which will deal with low level nodes.
The same sort of thinking can produce teams that down/send away opponents of a higher level.
I wonder what will happen with the supports rework. None of the new ones generate AP. They've said they plan to redo all the existing supports before allowing them in PvP -- I wonder if they'll remove AP generation.
@entrailbucket said: I wonder what will happen with the supports rework. None of the new ones generate AP. They've said they plan to redo all the existing supports before allowing them in PvP -- I wonder if they'll remove AP generation.
Or give true healing
@DrClever said: @MgoBlue51 said: excuse my ignorance here... But what teams win on turn 0? To give an example of what is required to put this sort of thing together, 5*Riri plus Iron Man with the Arc reactor support plus a villain with Proxima Midnight support can generally fire Riri's Repulor Charge AoE as soon as battle commences which will deal with low level nodes. The same sort of thinking can produce teams that down/send away opponents of a higher level.
@DrClever said:
I always thought it weird to consider Riri a turn 0 win. I mean, yes, it is by definition, but you still have to do something. There are teams you can use where you literally do nothing and win. Maybe we should call that a turn -1 win?
@entrailbucket said: Mine is championed at lvl451 (thanks, Sabertooth!) but Apocalypse is the key to this. Omega Red is only there to prevent Apocalypse from being stunned, and for the passive, stunproof AoE that Apocalypse can boost. Unfortunately, after a brief consultation with some top PvE players, this team is not fast enough to compete. It can't ever win turn 0, and that's basically a requirement to compete now. It is still pretty good though!
@entrailbucket said: Mine is championed at lvl451 (thanks, Sabertooth!) but Apocalypse is the key to this. Omega Red is only there to prevent Apocalypse from being stunned, and for the passive, stunproof AoE that Apocalypse can boost.
Unfortunately, after a brief consultation with some top PvE players, this team is not fast enough to compete. It can't ever win turn 0, and that's basically a requirement to compete now.
It is still pretty good though!
Yes and no. I believe he could have value at the top end because of two reasons.
On open he may not be there but could have value on grind. That and wave nodes specifically.
@StanleyBurrell said: @entrailbucket said: Mine is championed at lvl451 (thanks, Sabertooth!) but Apocalypse is the key to this. Omega Red is only there to prevent Apocalypse from being stunned, and for the passive, stunproof AoE that Apocalypse can boost. Unfortunately, after a brief consultation with some top PvE players, this team is not fast enough to compete. It can't ever win turn 0, and that's basically a requirement to compete now. It is still pretty good though! Yes and no. I believe he could have value at the top end because of two reasons. Consistent damage Supports not required On open he ,at not be there but could have value on grind. That and wave nodes specifically.
@StanleyBurrell said:
On open he ,at not be there but could have value on grind. That and wave nodes specifically.
Dunno! I'll defer to anybody who knows what they're doing in high end PvE, that is not my thing at all.
I thought I'd found a really cool fast team with Thanos... talked to a couple of them and they were like "lol no."
But 4* Juggernaut, 4* Grocket, and a GotG can do that with a match and not have to worry about if you supports don't fire.
@Punisher5784 said: @Falconfreak said: Now if we can just get Hobgoblin in the game... He's coming Halloween
@Punisher5784 said:
@Falconfreak said: Now if we can just get Hobgoblin in the game...
He's coming Halloween
I sincerely hope you are correct. I've been asking for years for Hobgoblin as have so many others.
@Grizwald said: @DrClever said: @MgoBlue51 said: excuse my ignorance here... But what teams win on turn 0? To give an example of what is required to put this sort of thing together, 5*Riri plus Iron Man with the Arc reactor support plus a villain with Proxima Midnight support can generally fire Riri's Repulor Charge AoE as soon as battle commences which will deal with low level nodes. The same sort of thinking can produce teams that down/send away opponents of a higher level. But 4* Juggernaut, 4* Grocket, and a GotG can do that with a match and not have to worry about if you supports don't fire.
@Grizwald said:
Turn zero precludes having to make a match IMO
@DrClever said: @Grizwald said: @DrClever said: @MgoBlue51 said: excuse my ignorance here... But what teams win on turn 0? To give an example of what is required to put this sort of thing together, 5*Riri plus Iron Man with the Arc reactor support plus a villain with Proxima Midnight support can generally fire Riri's Repulor Charge AoE as soon as battle commences which will deal with low level nodes. The same sort of thinking can produce teams that down/send away opponents of a higher level. But 4* Juggernaut, 4* Grocket, and a GotG can do that with a match and not have to worry about if you supports don't fire. Turn zero precludes having to make a match IMO
Yes and no. Can you technically not call juggs grocket GotG a turn zero? Sure. But it is still the fastest easy node clear. You don't need to take AP with you or have any supports so no banners have to proc. Only thing that could slow you down is if you accidentally cascade, or if there isn't a juggs match but with time/practice that's not an issue.
I don’t understand the thought process behind allowing Omega Red’s passive to proc against Chasm on turn 0, while kneecapping BRB and everyone else. It’s seems like pure power creep nonsense.
@allen_koholic said: I don’t understand the thought process behind allowing Omega Red’s passive to proc against Chasm on turn 0, while kneecapping BRB and everyone else. It’s seems like pure power creep nonsense.
They should go back and apply to all characters that start matches with passives. The first turn stun cripples way too many characters. Chasm already outputs 10k+ damage before the player can move, Add in the passive disruption and it’s ludicrously overpowered
I'd rather not have them mess with order of operations stuff on the scale of 400 characters. Just nerf Chasm already, instead.
@Bowgentle said: I'd rather not have them mess with order of operations stuff on the scale of 400 characters. Just nerf Chasm already, instead.
Ha, ha, yes. Imagine the chaos they could unleash - they can't even fix a Hit Monkey team up let alone re-write the game! Delete Chasm! Give us whatever you are going to give us. Never do Chasm again!
Of course, but they know how to do it now, and there are a significant portion of characters this affects but nowhere near all. Amongst the reasons people complain about Chasm I don’t see the first turn passive disruption cited that often compared to the drain or revives, and we already know they’re nerfing his match damage. They’re also obviously trying not to nerf him to oblivion. When the nerf finally comes, is the first turn stun prominent on the radar?
@658_2 said: @Bowgentle said: I'd rather not have them mess with order of operations stuff on the scale of 400 characters. Just nerf Chasm already, instead. Of course, but they know how to do it now, and there are a significant portion of characters this affects but nowhere near all. Amongst the reasons people complain about Chasm I don’t see the first turn passive disruption cited that often compared to the drain or revives, and we already know they’re nerfing his match damage. They’re also obviously trying not to nerf him to oblivion. When the nerf finally comes, is the first turn stun prominent on the radar?
@658_2 said:
How do we know they're nerfing his match damage?! Do you have details? Share!
@entrailbucket said: @658_2 said: @Bowgentle said: I'd rather not have them mess with order of operations stuff on the scale of 400 characters. Just nerf Chasm already, instead. Of course, but they know how to do it now, and there are a significant portion of characters this affects but nowhere near all. Amongst the reasons people complain about Chasm I don’t see the first turn passive disruption cited that often compared to the drain or revives, and we already know they’re nerfing his match damage. They’re also obviously trying not to nerf him to oblivion. When the nerf finally comes, is the first turn stun prominent on the radar? How do we know they're nerfing his match damage?! Do you have details? Share!
@entrailbucket said:
I think he's going by the version of Chasm that was in game for like an hour. Less match damage, but 4 AP drain, random.
@658_2 said: They’re also obviously trying not to nerf him to oblivion. When the nerf finally comes, is the first turn stun prominent on the radar?
I hope not. That first turn stun is the reason I use him on certain teams (ie mindless ones, stop BRB/Grocket placing SAPs etc). They can nerf all his other stuff and I wouldn't care.
KGB
I'd certainly start the Chasm changes with the first turn passive suppression (and fix it in the game mechanics if possible rather than with character changes).
I haven't got a good team to defeat Chasm by spamming the board and not letting him place abyss / web tiles but that ought to be a workable strategy and stopping him blocking first turn special tiles feels like a good starting point.
I don't personally mind if they do a series of changes to (/because of) Chasm and take a while over reducing his prevalence.
Something like this and maybe increasing the number of abyss tiles required for each successive revive might be enough to stop him clogging things up too much.
@Bowgentle said: I think he's going by the version of Chasm that was in game for like an hour. Less match damage, but 4 AP drain, random.
@Bowgentle said:
Yep. I shouldn’t say we “know” they’re nerfing match damage but strong indicator.