I can’t believe it’s not a Chasm nerf thread

Bowgentle

@Codex said:
Thanks. I have seen a few Riri Jane, glad this team works. I am close to 450 Riri.

I have not seen any hit monkey, I was hoping sw and monkey would be a good counter.

Unboosted Monkey doesn't have enough health to stick around, I think.

acescracked

@Timemachinego said:

@HoundofShadow said:
How many people still finding the "perfect" counter for Chasm/iHulk?

This entire forum has gone around and around with you on this. There are many counters, none are fast or defensive so the best answer to chasm/ihulk is chasm/ihulk and it's painfully boring.

We all have shorter memories as we get older I guess.

But, I remember how dreadfully slow it was going against colossus/Wanda teams. Match & power damage reduced. Only quick way to win was an MBW tu.

acescracked

@entrailbucket said:

@MrDupaTM said:

@HoundofShadow said:
You tone down all that and he's useless.

1) No team stun = useless against start of game special tile characters. That's one of his key draws.
2) Ap drain reduced to 1 = insignificant. Gargantos' 1 ap drain is living proof. Do you feel any pinch when he drains only one ap? If players felt anything about 1 ap drain per turn, his ap drain mechanic would be nerfed.
3) Toned down revival/heal = a better OML true heal

Because he's so slow at draining ap, and players are brushing off his ap drain, his passive damage and match damage boost will be weaken due to high average ap.

With the above changes, he's not meta and will be reduced to (higher) bottom tier.

You don't need to jump through a lot of hoops, you just need to understand how his draining works step by step.

That’s ok with me. Let’s make him a bottom tier, I won’t mind.

I remember the day they finally announced the Gambit nerf. All those players who spent $10,000 or more maxing him out (or scraping together and saving their meager rewards for months) because they thought they'd win everything forever, suddenly getting the rug yanked out from under them, reminded that it's not their game, it's the developers', and they can take away your toys anytime they want.

It was... beautiful. I hope to see it again someday.

The really weird thing is chasm nowhere near the level of difficulty God Gambit was.

It's like everyone is lazy and wants every match to be as quick and brainless as a cupcake/grill.

Bowgentle

Gambit wasn't difficult, though.
Just boring.
You won 99.99% of mirror matches by waiting for enemy Gambit to fire red first.

DAZ0273

With god boost health 5* and stun immune on a few characters even the Gambit black cheaty team wouldn't be impossible to handle these days.

Maybe we need a character who only fires their powers when their AP gets drained! Like they start the battle with 6AP in that power and when it gets to 0AP they fire!

Jimsta_rooney

@Timemachinego said:

@HoundofShadow said:
How many people still finding the "perfect" counter for Chasm/iHulk?

This entire forum has gone around and around with you on this. There are many counters, none are fast or defensive so the best answer to chasm/ihulk is chasm/ihulk and it's painfully boring.

Its actually the worst answer to chasm/ihulk.
Best way is to not use your own...
But i agree it is painfully boring

entrailbucket

The best answer is the weekly boosted guys, but if it's a bad week or you don't have those guys you're screwed.

Jimsta_rooney

Its a yawnfest
The fact he has to be killed last even when hes not paired with hulk means you have to spend all the match having your ap sucked every turn.
Wheres the fun in that?
Devs never told us about his most potent power either:he sucks away the desire to play at all.
Having to beat boosted champed characters with mostly match dmg isnt fun.
I hate when ppl call for nerfs but if devs dont rectify this i think its honestly gonna be the final nail in the coffin for this game
Im out anyway ill keep a lookout for the next meta,this one just doesnt do anything for me.

Bad

I'm saying exactly the same since 2 months ago.
Just give chasm more time without being hard countered and more players (seasoned players) will quit.
And with enough more time, the 4* tier.
It won't be because I didn't warned about him!

entrailbucket

@DAZ0273 said:
With god boost health 5* and stun immune on a few characters even the Gambit black cheaty team wouldn't be impossible to handle these days.

Maybe we need a character who only fires their powers when their AP gets drained! Like they start the battle with 6AP in that power and when it gets to 0AP they fire!

Reminder -- when we talk about Gambit's reign of terror, it wasn't 0/0/5 Gambit. People built 3* Gambit at 0/0/5 and ran him with Gwen. Because of this team, 3* Gambit was nerfed almost immediately.

Absolutely nobody built a 0/0/5 5* Gambit, because 5* covers were way too rare to waste like that, and Gambit's red power was really, really good.

acescracked

@Jimsta_rooney said:
Its a yawnfest
The fact he has to be killed last even when hes not paired with hulk means you have to spend all the match having your ap sucked every turn.
Wheres the fun in that?
Devs never told us about his most potent power either:he sucks away the desire to play at all.
Having to beat boosted champed characters with mostly match dmg isnt fun.
I hate when ppl call for nerfs but if devs dont rectify this i think its honestly gonna be the final nail in the coffin for this game
Im out anyway ill keep a lookout for the next meta,this one just doesnt do anything for me.

Another death prediction of MPQ filed. I'm on 9 years now and multiple times each of the years there have been people predicting the end.

The last MPQ death prediction will be correct! Is this the one? Let's meet back here in a year and see.

edit: conditions are if no chasm nerf of course.

Rod5

Chasm is a blight on the game, but I genuinely don’t think anti-revive is the answer - the AP drain is what makes him as annoying as he is.

Half-decent 5* with passive that disables AP drain would do fine.

Bad

Time to refresh memory!
5 months ago I used to play with 24 hours left and climb to 1000 points and shield.
Right now that is totally undoable for me, playing exactly in the same way than 5 months ago.
So as it will be easy to understand, I don't need to wait a year. For me the game already is in really worse condition then ever on my 4 years of experience.

HoundofShadow

Players quit playing game for all sorts of reasons. Do players quit because of certain meta? Yes. Is it unique to MPQ? No. There's nothing special about predicting this because histories in many other games and past meta of this game have proven this has happened, and will continue to happen in the future.

I can't wait for the first major nerf from BCS and see how tides are turned against them.

Borstock

@Bowgentle said:

@Codex said:
Thanks. I have seen a few Riri Jane, glad this team works. I am close to 450 Riri.

I have not seen any hit monkey, I was hoping sw and monkey would be a good counter.

Unboosted Monkey doesn't have enough health to stick around, I think.

He does, but you have to be quick, and you need a high health partner to out-survive iHulk if the board is very green.

entrailbucket

It won't kill the game, because we don't matter. The players they care about, the players that provide almost all of the income for this game, don't have any opinion on Chasm because they never see him at all.

If everyone on this forum, on Line, on Discord or whatever all quit on the same day, they wouldn't even notice. We're the top 5%.

IrisRyu

@Borstock said:

He does, but you have to be quick, and you need a high health partner to out-survive iHulk if the board is very green.

This. Hit-Monkey is working better than I expected. I had been running HM with Colossus, but am gravitating towards Chasm in pick-2 as a counter for Chasm/iHulk. With a few boosts, Chasm’s initial stun and a favorable board, iHulk is dead after turn one.

GrimSkald

@Pantera236 said:

@GrimSkald said:

@Pantera236 said:

@GrimSkald said:

@HoundofShadow said:
You tone down all that and he's useless.

1) No team stun = useless against start of game special tile characters. That's one of his key draws.
2) Ap drain reduced to 1 = insignificant. Gargantos' 1 ap drain is living proof. Do you feel any pinch when he drains only one ap? If players felt anything about 1 ap drain per turn, his ap drain mechanic would be nerfed.
3) Toned down revival/heal = a better OML true heal

Because he's so slow at draining ap, and players are brushing off his ap drain, his passive damage and match damage boost will be weaken due to high average ap.

With the above changes, he's not meta and will be reduced to (higher) bottom tier.

You don't need to jump through a lot of hoops, you just need to understand how his draining works step by step.

You keep saying that, and yet I've played any number of games against him where I literally have never been able to fire a single power. Tell us your magical way of gaining AP against Chasm so you can fire powers, I want to hear it.

Wanda is good at getting more AP you want with her purple. Brb, especially once you get his blue out, passively gets you AP. If you don't have those characters at a high enough level Jane and Riri work great, albeit not so great on defense.

Wanda's purple is her strongest color, so any time you have Wanda in front, you lose 3 purple. This makes it much more difficult to get out, basically you need to get a bunch in a single turn. Boosting doesn't help much - those 2 AP go away the first time she matches something other than purple.

BRB is a little better, but you still need some kind of AP gain to get it out, and you'd better pray you do so before Chasm covers all the blue tiles with void or web tiles. You've also lost his first turn protects. He's still not a great choice.

Basically your only reliable choices are characters who do board shake every turn, and even they still have their own problems - Jane looses her first turn charged tiles so her speed is cut by a lot, Half-Thor exists, I guess, but only a mad person leaves them out in PVP. You can bring Chasm/iHulk yourself, but once the board fills up with web tiles you will long for death by the time the fight ends.

Or, I guess, you can bring a good TU. A poor solution.

If you take +2 all +2 r/y and +2 p/blue and put Wanda on the right apoc on the left and take loaner required (if their top color is red yellow or purple, otherwise you can take full strength) so they die on your 1st stunned turn apoc will jump up front and chasm will take black. Turn 2 (your 1st turn after being stunned) you put Wanda's purple on red, then match yellow asap. Doesn't take long before the required character is down, chasm and ihulk are low enough in health and you've got apocs repeaters out and 7 red.

For brb it's the exact same basically you are just going for that initial blue match to get his blue going and yellow to get apocs going.

These aren't theory crafting either. I've won hundreds of matches with them.

Here's the thing, though - the + 2 to all AP costs, what, 250 hero points to replenish when you're run out? I haven't let mine run out in years, I just use it on hops, so that may have changed, but that's what I recall. As solutions go, I find that to be somewhat exceptional, and not really any better than saying "use whales," though it is faster than whales I'm sure.

Zalasta

I really dislike the idea of nerfing any character that isn't totally broke, like Gambit or Bishop were. Part of the problem is that nerfs usually move a top tier character to the trash tier. There was really no excuse for nerfing Wolverine. Seems like we go through this with any new meta character. How many calls have there been to nerf Okoye, or Kitty, or Wanda/Colossus?

Much like Kitty, if Chasm is alone, he's not really that big of a threat. In a pick 3, you could probably kill him before he had 3 abyss tiles out if he wasn't boosted. It's really having a second resurrection character that makes this difficult, and in particular having iHulk as the second. iHulk is really more of the problem, much like when he's paired with Okoye (though their defense isn't nearly as good, and there is a few hard counters). Give this one time, and I suspect Chasm's day in the sun will come to an end. Maybe a character will come out with a passive power that prevents resurrection. In the meantime, I just pay the skip tax.

Pantera236

@GrimSkald said:

@Pantera236 said:

@GrimSkald said:

@Pantera236 said:

@GrimSkald said:

@HoundofShadow said:
You tone down all that and he's useless.

1) No team stun = useless against start of game special tile characters. That's one of his key draws.
2) Ap drain reduced to 1 = insignificant. Gargantos' 1 ap drain is living proof. Do you feel any pinch when he drains only one ap? If players felt anything about 1 ap drain per turn, his ap drain mechanic would be nerfed.
3) Toned down revival/heal = a better OML true heal

Because he's so slow at draining ap, and players are brushing off his ap drain, his passive damage and match damage boost will be weaken due to high average ap.

With the above changes, he's not meta and will be reduced to (higher) bottom tier.

You don't need to jump through a lot of hoops, you just need to understand how his draining works step by step.

You keep saying that, and yet I've played any number of games against him where I literally have never been able to fire a single power. Tell us your magical way of gaining AP against Chasm so you can fire powers, I want to hear it.

Wanda is good at getting more AP you want with her purple. Brb, especially once you get his blue out, passively gets you AP. If you don't have those characters at a high enough level Jane and Riri work great, albeit not so great on defense.

Wanda's purple is her strongest color, so any time you have Wanda in front, you lose 3 purple. This makes it much more difficult to get out, basically you need to get a bunch in a single turn. Boosting doesn't help much - those 2 AP go away the first time she matches something other than purple.

BRB is a little better, but you still need some kind of AP gain to get it out, and you'd better pray you do so before Chasm covers all the blue tiles with void or web tiles. You've also lost his first turn protects. He's still not a great choice.

Basically your only reliable choices are characters who do board shake every turn, and even they still have their own problems - Jane looses her first turn charged tiles so her speed is cut by a lot, Half-Thor exists, I guess, but only a mad person leaves them out in PVP. You can bring Chasm/iHulk yourself, but once the board fills up with web tiles you will long for death by the time the fight ends.

Or, I guess, you can bring a good TU. A poor solution.

If you take +2 all +2 r/y and +2 p/blue and put Wanda on the right apoc on the left and take loaner required (if their top color is red yellow or purple, otherwise you can take full strength) so they die on your 1st stunned turn apoc will jump up front and chasm will take black. Turn 2 (your 1st turn after being stunned) you put Wanda's purple on red, then match yellow asap. Doesn't take long before the required character is down, chasm and ihulk are low enough in health and you've got apocs repeaters out and 7 red.

For brb it's the exact same basically you are just going for that initial blue match to get his blue going and yellow to get apocs going.

These aren't theory crafting either. I've won hundreds of matches with them.

Here's the thing, though - the + 2 to all AP costs, what, 250 hero points to replenish when you're run out? I haven't let mine run out in years, I just use it on hops, so that may have changed, but that's what I recall. As solutions go, I find that to be somewhat exceptional, and not really any better than saying "use whales," though it is faster than whales I'm sure.

It cost 100 HP for 10, or 5 +2 uses. You can't really compare that to DP points as one is a finite resource that there is only one way to get and the other there are numerous ways to get. It's a solution that works, not anyone's fault if you are unwilling to use it.