entrailbucket said: TheRiddler said: So I guess my next question here would be that the boosted 5s don't effect your MMR? So in the Karolina PVP right now for example. My highest character even with boosts is Scarlett Witch at 453 and have another 6 champed 5s in that same range. And I'm currently sitting at 85th in SCL10. And I'm skipping through teams that have duos of boosted 5s in the 570-580 range. Am I out of opponents? There's not enough information here to determine that. SCL is completely irrelevant to this discussion, it does not affect matchmaking in any way. Your current placement is also not relevant.How many points are these fights worth? When does your PvP end? What is your current score? Are you shielded?
TheRiddler said: So I guess my next question here would be that the boosted 5s don't effect your MMR? So in the Karolina PVP right now for example. My highest character even with boosts is Scarlett Witch at 453 and have another 6 champed 5s in that same range. And I'm currently sitting at 85th in SCL10. And I'm skipping through teams that have duos of boosted 5s in the 570-580 range. Am I out of opponents?
KGB said: @entrailbucket - The reason he doesn't is because he is refraining from opening LT's. The reason he is doing that is because he is HP constrained as he finishes champing the 3* tier and moves into the 4* tier by rostering all the characters. Even if he spent a Stark, he'd only net 20 roster spots which isn't enough to roster the entire 4+5 tier (~160 characters) so he'd need to buy 8 Starks! Then he'd need to open ~300 classic legends (6000 cp) to net ~45 5* covers and hope every one of those was for a unique 5* character. That's an incredibly large ask for 3* players transitioning into the 4* tier.He wasn't having problems queuing teams prior to boosted 5*. The problem now is that no one is using dual 3* champ characters in the 160-200 range (or under covered 4* in the same range) when they can run 2 5* characters at 370 (a single cover 5* levels to 270 and boosts 100 levels) and just win via 5* match damage + huge health (for example my L255 GR is boosted to 368 right now with 30K health so no way 3* champs in the L200 range can compete with that) a lot faster/easier.The real problem is just adding +100 levels to 5* characters regardless of what level / number of covers they have. It's messing things up badly at lower tiers. They should change the 5* boost so that <L300 it's only a +25 level boost, 301-375 it's only a +50 boost, 375-450 it's only +75 boost and 450+ (ie champed) it's a +100 boost.KGB
TheRiddler said: entrailbucket said: TheRiddler said: So I guess my next question here would be that the boosted 5s don't effect your MMR? So in the Karolina PVP right now for example. My highest character even with boosts is Scarlett Witch at 453 and have another 6 champed 5s in that same range. And I'm currently sitting at 85th in SCL10. And I'm skipping through teams that have duos of boosted 5s in the 570-580 range. Am I out of opponents? There's not enough information here to determine that. SCL is completely irrelevant to this discussion, it does not affect matchmaking in any way. Your current placement is also not relevant.How many points are these fights worth? When does your PvP end? What is your current score? Are you shielded? 15-40 points. A day left. 416. Unshielded.
entrailbucket said: *The strategy being employed here is no longer ideal and nobody has bothered to reconsider it.* They're trying to encourage players to not do what he's doing. If players would have to open 20,000 CP and spend 80 starks to get a single one-cover 5*, why are all of these other low tier players running one-cover 5*? They are opening as they go, and they have a few one-cover or two-cover 5* that make them unbeatable that week.The meta has shifted 180°. You can't expect to do things the same way you did before. Open as you go, collect 5* as you go, be successful if you have the 5* that week.
KGB said: entrailbucket said: *The strategy being employed here is no longer ideal and nobody has bothered to reconsider it.* They're trying to encourage players to not do what he's doing. If players would have to open 20,000 CP and spend 80 starks to get a single one-cover 5*, why are all of these other low tier players running one-cover 5*? They are opening as they go, and they have a few one-cover or two-cover 5* that make them unbeatable that week.The meta has shifted 180°. You can't expect to do things the same way you did before. Open as you go, collect 5* as you go, be successful if you have the 5* that week. There has been no official word that this is going to continue going forward or whether it's a short term experiment followed by adjustments. Until there is official word it would be crazy to wildly adjust your strategy after 2 weeks time.I understand shifting the 5* meta with boosted characters. Makes total sense for those with 5* MMR.But what's happening now is that the 3 and 4* metas are being made totally obsolete. It's just 2* then straight to 5* and nothing in between. Since your a long time player you'll recall why OML was nerfed. It was because 2* players were drawing a single Yellow cover and riding it. The same thing is now happening in 3/4* land due to the crazy boost being given to 5* which already started at very high levels (as a late stage 4* player with mine in the 320 range all I see are dual boosted 5* or Polaris teams, virtually no dual 4* boosted at all). It should be very easy to reign in the 5* boost in a manner I suggested (fewer levels for under covered 5*) to prevent this from happening. KGB
entrailbucket said: Anyway I guess I'm confused about the problem here. You seem to be suggesting that there are players in the 3* and 4* tiers who are dominating because they have one-cover versions of all the 5*, and also that it's impossible for players at those tiers to have one-cover versions of all the 5*. Which is it? If all of these players only have a few 5* covers, then they're dominating for a week then returning to normal, which is the same boat everyone else is in.
KGB said: entrailbucket said: Anyway I guess I'm confused about the problem here. You seem to be suggesting that there are players in the 3* and 4* tiers who are dominating because they have one-cover versions of all the 5*, and also that it's impossible for players at those tiers to have one-cover versions of all the 5*. Which is it? If all of these players only have a few 5* covers, then they're dominating for a week then returning to normal, which is the same boat everyone else is in. I'm saying that the problem is that the 5* boost of 100+ levels is SO overwhelming that players in the 3/4* tier are no longer using champed 3/4 characters. Instead they are just using 1-2 cover 5* characters in PvP because it's way more efficient to do so (easier and faster to win). They don't dominate in the sense of placement obviously. Instead what happens is that all there is in the list of opponents is boosted 5* characters because that's all that's being used by other players in their same MMR. There are no more 3* vs 3* battles or 3* vs 4* or 4* vs 4*. It's just boosted 5* vs boosted 5*.And yes, you technically 'dominate' for a week when yours are boosted. BUT YOU ALWAYS FACE boosted 5* every week because there is always someone who happens to have the right boosted 5* for that week. Since as you well know, MMR does not take boost into account you just get matched against boosted 5* even though you may have no boosted characters at all. This is a real problem at 3/4 level PVP because those characters were never designed to be going head-2-head with 5*s (even ones with just 1-2 covers).As I mentioned, my L255 GR is boosted to 368. He has 31K health, does 325 avg match damage and his 1 cover Black does 4280 damage. If I compare to my L186 Deadpool he's boosted to 272 and has only 14K health and does 4K with his Red. Why would you use Deadpool? Even my max champed Deadpool is only boosted to L367 with 28K health and his Red does 7K which is comparable but match damage he only does 130 so GR will match damage him to death so even a L266 3* is barely usable against a 1 cover L255 GR.Boosted 5* are great for 5* PvP. They aren't so great for the 3* and 4* PvP where they are crowding out everything else and making it so you only ever face boosted 5* in PvP. That's bad for the 3/4* PvP gaming experience.The easiest fix is to change the 5* boost from a flat 100+ levels to instead be based on level / covers. Lets say it's based on covers. Take the boost level (113 levels for GR who goes from 255->368) and divide by 13 = ~8.7. So for every cover on your 5* you get 8.7 levels boost. So a single cover 5* gets 8.7 levels and a fully covered one gets 113 levels. Leaves 5* PvP unchanged for those with champs/near champs but restores the game play to 3/4* land where players mostly have a handful of covers for the 5*.KGB
Phumade said: KGB said: entrailbucket said: Anyway I guess I'm confused about the problem here. You seem to be suggesting that there are players in the 3* and 4* tiers who are dominating because they have one-cover versions of all the 5*, and also that it's impossible for players at those tiers to have one-cover versions of all the 5*. Which is it? If all of these players only have a few 5* covers, then they're dominating for a week then returning to normal, which is the same boat everyone else is in. I'm saying that the problem is that the 5* boost of 100+ levels is SO overwhelming that players in the 3/4* tier are no longer using champed 3/4 characters. Instead they are just using 1-2 cover 5* characters in PvP because it's way more efficient to do so (easier and faster to win). They don't dominate in the sense of placement obviously. Instead what happens is that all there is in the list of opponents is boosted 5* characters because that's all that's being used by other players in their same MMR. There are no more 3* vs 3* battles or 3* vs 4* or 4* vs 4*. It's just boosted 5* vs boosted 5*.And yes, you technically 'dominate' for a week when yours are boosted. BUT YOU ALWAYS FACE boosted 5* every week because there is always someone who happens to have the right boosted 5* for that week. Since as you well know, MMR does not take boost into account you just get matched against boosted 5* even though you may have no boosted characters at all. This is a real problem at 3/4 level PVP because those characters were never designed to be going head-2-head with 5*s (even ones with just 1-2 covers).As I mentioned, my L255 GR is boosted to 368. He has 31K health, does 325 avg match damage and his 1 cover Black does 4280 damage. If I compare to my L186 Deadpool he's boosted to 272 and has only 14K health and does 4K with his Red. Why would you use Deadpool? Even my max champed Deadpool is only boosted to L367 with 28K health and his Red does 7K which is comparable but match damage he only does 130 so GR will match damage him to death so even a L266 3* is barely usable against a 1 cover L255 GR.Boosted 5* are great for 5* PvP. They aren't so great for the 3* and 4* PvP where they are crowding out everything else and making it so you only ever face boosted 5* in PvP. That's bad for the 3/4* PvP gaming experience.The easiest fix is to change the 5* boost from a flat 100+ levels to instead be based on level / covers. Lets say it's based on covers. Take the boost level (113 levels for GR who goes from 255->368) and divide by 13 = ~8.7. So for every cover on your 5* you get 8.7 levels boost. So a single cover 5* gets 8.7 levels and a fully covered one gets 113 levels. Leaves 5* PvP unchanged for those with champs/near champs but restores the game play to 3/4* land where players mostly have a handful of covers for the 5*.KGB We really need the dev level stats on matches etc. it’s not that either is wrong in their line of thinking. But we’re at a fine grain level of discussion where actual match stats would really inform the discussion. It’s been literal years since anyone of us played at that tier and even then we had the benefit of high level alliances/coordination/theory crafting. So our 3*/4* exp would not be considered typical for anyone under Shield rank 75 ish. I personally can’t remember when the advance tier got such a big boost. It would be like FIST//Buster Jean/buster with 75 levels against a simple 3* champ(no champ levels then)it’s cool to keep up the discussion but you can’t really prove or disprove with out the actual game stats.
HoundofShadow said: None of the 5* that is supposed to be boosted is in there. I think it might be too early to say that. However, if anyone can remember what the boost level was for previous House of X Event, it might be what you said.